Pre-Game Talk: The official SENS are Elimated vs Carolina game, Sat 7PM on HNIC

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The Lewler

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Jul 2, 2013
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Cherry seems to think the Billboards were supported by the entire Fan Base, they're not. If he had known that just over 400 "fans" had contributed to the Billboards, then perhaps he would not have lambasted the entire Fan Base ........... but he's an entertainer, and based in Toronto, so I kind expect that.

One thing he did say, and it was quick, but I think he said that Melnyk phoned, and asked him about the Chara/Redden decision, that the Senators had to do back in the day.

Scare quotes ftw
 
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Back in Black

All Sports would be great if they were Hockey
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Works for me.

Then we can get a real owner in the Lebreton development.

There is zero chance the NHL leaves this market empty. Too much money to be made.

So your ok if Melnyk move the team? Do you really think the NHL would put another team here??

Zero chance ??? Too much money here??? Does this stuff just pop out of your head??????
 

Burrowsaurus

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Mar 20, 2013
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Pretty much this. Melnyk is a frustrating personality, but that's par for the course in professional sports ownership. He can be a dillhole all he wants, as long as he's honest with the fanbase, treats the Senators as a competitive professional hockey franchise given the resources needed to compete at an at-minimum league-average level, keeps his nose out of the hockey side of the business, and stops threatening the fanbase.

The purpose of the movement is to increase public awareness that the team is currently being run into the ground, for a potential and hypothetical variety of reasons, and that some fans are taking notice.
Well yeah. But this is sort of kind of turning into “lower the damn prices” (for a chunk of fan base. Which is ridiculous.
 

Burrowsaurus

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So your ok if Melnyk move the team? Do you really think the NHL would put another team here??

Zero chance ??? Too much money here??? Does this stuff just pop out of your head??????
Melnyk CANNOT say “I’m moving the team” and poof, the team is moved. That is not how it works
 
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Burrowsaurus

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the lack of effort and the body language has always been there with Hoffman. Sometimes it is better / worse than others but it is there.

And it's why I never would or will have an issue if they trade him. you do not want those attributes rubbing off on young players and I've posted that before.

I also think it will impact any potential return on trading him. Which will start another 100 page thread on PD getting fleeced
Do you really think him getting burned by mcdavid and not attempting anything will make chlapik white wolanin be like “hmm we can do that too”. No of course not. Yeah his body language hasn’t been ideal but that’s the realities of our situation.
 

Nac Mac Feegle

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Do you really think him getting burned by mcdavid and not attempting anything will make chlapik white wolanin be like “hmm we can do that too”. No of course not. Yeah his body language hasn’t been ideal but that’s the realities of our situation.

Honestly, you never know. While it isn't the norm at the highest level of pro sports, it does happen on occasion.

I've seen a lot of good workers over the years give into the temptation of laziness. It is just so damned easy to get complacent, and so hard to get the intensity back afterwards.
 

Filatov2Kovalev2Bonk

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Right. And it’s standard across all sports..... and all entertainment.

Only season ticket holders go 40 times a year. Some people don’t even go once a year. Or twice or three times. That’s probably the average. So yeah. Average movies a year and average games a year. Aboooout the same I’m guessing

Nah. We got to the movies several times a month. Big, big difference? FREE PARKING. If I had to pay $30-$50 to get parking at the movies I'd just stream them. Big difference also is that movies are reviewed before seeing; obviously this is impossible for sports (live), but a better product on the ice means more incentive to attend. Also, you get discounts/copies of the movies when they come out on Blu-Ray now, for those to whom it matters. I get...nothing as a perk for being a season's ticket holder? I mean, I used to get stuff but now it's a draw for stuff or whatever.


People need to accept that Ottawa doesn’t sell out because it’s cheap. We can build a winner and people still won’t go because then guess what? Tickets would be more expensive. I was born here. Grew up here. Love this city. But as a whole the people are penny pinchers in this town. It’s a big city with small town mentality. Could be the fact that it’s a government town and that culture kind of promotes tight wallets, for what reason I’m not sure but whatever.

