The Nylander Chronicles Part XXI - Legal Drinking Age in the US Version

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Auston Powers

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May 16, 2016
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wow so front loading helps the cap hit? thats interesting. What's the upper limit in terms of front loading the contract to the max to help cap following years?

EDIT -- Didn't see your 6.5Mx6 and I did it above based on 7Mx6. Sorry about that. Below is updated results.

Based on 6.5M over 6 years:
$39,000,000 total cap hit
2018-2019 - $6,500,000
2019-2020 - $6,500,000
2020-2021 - $6,500,000
2021-2022 - $6,500,000
2022-2023 - $6,500,000
2023-2024 - $6,500,000
(today) Cap Hit (2019-2020 to 2024-2025) = ($6,500,000 * 160/180 + $32,500,000) / 6 = 6,379,629
(today) Cap hit (2018-19) = $6,379,629 * 180 / 160 = $7,177,083
Total earnings = $39,075,228
2018-2019 cap hit – $7,177,083
2019-2025 cap hit – $6,379,629 - 120K savings per year for 5 years


and if we front load it and he signed today...
$39,000,000 total cap hit
2018-2019 - $10,600,000
2019-2020 - $7,200,000
2020-2021 - $5,400,000
2021-2022 - $5,400,000
2022-2023 - $5,200,000
2023-2024 - $5,200,000
Cap Hit (2019-2020 to 2024-2025) = ($10,600,000 * 160/180 + $28,400,000) / 6 = 6,303,703
Cap hit (2018-19) = $6,303,703 * 180 / 160 = $7,091,666
Total earnings = $38,610,181
2018-2019 cap hit – $7,091,666
2019-2025 cap hit – $6,303,703 - 196K savings per year for 5 years[/QUOTE]
 

MyBudJT

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Mar 5, 2018
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EDIT -- Didn't see your 6.5Mx6 and I did it above based on 7Mx6. Sorry about that. Below is updated results.

Based on 6.5M over 6 years:
$39,000,000 total cap hit
2018-2019 - $6,500,000
2019-2020 - $6,500,000
2020-2021 - $6,500,000
2021-2022 - $6,500,000
2022-2023 - $6,500,000
2023-2024 - $6,500,000
(today) Cap Hit (2019-2020 to 2024-2025) = ($6,500,000 * 160/180 + $32,500,000) / 6 = 6,379,629
(today) Cap hit (2018-19) = $6,379,629 * 180 / 160 = $7,177,083
Total earnings = $39,075,228
2018-2019 cap hit – $7,177,083
2019-2025 cap hit – $6,379,629 - 120K savings per year for 5 years


and if we front load it and he signed today...
$39,000,000 total cap hit
2018-2019 - $10,600,000
2019-2020 - $7,200,000
2020-2021 - $5,400,000
2021-2022 - $5,400,000
2022-2023 - $5,200,000
2023-2024 - $5,200,000
Cap Hit (2019-2020 to 2024-2025) = ($10,600,000 * 160/180 + $28,400,000) / 6 = 6,303,703
Cap hit (2018-19) = $6,303,703 * 180 / 160 = $7,091,666
Total earnings = $38,610,181
2018-2019 cap hit – $7,091,666
2019-2025 cap hit – $6,303,703 - 196K savings per year for 5 years
[/QUOTE]

I don't think cap hits work that way... Does it?
 

PromisedLand

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It isn't front loading. Because he is sitting out it changes the cap structure where there is a higher hit the 1st year and a lower hit for the duration of the deal. I believe something similar happened with Trouba and Lindholm.

not sure looking at capfriendly's FAQ

NHL CBA FAQ - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

looks like the calculation is:

If a RFA signs after the season starts, how is their cap hit calculated?

When a restricted free agent signs a contract after the NHL season has already begun, their cap hit for the first year is greater than the contracts annual average, and similarly the cap hit of the remaining years is less than that of the annual average.

