The Next Step In Kadri's Evolution

[Fogelhund]

The next step in Kadri's evolution, will be his name on the Stanley Cup, for the Leafs.

 

[rent free]

Why do you keep spewing blatantly false nonsense?

Kadri scored 32 goals and 61 points playing primarily with Leo Komarov and Connor Brown. How in the holy **** does he need "someone to help him produce."

it's not false nonsense, you aren't understanding what's being said, unsurprisingly. komarov and brown had 30 points when they played with kadri, so thats a bad argument. kadri also had 17 of his points (more than a 1/4th) on the pp. this season, when kadri played with marleau and komarov, he had 25 points in 47 games, but when he played with marner he netted 30 points in 33 games. to add to this, he went pointless through 11 games in the month of december, and had 2 points in 9 games in janaury. when marner was placed along his side, he only had 12 pointless games. it's not shocking you couldn't tell that he needed someone to help him produce.

 

[Gary Nylund]

it's not false nonsense, you aren't understanding what's being said, unsurprisingly. komarov and brown had 30 points when they played with kadri, so thats a bad argument. kadri also had 17 of his points (more than a 1/4th) on the pp. this season, when kadri played with marleau and komarov, he had 25 points in 47 games, but when he played with marner he netted 30 points in 33 games. to add to this, he went pointless through 11 games in the month of december, and had 2 points in 9 games in janaury. when marner was placed along his side, he only had 12 pointless games. it's not shocking you couldn't tell that he needed someone to help him produce.

I don't think you responded to the numbers I posted earlier, here they are again. I don't want to give you a hard time but I can't help but wonder if you're ignoring these numbers because the fact that Marner's scoring rate roughly doubled while playing with Kadri seems to directly contradict your claim that Kadri is a poor passer etc.

Marner with Kadri: 5.58 GF/60, 2.09 GA/60
Marner without Kadri: 2.83 GF/60, 2.91 GA/60

To me, there is one and only one area where we could hope to see massive improvement when it comes to Kadri. He should be doing something like practising meditation and working with someone who can teach him how to keep calm at all times. Be a pest, get under opponents skins but do it in a cold, calculated fashion while always keeping your cool the way Marchand does. Cut down the games suspended during playoffs from 3 to 0, that's what I want to see and I think he can do it. As for cherry picking on-ice stats, to me that's just trying really hard to find some that just isn't there. Kadri's overall stats are #1C level and if that means I'm defending him against criticism, I'm 100% fine with that.

 

[rent free]

Kadri is 17th in goals scored over the last two seasons. He's literally in the top 3% of goal scorers. Hell, he only has one less goal than Tavares who is considered a bonafide star and borderline franchise player.

you are only clinging on to is his goal scoring. the reason you are doing that is because you have nothing else to mention when it comes to kadri. when talking about offence, there's more than goal scoring.

john tavares is considered a bonafide star and borderline franchise player because he is a fantastic play maker and elevates the players around him, not because he scores a lot of goals and doesn't get a lot of assists, unlike kadri. kadri isn't a fantastic play maker (he's a good one) and he definitely doesn't elevate the players around him. another reason why tavares is renowned as an exceptional player is due to his point totals. he's a near ppg player over his career, which spans a year off of a decade. kadri isn't close to that whatsoever and most likely will never be. another thing to mention is that kadri is a center, yet he didn't drive his line last season. it was marner who did that. tavares has been the line driver and focal point of the isles offence for the past decade minus one year. tavares is the complete package offensively. he scores goals and gets assists as well. kadri's only had 1 season where he's gotten 30 assists, tavares has done it every season he's been in the nhl, minus the lockout season.

its remarkably shameful how you and other leaf fans ignore his low assist total and only look at his goal total to pump his tires, calling him a "1C", when his career high is 61 points, which looks to be less reachable as time goes on.

 

[1specter]

and he definitely doesn't elevate the players around him

This is pretty much all I need to read to know you don't know anything. Not sure how you can make these claims when guys like Komarov and Winnik had their best production and career years alongside Kadri, or even a guy like Santorelli who managed a 40 pt pace with him and was parlayed into a package deal for a first and a decent prospect at the time.

its remarkably shameful how you and other leaf fans ignore his low assist total

What's shameful is making arguments without factoring in the bigger picture and then pretending like you know more than others.