We don’t want a “nicer” owner. We want an owner with more money. And that’s fair and I will back MelnykOut with that thought in mind. People are kidding themselves with some things now though

We are cheap (at least me and my circle are) but that doesn't mean we won't spend if it's warranted. We had season's right through the start of the Murray era. We dropped when he became GM because we knew there would be no accountability from media or management and it would be mediocre. We got a package this year, which we aren't renewing since Dorion says the focus is to make the playoffs next year, which means it's more patching and short-term fixes instead of going the hard route.

But if Dorion does a real rebuild and brings in tons of youth an a good vet or two (not Burrows...) we will spend again, most likely.
 

Filatov2Kovalev2Bonk

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So your ok if Melnyk move the team? Do you really think the NHL would put another team here??

Zero chance ??? Too much money here??? Does this stuff just pop out of your head??????

Teams don't just move. There has to be a vote by the Board of Governors and they would for sure find a buyer financer to keep it here. Melnyk is a hothead full of hot air and is bluffing because that's what he does. See the Sens live or do not, but they will be here for the foreseeable future.
 
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Burrowsaurus

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Honestly, you never know. While it isn't the norm at the highest level of pro sports, it does happen on occasion.

I've seen a lot of good workers over the years give into the temptation of laziness. It is just so damned easy to get complacent, and so hard to get the intensity back afterwards.
But where did you see this. Not in an environment as competitive as this I’m sure
 

Burrowsaurus

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Nah. We got to the movies several times a month. Big, big difference? FREE PARKING. If I had to pay $30-$50 to get parking at the movies I'd just stream them. Big difference also is that movies are reviewed before seeing; obviously this is impossible for sports (live), but a better product on the ice means more incentive to attend. Also, you get discounts/copies of the movies when they come out on Blu-Ray now, for those to whom it matters. I get...nothing as a perk for being a season's ticket holder? I mean, I used to get stuff but now it's a draw for stuff or whatever.




We are cheap (at least me and my circle are) but that doesn't mean we won't spend if it's warranted. We had season's right through the start of the Murray era. We dropped when he became GM because we knew there would be no accountability from media or management and it would be mediocre. We got a package this year, which we aren't renewing since Dorion says the focus is to make the playoffs next year, which means it's more patching and short-term fixes instead of going the hard route.

But if Dorion does a real rebuild and brings in tons of youth an a good vet or two (not Burrows...) we will spend again, most likely.
At several movies a month you are the outlier.

You may be cheap. But some people (most) are so cheap they can’t even identify when it’s warranted to spend. Tickets are dirt cheap right now. People don’t go blame it on melnyk. If we’re elite ticket prices go up. People don’t go... guess who gets the blame.
 

Sensung

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So your ok if Melnyk move the team? Do you really think the NHL would put another team here??

Zero chance ??? Too much money here??? Does this stuff just pop out of your head??????
I'd be fine with Melnyk moving the team if he is not willing to sell. (He wouldn't be allowed to, but I'll let you figure that one out on your own)

I know the NHL would put another team in this mid sized market with solid revenue streams. Lebreton is coming and will have an NHL team; with or without Melnyk.
 

Jorge Garcia

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and yet our ticket prices are the lowest in the country

if the average fan won't pay that AND
the average income in ottawa is higher than in other canadian cities THEN how is this a strong market?
You must know that some of those fans haven't been able to depend on getting paid for a couple of years. Also, that the main employer in town not only won't buy tickets as incentives, gifts or promotions, but also won't allow its employees to accept any hospitality from the few companies that do buy tickets. Senators tickets are sold to fans who pay out of their own after-tax income. Other markets have huge sales of tax-deductable tickets to corporate buyers, and seats filled with clients, employees and business associates who get in as corporate guests.
Ottawa is a market with challenges, but it's not full of highly paid cheapskates, just regular folks with families to feed and bills to pay.
 