A notable aspect of the following calculation is that the sum of the cap hit values is greater than if the contract was signed before season start (and used the normal AAV calculation; monetary value of the contract divided by the total years)

The cap hit of the years after the first year of the contract is calculated first:
Equation (A) Cap hit after the first year = (First year salary * season days remaining / total season days + contract value remaining) / contract years

The first years cap hit is then calculated:
Equation (B) First years cap hit = cap hit after the first year * total season days / season days remaining

So based on the above: Given Equation (A). It is first year's salary not the "cap hit" when RFAs signs after the season starts. If if the Leafs can max out the first year to the limit (don't know what that is) leafs can potentially lower the cap hit significantly in the following years. Especially if the Leafs wait till Dec. 1st lol

Basically, if leafs were allowed to max the first year at 20 million then (42 million contract 7 years)

Dec 1st calculation:
20M*127/186+22M/6yrs = 5.9M cap hit for 2019-2020 to 2025-2026

Cap Hit this season (2018-2019) = 5.9M*186/127 = 8.7M

If we can front load the first year to the max it will help

time for MLSE to flex that financial MUSCLE

:yo:
 

BertCorbeau

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EDIT -- Didn't see your 6.5Mx6 and I did it above based on 7Mx6. Sorry about that. Below is updated results.

Based on 6.5M over 6 years:
$39,000,000 total cap hit
2018-2019 - $6,500,000
2019-2020 - $6,500,000
2020-2021 - $6,500,000
2021-2022 - $6,500,000
2022-2023 - $6,500,000
2023-2024 - $6,500,000
(today) Cap Hit (2019-2020 to 2024-2025) = ($6,500,000 * 160/180 + $32,500,000) / 6 = 6,379,629
(today) Cap hit (2018-19) = $6,379,629 * 180 / 160 = $7,177,083
Total earnings = $39,075,228
2018-2019 cap hit – $7,177,083
2019-2025 cap hit – $6,379,629 - 120K savings per year for 5 years


and if we front load it and he signed today...
$39,000,000 total cap hit
2018-2019 - $10,600,000
2019-2020 - $7,200,000
2020-2021 - $5,400,000
2021-2022 - $5,400,000
2022-2023 - $5,200,000
2023-2024 - $5,200,000
Cap Hit (2019-2020 to 2024-2025) = ($10,600,000 * 160/180 + $28,400,000) / 6 = 6,303,703
Cap hit (2018-19) = $6,303,703 * 180 / 160 = $7,091,666
Total earnings = $38,610,181
2018-2019 cap hit – $7,091,666
2019-2025 cap hit – $6,303,703 - 196K savings per year for 5 years
[/QUOTE]

Neat, thanks for doing the math.
 

LeafsHome

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Oct 17, 2018
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Toronto
That would actually really hurt us as next year is our biggest cap crunch season.

In fact, it’s leverage that both Marner and Matthews will have over Dubas.
Hopefully old man Marleau will retire after he receives his $3mil signing bonus in July. If he does that the leafs can then trade him(with his consent) to a team looking to take a cap hit(6.25) while only having to pay him 1.25
 

Auston Powers

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May 16, 2016
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Toronto
wow so front loading helps the cap hit? thats interesting. What's the upper limit in terms of front loading the contract to the max to help cap following years?
Also, because of the contract not being signed until after start of season and before dec. 1st

So you want to sign an SPC
If an SPC is in the front-loaded category, there are essentially two variability rules: no more than 35% year-to-year, and no more than 50% ever. For the first one: let's say you're making $4.0M in the first year of your deal. In the second year, your salary can't go past either 35% more--$5.4M—or 35% less---$2.6M. (Even NHL teams sometimes miss this. The league recently rejected the first version of Mikkel Boedker's SPC for breaking this rule.) For the second one: the stated player salary and bonuses in the lowest year can't be less than 50% of that in the highest. If at the peak of the deal, you're making $6.0M, you can't be making less than $3.0M in the lowest year.

Basically you can't change up or down by no more than 35% per year and your lowest year has to at least be 50% of your highest year.

