Fro
Cheatin on CBJ w TBL
does Giroux come with him since he's the player that's helped him the most...well prob him and Jagr i'd imagine...
the Nash trade - We won
- Thread starter Nordique
- Start date
- Status
does Giroux come with him since he's the player that's helped him the most...well prob him and Jagr i'd imagine...
Losing Ryan Suter for nothing, trading away first round picks, having your captain sign an offer sheet because he doesn't want to sign there forcing you to giving him like $20 million, failing to draft, develop, or aquire and legit scoring or first line talent - no, that's not the kind of organization I want to emulate.
Crede777
Deputized
- Dec 16, 2009
- 14,639
- 4,164
While that's a fairly wrong assessment of their situation (Weber was after the money and wanted to just get a deal done, he didn't want to leave Nashville), what you bring up is moot when you consider the fact that they consistently make the playoffs. They have some of the best coaching and defensive/goaltending drafting and development in the league. Their style of scoring by committee and building from the net out is something which Davidson has said Columbus will be doing. So if you don't like that type of team, I have some rough news for you.
Columbus would be lucky if they had that kind of success. This is a team where a single playoff victory would be cause for celebration and a parade.
Let's have a little success before we start throwing stones, please. A Nashville fan came in here and complimented our team and you responded by trashing his. That's highly immature.
I wouldn't say we won the trade or that the Rangers lost the trade - honestly, I think it's what both organization's did around the trade that has made the difference. The CBJ with Nash and no one else were going nowhere - and by the time the assets we did have (Jenner, Johansen, Murray) developed, Nash would be in his 30's.
By trading Nash and getting multiple young, NHL ready roster players and the pick, we were able to get a more balanced roster - but this is also because we acquired Foligno, and brought up Atkinson and Calvert, got more out of Johansen, and of course, got BOB.
The Rangers I don't think gave up too much for Nash. The problem is that they expected to get strong contributions from Richards, Gaborik, and Krieder this year - and both players haven't given them much (not to mention Brian Boyle last year compared to this year). So that was a huge miscalculation, as was their belief they could get by with Aaron Asham, Jeff Halpern, Taylor Pyatt, etc in depth roles.
They also, along with their fans, put too much stock in their defense like McDonough, MDZ, etc...these guys put up less points the Fedor Tyutin. Not exactly what was expected.
But I do agree that the CBJ are better off after having made the Nash deal, but a lot depends on the moves both teams made around the deal as well as their expectations for the rest of the roster.
Last edited by a moderator:
I found it condescending that a Preds fan would come in and say we are becoming "Nashville-esque" as if they are the franchise we should strive for, when their history is filled with trade blunders and failed draft picks. Nashville is not the model we should strive for.
But maybe I just took it the wrong way because of anti-Preds bias.
I gave you a pass because you live in Hoboken
I've been meaning to ask if you're looking forward to having the Jackets in your backyard with the realignment?
the thing is
the rangers will not be able to get a player like nash thru the draft unless they get extremely lucky. even when they are bad, they are not bad enough to get top 5 picks so trading dubi and arty for nash was a no brainer. they feel that they will be able to replicate those to players thru the draft a heck of a lot easier then it will be to acquire a player of nash's talents. you do that trade 10 outta 10 times. the main thing that hurt them was that they let prust mitchell and fedotanko walk. along with losing dubi and arty that is a heck of alot of turnover to deal with in a short season. a longer camp would have been more beneficial. the smart thing would have been to shell out a little more money for those guys if they knew they were going to make the trade.
from cbj perspective, they had a superstar and a team with high picks that never panned out. they had no swagger,no identity they needed a culture change and these guys have provided it. they actually remind me of the nyr teams from the past few years. never quit don't want to lose attitude. i really wish you guys were bad this year cause i want you to get makkinion. eventually when you guys are ready, your going to need to add a superstar to really contend. i just hope for your guys sake it's thru the draft so you don't have to go thru what we have. all and all i think it's a pretty even trade. both teams needed a specific brand of medicine and got it. i think the rangers will be much better next year with a long camp. nash is good as advertised, truly remarkable with the puck. and cbj got that new swagger. and the players that have it are all young. you guys are really getting there and it is a pleasure to see. your fans deserve it. just learn from our mistakes when it is time to add your horse. make smarter decisions with the money.
the rangers will not be able to get a player like nash thru the draft unless they get extremely lucky. even when they are bad, they are not bad enough to get top 5 picks so trading dubi and arty for nash was a no brainer. they feel that they will be able to replicate those to players thru the draft a heck of a lot easier then it will be to acquire a player of nash's talents. you do that trade 10 outta 10 times. the main thing that hurt them was that they let prust mitchell and fedotanko walk. along with losing dubi and arty that is a heck of alot of turnover to deal with in a short season. a longer camp would have been more beneficial. the smart thing would have been to shell out a little more money for those guys if they knew they were going to make the trade.