Burrowsaurus

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You must know that some of those fans haven't been able to depend on getting paid for a couple of years. Also, that the main employer in town not only won't buy tickets as incentives, gifts or promotions, but also won't allow its employees to accept any hospitality from the few companies that do buy tickets. Senators tickets are sold to fans who pay out of their own after-tax income. Other markets have huge sales of tax-deductable tickets to corporate buyers, and seats filled with clients, employees and business associates who get in as corporate guests.
Ottawa is a market with challenges, but it's not full of highly paid cheapskates, just regular folks with families to feed and bills to pay.
That’s a fair point if I understand correctly. Also Our biggest “corporation” here is the government. And they can’t necessarily be buying boxes and tickets or else the general public would be like “whoa look at the government they must have lots of money !!! This ain’t fair !?!?” So the government itself affects ticket sales PLUS non government workers attitude towards the public sector hinders it as well. I mean there’s a reason why the government is the one place you work where you don’t get an employee discount on parking in the buildings. “Another break for lazy government workers”. So yeah. Factors in. But people here ARE cheap. I’ve been around small and medium businesses for most of my life and there is a signniiiiiiiiiiificant difference in willingness to spend from public vs private sector employees.

I mean just walk through the sens store after a game lmao. The oo-ing and ah-ing is hilarious.
 
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Tnuoc Alucard

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coladin

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The average fan isn't going to pay $150 for tickets and then $70-90 on top of that for 10-20 games a season. Eugene wants to know why fan interest is down, it's a lot of little things that add up.

But it is like that in every arena????

Not sure what you are expecting..,Burrowsaurus summed it up quite nicely
 

coladin

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Sep 18, 2009
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That’s a fair point if I understand correctly. Also Our biggest “corporation” here is the government. And they can’t necessarily be buying boxes and tickets or else the general public would be like “whoa look at the government they must have lots of money !!! This ain’t fair !?!?” So the government itself affects ticket sales PLUS non government workers attitude towards the public sector hinders it as well. I mean there’s a reason why the government is the one place you work where you don’t get an employee discount on parking in the buildings. “Another break for lazy government workers”. So yeah. Factors in. But people here ARE cheap. I’ve been around small and medium businesses for most of my life and there is a signniiiiiiiiiiificant difference in willingness to spend from public vs private sector employees.

I mean just walk through the sens store after a game lmao. The oo-ing and ah-ing is hilarious.

The other game walking by a box I saw it was Nav Canada posted on the door as the suiteholder. suiteholder

:huh:
 

JD1

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Sep 12, 2005
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You must know that some of those fans haven't been able to depend on getting paid for a couple of years. Also, that the main employer in town not only won't buy tickets as incentives, gifts or promotions, but also won't allow its employees to accept any hospitality from the few companies that do buy tickets. Senators tickets are sold to fans who pay out of their own after-tax income. Other markets have huge sales of tax-deductable tickets to corporate buyers, and seats filled with clients, employees and business associates who get in as corporate guests.
Ottawa is a market with challenges, but it's not full of highly paid cheapskates, just regular folks with families to feed and bills to pay.

Yes I am aware of the phoenix situation. Everyone is. It is a real problem for some people. It's also pretty overblown on this site but that's a different issue. I'm aware of the employer thing too. I used to go to the games in a box for years, then the feds brought in that policy and that was the end of the box. That really sucked, I liked sitting in the box to watch games. And I am fully aware of the Joe Fan buying a ticket thing. You can go back and look in the main board playoff threads from last year where I very clearly made that case.

Here's some Stats Can data on media family income circa 2015
Calgary - 104,410
Ottawa - 104,070
Edmonton - 101,870
Winnipeg - 81,880
Vancouver - 79,930
Toronto - 78,280
Montreal - 76,950

That is for all family types. For couple family types, the Ottawa number jumps to 113,610 which is the highest in the country.