Which is why I had to do weird numbers for the last example based on 6.5M x 6:
if we front load it and he signed today...
$39,000,000 total cap hit
2018-2019 - $10,600,000
2019-2020 - $7,200,000
2020-2021 - $5,400,000
2021-2022 - $5,400,000
2022-2023 - $5,200,000
2023-2024 - $5,200,000
Cap Hit (2019-2020 to 2024-2025) = ($10,600,000 * 160/180 + $28,400,000) / 6 = 6,303,703
Cap hit (2018-19) = $6,303,703 * 180 / 160 = $7,091,666
Total earnings = $38,610,181
2018-2019 cap hit – $7,091,666
2019-2025 cap hit – $6,303,703 - 196K savings per year for 5 years
 
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OppositeLocK

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So you have the top UFA coming to TOR and sacrificing money to be part of a winning team. That sets a prime example for everyone else.

It's not like the Leafs are lowballing him, so I think it's just selfish greed at this point.

Is this a heart and soul team player you go to war with and sacrifice together to win?

For some reason Nylander just doesn't strike me as a guy who'd be diving in front of a slap shot to protect a G7 lead in the SCF.
 
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PromisedLand

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Also, because of the contract not being signed until after start of season and before dec. 1st

So you want to sign an SPC
If an SPC is in the front-loaded category, there are essentially two variability rules: no more than 35% year-to-year, and no more than 50% ever. For the first one: let's say you're making $4.0M in the first year of your deal. In the second year, your salary can't go past either 35% more--$5.4M—or 35% less---$2.6M. (Even NHL teams sometimes miss this. The league recently rejected the first version of Mikkel Boedker's SPC for breaking this rule.) For the second one: the stated player salary and bonuses in the lowest year can't be less than 50% of that in the highest. If at the peak of the deal, you're making $6.0M, you can't be making less than $3.0M in the lowest year.

Basically you can't change up or down by no more than 35% per year and your lowest year has to at least be 50% of your highest year.

Which is why I had to do weird numbers for the last example based on 6.5M x 6:

DAMN IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I knew there was a catch :laugh:

I really had my hopes up lol

so if we front load it 10M for the first year; then his last year has to equal at least 50% of that i.e. at least 5 million and then that stupid 35% rule also has to factor in. Man who the hell came up with this stuff? lol

May be such structure should be even more strict for teams that have no state income taxes. Leafs cannot really use their financial might to the fullest with these stupid rules.......
 

StevenB

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So you have the top UFA coming to TOR and sacrificing money to be part of a winning team. That sets a prime example for everyone else.

Then you have Nylander trying to extract as much money as possible. It's not like the Leafs are lowballing him, so it's just selfish greed at this point. Perhaps Nylander sucks so he wants as much money as possible now because nobody may give him more in the future? Wants to cash in from being attached to Matthews's hip, perhaps?

Is this a heart and soul team player you go to war with and sacrifice together to win?

For some reason Nylander just doesn't strike me as a guy who'd be diving in front of a slap shot to protect a G7 lead in the SCF.
How do you know the team isn’t lowballing him?
 
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Auston Powers

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Personally I hope they front load it. I have a feeling this is a loop hole and will be rectified in the next CBA. But for now with our BIG 3. Why not?!! We have been at the bottom for years. We still deserve what?? Another 7 years of good luck at least.
 
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OppositeLocK

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How do you know the team isn’t lowballing him?

Because they take care of their players. It's clear that TOR invested a lot in managing its players' all around beyond just salary.

I'm sure they're offering him more than 10% over ELC.

This is a bad example for everyone else and if the Leafs give in, more will join in.
 

Nineteen67

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Friedman on Prime Time Sports:

- Said Kypreos isn't wrong that a 6 year deal is on the table.
- People aren't talking much about the situation. Both sides are trying to keep it as lowkey as possible.
- Meetings have been optimistic and both sides want to get something done
- Said he's also heard 6 years around 6.5-7M as Kyper, but doesn't know how much of an actual possibility it is
- Prior to the meeting in Switzerland, Leafs were offering 4 years, worth 19-20M.
- Both sides want to do 6 years, but not sure if the Leafs will go up to 7M
- Believes Toronto has offered 7 year deals as well.
- Said Nylander's camp wants to sign a long-term deal under the current CBA, rather than risking a short term deal and having to sign under whatever the next CBA is.
- Friedman said if he were Nylander he'd take a 2-3 year deal, and bet on himself, but an agent told him yesterday that no one knows what contracts will look like in the next CBA, so players want to sign long-term now.
- Said he believes if the deal is a 4 year deal, the caphit will be around 5M which will be the deal the Leafs have had on the table for a couple weeks


So, based on what he said, it's possible the Leafs/Nylander have a 4 year deal they are willing to do, but are still trying to get a 6 year deal done.