 

[rent free]

I don't think you responded to the numbers I posted earlier, here they are again. I don't want to give you a hard time but I can't help but wonder if you're ignoring these numbers because the fact that Marner's scoring rate roughly doubled while playing with Kadri seems to directly contradict your claim that Kadri is a poor passer etc.

Marner with Kadri: 5.58 GF/60, 2.09 GA/60
Marner without Kadri: 2.83 GF/60, 2.91 GA/60

To me, there is one and only one area where we could hope to see massive improvement when it comes to Kadri. He should be doing something like practising meditation and working with someone who can teach him how to keep calm at all times. Be a pest, get under opponents skins but do it in a cold, calculated fashion while always keeping your cool the way Marchand does. Cut down the games suspended during playoffs from 3 to 0, that's what I want to see and I think he can do it. As for cherry picking on-ice stats, to me that's just trying really hard to find some that just isn't there. Kadri's overall stats are #1C level and if that means I'm defending him against criticism, I'm 100% fine with that.

i never said kadri is a poor passer, i said he wasn't a line driver. he certainly wasn't one this season, and that was evident by his splits with and without marner. kadri helped marner as well, i'm not denying that.

 

[rent free]

This is pretty much all I need to read to know you don't know anything. Not sure how you can make these claims when guys like Komarov and Winnik had their best production and career years alongside Kadri, or even a guy like Santorelli who managed a 40 pt pace with him and was parlayed into a package deal for a first and a decent prospect at the time.


What's shameful is making arguments without factoring in the bigger picture and then pretending like you know more than others.

by cherry picking parts of my posts instead of critiquing the entire thing, its clear that you accept what i wrote as the truth.

 

[Gary Nylund]

i never said kadri is a poor passer, i said he wasn't a line driver. he certainly wasn't one this season, and that was evident by his splits with and without marner. kadri helped marner as well, i'm not denying that.

He didn't just "help", Marner's goal scoring rate doubled with Kadri. That would suggest Kadri is quite the play maker and it directly refutes your claims that Kadri doesn't drive the offence and especially your statement that he doesn't elevate the players around him.

There are quite a few players who have seen more success playing with Kadri than anywhere else, how do you explain that?

 

[Ratboy]

Curious argument:
Kadri didn't play for the leafs due to a suspension and that hurt the team.
solution: get him off the team.

no no no. instead hire a player that wouldnt be suspended and could help the team?

 

[Gary Nylund]

kadri isn't a fantastic play maker (he's a good one) and he definitely doesn't elevate the players around him. .

Not sure how you can make these claims when guys like Komarov and Winnik had their best production and career years alongside Kadri, or even a guy like Santorelli who managed a 40 pt pace with him and was parlayed into a package deal for a first and a decent prospect at the time.

Good sir Anish, this seems to completely refute your claims about Kadri. Perhaps it's time to admit that you were mistaken?

 

[Obliviate]

View attachment 135359

HockeyIntangibles: The Next Step in Kadri's Evolution



Happy Monday

For Kadri's metamorphosis to run it's course he has to challenge Ryan Johannsen to a parking lot fight.

 

[stickty111]

no no no. instead hire a player that wouldnt be suspended and could help the team?

Kadri already helps the team in a big way.
However he does need to control his emotions, and is something he could get better at.

 

[Ratboy]

Kadri already helps the team in a big way.
However he does need to control his emotions, and is something he could get better at.

exactly.

 

[stickty111]

exactly.

This is fine because its something that is a weakness. Criticising something like passing which he is good at is not alright. I know it wasnt you, just commenting on the other poster.

 

[kb]

So your saying the supporters of a player shouldnt defend him?
Then I will go the opposite, the critics shouldnt criticize a player.
If people are allowed to present their opinion, then why are you going after the posters who are defending the player? Isnt that also an opinion?

But he is defended when there is no need to defend. Read very carefully.......what is the premise of this thread again? What is the next step he could take in his evolution to be better.

What if some think he is still underachieving because they see he could improve and do more, and become elite? It's not to criticize, it's to say they think with X or Y improvement, think he can be even better than he is now! It doesn't mean people don't love what he is doing now.

