The NHL has a BIG problem ( Cap Circumvention via LTIR)

Discussion in 'National Hockey League Talk' started by Leaves34, Apr 10, 2021.

  1. edog37 Registered User

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    outside of this message board, no one cares.
     
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  2. Leaves34 Registered User

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    With Dougie Hamilton’s comments today, how are we feeling about this?
     
  3. Lunatik Normal is an illusion.

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    It makes prefect sense, they want it to be calculated daily and you can't do that and include the playoffs because every team will have a different length to their season.
     
  4. Lunatik Normal is an illusion.

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    It's not a big deal and some are blowing it out of proportion. Like one team every 5 years ends up doing this because injuries line up in such a way, it's not a problem,
     
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  5. Saucechucker99 Registered User

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    Cap should remain in effect for playoffs, or there should be a limit for how much you can go over. 17 mil over for Tampa is a joke.

    I am not trying to say Kuch wasn’t injured and required extended time off for his surgery. But it is pretty naive to think the timing of it all was not by design.
     
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  6. Crazy8oooo Puck Off!

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    Easy fix...upon the start of the playoffs, each team submits their cap compliant lineup. If the injured player is good to go, he's included on the playoff roster, but counts against the cap. That would help prevent teams from loading up and playing at an advantage throughout the playoffs.
     
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  7. Lunatik Normal is an illusion.

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    That 17 million is extremely misleading, they currently have a 34 man roster and only 19 of those players played against Carolina and 20 total. The number is closer to 8.5m
     
  8. Lunatik Normal is an illusion.

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    How is that an easy fix? You have to completely revamp the way the cap is calculated which requires changing the CBA
     
  9. Crazy8oooo Puck Off!

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    Why does it need to be revamped? They'd just carry the cap that was in effect until the end of the season, into the playoffs. If an injured player who makes $5 million returns, then you must remove $5 million in order to add him. Just like when they return during the season, you must remove player(s) to activate someone.
     
  10. Saucechucker99 Registered User

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    Fair enough. I just read the article with Hamilton’s comments and it said that they were 17.3 over and assumed it was accurate.

    I’m just a jealous stars fan still living in 2020.
     
  11. Ol' Jase Good trade for both teams.

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    LTIR just needs to apply to the playoffs as well. When a player plays, it counts towards the cap.

    It’s really not that hard at all. Cap needs to be in play until the Cup is awarded.
     
  12. NoCogs2020 Registered User

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    Man for all of Tampa's "Gaming the system" they sure did it poorly, they had over 5mil in LTIR they could have used on yet another player.
    Lousy cheaters are even lousy at cheating....



    Get over it.
    It isn't a problem, the roster they actually ice, isn't 18million over the cap.

    They have
    24.737 to their 6 dressed defensemen
    10.8 to Goalies
    53.791 to their 12 forwards.
    which
    Totals out at 89.328 mil for their 20man dress roster.
    They are 7.28mil over the "cap" with the roster they are actually using.

    For the Cap should count in the PO Crowd.
    They have 7.475 of LTIR space from the Gaborik and Nilsson contracts, so the roster they are dressing would even cap compliant in those circumstances.


    And if you want to get even more technical, they have 5.736mil in their LTIR relief pool that is unused, so, Yes they would technically have to sit 1.5mil in cap hits out of the lineup to be "compliant" but again, it isn't some extreme number for them to be compliant.
    That's basically swapping McElhinney for one of their 700k ahl goalies, and swapping Rutta with Cleasson.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2021
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  13. KevFu Registered User

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    He was injured, he took time to get back. And they looked at where they were in the standings and thanks to CBJ's bad season, they basically kept him out of the lineup an extra month to go buy more players. And that is what has people upset. He was in practice, wearing a contact jersey for like 6 weeks before he was activated. I know guys need time to go from "I can be on the ice in practice" to "I'm 100% to play an NHL game" but it was blatantly obvious what they were doing.

    THAT is really the issue. I have no problem with the rules being what they are, because 99% of teams would be screwed and miss the playoffs if they lost elite talent like Kucherov and Stamkos for the regular season.

    Like, the Islanders were 4th and 3rd in the NHL in points at the time of Adam Pelech's injury last year and Anders Lee's injury this year. They finished 11th and 12th in the NHL in points, and if there were 82-game seasons each time, them getting into the playoffs might have been dicey both years (2020 more than this year).

    And the Islanders are using Boychuk on LTIR instead of retirement for the cap space benefit.
     
  14. Nuckler Registered User

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    An easy fix for this would just be that once a player is cleared to practice with the team(meaning getting close to return) their cap hit applies to the teams cap. No more having a guy practice with the team for 6 weeks before he's activated
     
  15. NoCogs2020 Registered User

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    The Stars did the same thing with Seguin.
    He had the same surgery as Kucherov (plus another one on top of that on his knee)
    He had it earlier than Kucherov did, and was back at practice weeks before he dressed for a game, all the while the team was fighting for a PO spot. You think they wouldn't have liked to insert him into the lineup a couple weeks before they did, to put them over the top in the PO pursuit?
    All in all, despite having surgery over a month earlier, he made it back in time to potentially play for 5 games, he played in 3. They were 100% missing the PO and sat him for the last 2 to give him even more time to recover.
     
  16. BoltSTH Registered User

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    If a team had a GM that is smart enough to use the CBA for the maximum benefit of that team, and an owner willing to pay for it, that is not circumvention but a GM doing his job, and an owner committed to winning.
     
  17. KevFu Registered User

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    Right, but the rule now is that teams aren't allowed to keep healthy players on IR for cap circumvention, but no one is going to get called on that, ever.

    They're not going to change the rules because no team is dumb enough to purposefully try what the Lightning did.
     
  18. Captain97 Registered User

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    I said this in another thread we shouldn't be mad at Tampa.

    Be mad at:

    The NHL for writing the rules to allow it

    And

    Your favourite team's GM for not doing it first.
     
  19. KevFu Registered User

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    See, that's why there are people upset. The rules DON'T allow it. There's a rule that specifically says you can't do what Tampa did with Kucherov, because it is cap circumvention. It's just totally impossible to enforce. No one is going to NOT BELIEVE a player or medical staff when they say "He needs more time." Even though everyone knew.

    His timeline was always "Game one of the playoffs" and yet when the NHL pushed the playoffs back after he took off the no-contact jersey, his timeline moved with it. Cooper's saying "oh, he's wearing that jersey instead of the no contact jersey because no one likes the color."

    It was all one giant wink.

    It is what it is. Doesn't change anything for the playoffs. But probably should cost them a draft pick.
     
  20. WarriorofTime Registered User

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    If you want to stop Tampa Bay, BEAT them in the Playoffs. Complaining about the rules is loser talk IMO
     
  21. WarriorofTime Registered User

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    The Islanders series hasn't even started and they have fans already complaining? Come on guys... at least have some hope in your team.
     
  22. Xirik Registered User

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    the Lightning are violating the spirit of the rules you say?

    Better forfeit some draft picks!

    signed
    Still angry Devils fan
     
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  23. WarriorofTime Registered User

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    What the Devils tried to do was ridiculous IMO. Didn't they offer Kovalchuk a 17 year contract when he was already in his 30s? I get that other teams (Hawks included) were doing similar stuff but they just took it to a whole different level.
     
  24. Leaves34 Registered User

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    Nothing they did was against the rules, at all.
    Teams should have just accepted it and beat the Devils in the playoffs :help:
     
  25. WarriorofTime Registered User

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    They did, or did I miss the Devils winning any Cups post-salary cap era?
     

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