Said Nylander's camp wants to sign a long-term deal under the current CBA, rather than risking a short term deal and having to sign under whatever the next CBA is

This is interesting, in that, I wouldn’t think the owners would want to change the current CBA, so if it gets opened, I would think it would be by the NHLPA. Surely they wouldn’t open this one and come away with a worse deal. Or could they?
 

Throw More Waffles

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Hopefully old man Marleau will retire after he receives his $3mil signing bonus in July. If he does that the leafs can then trade him(with his consent) to a team looking to take a cap hit(6.25) while only having to pay him 1.25
Why didn't the leafs just sign Marleau to 2 years at 16.5 million? We would have the cap space for those two years, Marleau would make the same amount of money, and he'd be off the books on our cap crunch year.
 

Auston Powers

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MyBudJT

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Also, because of the contract not being signed until after start of season and before dec. 1st

So you want to sign an SPC
If an SPC is in the front-loaded category, there are essentially two variability rules: no more than 35% year-to-year, and no more than 50% ever. For the first one: let's say you're making $4.0M in the first year of your deal. In the second year, your salary can't go past either 35% more--$5.4M—or 35% less---$2.6M. (Even NHL teams sometimes miss this. The league recently rejected the first version of Mikkel Boedker's SPC for breaking this rule.) For the second one: the stated player salary and bonuses in the lowest year can't be less than 50% of that in the highest. If at the peak of the deal, you're making $6.0M, you can't be making less than $3.0M in the lowest year.

Basically you can't change up or down by no more than 35% per year and your lowest year has to at least be 50% of your highest year.

Which is why I had to do weird numbers for the last example based on 6.5M x 6:

Interesting, thanks for the Lesson...

So the Leafs COULD do:

11
8.15
6.05
4.5
3.8
5.5
 

Kiwi

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Said Nylander's camp wants to sign a long-term deal under the current CBA, rather than risking a short term deal and having to sign under whatever the next CBA is

This is interesting, in that, I wouldn’t think the owners would want to change the current CBA, so if it gets opened, I would think it would be by the NHLPA. Surely they wouldn’t open this one and come away with a worse deal. Or could they?

There has been rumours of teams wanting to bring contract length down from 8 to 5 years like the NBA, i think the owners would fight over that one if they could
 
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Menzinger

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I don't see him scoring 37-40 goals on a regular basis though...

well, he’s more of a playmaker so he’ll always have more assists.

But points wise they could be we’ll be in the same tier during their prime years. Especially when you adjust for p/60
 

PromisedLand

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So basically based on the 6.5 x 6 (using your calculations)

Auston Powers said:
if we front load it and he signed today...
$39,000,000 total cap hit
2018-2019 - $10,600,000
2019-2020 - $7,200,000
2020-2021 - $5,400,000
2021-2022 - $5,400,000
2022-2023 - $5,200,000
2023-2024 - $5,200,000
Cap Hit (2019-2020 to 2024-2025) = ($10,600,000 * 160/180 + $28,400,000) / 6 = 6,303,703
Cap hit (2018-19) = $6,303,703 * 180 / 160 = $7,091,666
Total earnings = $38,610,181
2018-2019 cap hit – $7,091,666
2019-2025 cap hit – $6,303,703 - 196K savings per year for 5 years

10.6 is the max that we can do given the restrictions. approx 200K in savings is pretty good IMO; if we can get that from 4 more guys somehow; that would be about a million dollars saving from cap hit.

Given the cap crunch coming up next year; I assume they will not want Marner and Matthews to hold out as their first year cap hits would completely kill Leafs cap.

man things are getting mighty tight :laugh:
 
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