Jesus people, get a grip.

So many people take things the wrong way, and my original post stands and was proven here beyond a shadow of a doubt. Never suggest improvements, or you are branded a hater and a know nothing.

 

[Ratboy]

This is fine because its something that is a weakness. Criticising something like passing which he is good at is not alright. I know it wasnt you, just commenting on the other poster.

The suspension itself hurt our centre depth so bad because Bozak was hot trash all last year. I just want Kadri to take numbers and wait for his chance if he wants to play that game. We can't have stupid plays like that anymore. If he can't cut it out of his game I WOULD consider trading the guy for someone who is more reliable to be there when you need him.
Don't get me wrong , I want him on the team putting up 30 goal seasons and shutting guys down but I ALSO want him not making really boneheaded plays when it matters the most.

 

[stickty111]

The suspension itself hurt our centre depth so bad because Bozak was hot trash all last year. I just want Kadri to take numbers and wait for his chance if he wants to play that game. We can't have stupid plays like that anymore. If he can't cut it out of his game I WOULD consider trading the guy for someone who is more reliable to be there when you need him.
Don't get me wrong , I want him on the team putting up 30 goal seasons and shutting guys down but I ALSO want him not making really boneheaded plays when it matters the most.

I agree with you. Kadri has shown to improve so lets see if it happens again.

 

[moon111]

He didn't just "help", Marner's goal scoring rate doubled with Kadri. That would suggest Kadri is quite the play maker and it directly refutes your claims that Kadri doesn't drive the offence and especially your statement that he doesn't elevate the players around him.

There are quite a few players who have seen more success playing with Kadri than anywhere else, how do you explain that?

Who?

 

[Duke Silver]

no no no. instead hire a player that wouldnt be suspended and could help the team?

So you're going to throw away a back-to-back 30 goal scoring #3C due to a mistake (where he was picking up for Marner, by the way... some would call that character).

That's the definition of short-sightedness.

 

[Ratboy]

So you're going to throw away a back-to-back 30 goal scoring #3C due to a mistake (where he was picking up for Marner, by the way... some would call that character).

That's the definition of short-sightedness.

"The suspension itself hurt our centre depth so bad because Bozak was hot trash all last year. I just want Kadri to take numbers and wait for his chance if he wants to play that game. We can't have stupid plays like that anymore. If he can't cut it out of his game I WOULD consider trading the guy for someone who is more reliable to be there when you need him.
Don't get me wrong , I want him on the team putting up 30 goal seasons and shutting guys down but I ALSO want him not making really boneheaded plays when it matters the most."

pay attention.

 

[mapleleaf979]

Next step for Kadri? Self-control at all times. His playoff suspension was selfish and a borderline tradeable offense.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Who?

Several players have been mentioned earlier ITT. Not sure if Frattin has been mentioned or not but I'm pretty sure he's another one.

Next step for Kadri? Self-control at all times. His playoff suspension was selfish and a borderline tradeable offense.

LOL. I'll never understand why some people insist on using the word selfish when Kadri had nothing to gain from his actions.

 

[deletethis]

A newly adjusted line over which to not cross in the heat of competition. As recently as the time Kadri was drafted, that infamous Boston series' hit wouldn't even have been punished, it would have been applauded.

 

[ACC1224]

Next step for Kadri? Self-control at all times. His playoff suspension was selfish and a borderline tradeable offense.

You could find many ways to describe what happened. Sticking up for a teammate would not be considered selfish in a Team environment.

 

[Duke Silver]

But he is defended when there is no need to defend. Read very carefully.......what is the premise of this thread again? What is the next step he could take in his evolution to be better.

What if some think he is still underachieving because they see he could improve and do more, and become elite? It's not to criticize, it's to say they think with X or Y improvement, think he can be even better than he is now! It doesn't mean people don't love what he is doing now.

Jesus people, get a grip.

So many people take things the wrong way, and my original post stands and was proven here beyond a shadow of a doubt. Never suggest improvements, or you are branded a hater and a know nothing.

Rarely do threads remain solely on topic. The conversation usually morphs into quasi-related topics. My initial foray into this conversation was due to a poor logical conclusion. That’s pretty much it. I would have done the same in a Rielly thread or a Nylander thread.