Data comes from here Median total income, by family type, by census metropolitan area (Couple families)

I'm a regular folk with bills to pay, family to feed, kids to educate. I get it. I don't go as often as I used to. Keep thinking i am going to return to buying packages, haven't got off my ass to do that yet.

There are two sides to this market. There is more disposable income in this market than any city in Canada yet we struggle to fill the place at lower prices than any other market. This is what concerns me about the situation we are in. Investors and the league will look at the market size, the income levels, the disposable income levels, gate receipts and conclude it is a crappy market. I think part of it is being stuck between Montreal and Toronto and another large part of it is the location.
 

Karl Prime

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Feb 13, 2017
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But it is like that in every arena????

Not sure what you are expecting..,Burrowsaurus summed it up quite nicely

I didn't say for one game, I said for 10-20. And that's more the case now than years ago because of the phoenix pay debacle. If the arena was in the city, then a lot of people would bus (and in a few months rail) to the game and far fewer people would be paying for parking. And all that is leaving out the crux of it all, as Jorge Garcia said, that the government can't buy and give out tickets. If they could, every game in the playoffs last year would have been sold out no problem.
 

Karl Prime

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Feb 13, 2017
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Yes I am aware of the phoenix situation. Everyone is. It is a real problem for some people. It's also pretty overblown on this site but that's a different issue. I'm aware of the employer thing too. I used to go to the games in a box for years, then the feds brought in that policy and that was the end of the box. That really sucked, I liked sitting in the box to watch games. And I am fully aware of the Joe Fan buying a ticket thing. You can go back and look in the main board playoff threads from last year where I very clearly made that case.

Here's some Stats Can data on media family income circa 2015
Calgary - 104,410
Ottawa - 104,070
Edmonton - 101,870
Winnipeg - 81,880
Vancouver - 79,930
Toronto - 78,280
Montreal - 76,950

That is for all family types. For couple family types, the Ottawa number jumps to 113,610 which is the highest in the country.

Data comes from here Median total income, by family type, by census metropolitan area (Couple families)

I'm a regular folk with bills to pay, family to feed, kids to educate. I get it. I don't go as often as I used to. Keep thinking i am going to return to buying packages, haven't got off my ass to do that yet.

There are two sides to this market. There is more disposable income in this market than any city in Canada yet we struggle to fill the place at lower prices than any other market. This is what concerns me about the situation we are in. Investors and the league will look at the market size, the income levels, the disposable income levels, gate receipts and conclude it is a crappy market. I think part of it is being stuck between Montreal and Toronto and another large part of it is the location.

How many people living in Ottawa are Leafs and Habs fans? They aren't going to Sens games unless it's against their team. And with Habs fans, they'll just drive to Montreal and go to games there.
 

coladin

Registered User
Sep 18, 2009
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I didn't say for one game, I said for 10-20. And that's more the case now than years ago because of the phoenix pay debacle. If the arena was in the city, then a lot of people would bus (and in a few months rail) to the game and far fewer people would be paying for parking. And all that is leaving out the crux of it all, as Jorge Garcia said, that the government can't buy and give out tickets. If they could, every game in the playoffs last year would have been sold out no problem.

I have a half season and I rarely eat there. Usually a coffee or a drink or two. Nav Canada had a box at the Oiler game, so they can buy but maybe as a reward, not for potential clients.
 

L'Aveuglette

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Jan 8, 2007
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Montreal
As always, you can count on the few loud posters on this board to turn everything against the fans.

Doesn't matter that we used to have one of the best attendance records in the league until the last few years. Nope. It must be that we all just collectively decided to be cheap, bad fans. Has nothing to do with the product on the ice or the man behind all of it. Nope nope nope. BAD FANS!
 
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