from cbj perspective, they had a superstar and a team with high picks that never panned out. they had no swagger,no identity they needed a culture change and these guys have provided it. they actually remind me of the nyr teams from the past few years. never quit don't want to lose attitude. i really wish you guys were bad this year cause i want you to get makkinion. eventually when you guys are ready, your going to need to add a superstar to really contend. i just hope for your guys sake it's thru the draft so you don't have to go thru what we have. all and all i think it's a pretty even trade. both teams needed a specific brand of medicine and got it. i think the rangers will be much better next year with a long camp. nash is good as advertised, truly remarkable with the puck. and cbj got that new swagger. and the players that have it are all young. you guys are really getting there and it is a pleasure to see. your fans deserve it. just learn from our mistakes when it is time to add your horse. make smarter decisions with the money.
I agree with this. But let me add, we're all a little new to this concept of smack talk.
Well said Jay,
Trades aren't like games, there doesn't have to be a "winner." Both teams can get exactly what they need. But too often we just boil things down to wins and losses for things that really don't have them such as trades, business deals, and politics.
Trades aren't like games, there doesn't have to be a "winner." Both teams can get exactly what they need. But too often we just boil things down to wins and losses for things that really don't have them such as trades, business deals, and politics.
I gave you a pass because you live in Hoboken
I've been meaning to ask if you're looking forward to having the Jackets in your backyard with the realignment?
Yes, although not nearly as much as I enjoyed having my Zherdev out here for a year.
"what is this?! two skilled players punching each other? with Shields Joe?!"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sg1VQWLfgvs
Sens fan here:
Right from Day 1 I thought that NYR overpaid for Nash. He is a great winger - one of the best ones you can get but I have always preferred building around Playmaking Centers.
Either way you guys got value. You have 4 nhlers from a trade where all 4 will have the potential to be top 6 forwards and/or top 4 Dmen. I'm including the 1st rounder here because in 2013 a middle of the first round pick is very valuable. The top end of this draft is almost as good as 2003 and you guys have a fantastic judge of talent in your new GM. I have no doubt you will get a top 6 forward from this pick.
Some will say you can't compare a trade too early - I agree oftentimes but to be frank nowmatter how well Nash does it will be hard to equal the value NYR gave you guys. Unless he is going to be putting up 100 points every year its unlikely that this trade will be even.
Right from Day 1 I thought that NYR overpaid for Nash. He is a great winger - one of the best ones you can get but I have always preferred building around Playmaking Centers.
Either way you guys got value. You have 4 nhlers from a trade where all 4 will have the potential to be top 6 forwards and/or top 4 Dmen. I'm including the 1st rounder here because in 2013 a middle of the first round pick is very valuable. The top end of this draft is almost as good as 2003 and you guys have a fantastic judge of talent in your new GM. I have no doubt you will get a top 6 forward from this pick.
Some will say you can't compare a trade too early - I agree oftentimes but to be frank nowmatter how well Nash does it will be hard to equal the value NYR gave you guys. Unless he is going to be putting up 100 points every year its unlikely that this trade will be even.
Zherdev for a single year is worth more to you than Tyutin for several??
my Zherdev Rangers shirt is forever
Like I said in a different thread, if a mysterious funk settles on your team and everyone on it starts to look like losers with no heart and all the fans are calling on the coach to be fired because he's lost the team, you better check to see if Rick Nash is on the roster.
I'm prepared to be wrong about this, the sample size for Nash is too small- only 2 teams. But I think it's entirely possible that the presence of Nash has something to do with the team's woes. Not in a consciously disruptive "cancer in the room" kind of way, but in some way that messes with other guys on the team. Something like your "talent sucking force field".
Around here, it's safe to say that even ardent Nash supporters are at least satisfied with the results of the trade; I know there are sentiments though that the trade was bad for the Rangers (see: 2013 NY Rangers record). Could be a lot of hooey, but I'm interested to find out. Time will tell.
Admittedly, I'm down on Nash, so that's maybe got something to with this. With a different couple of guys than Richards and Gaborik, maybe better chemistry happens. But we've seen several seasons of failed attempts to build around Nash already. I think you should be glad he's not the captain.
Finally, the talent level of the guy is undeniable (as is the wholesomeness of his projected persona). But his numbers on a team don't tell the whole story.
IBleedUnionBlue
Registered User
- Aug 16, 2009
- 2,143
- 0
As the season winds down, I wonder if opinions has changed. Nash leads Rangers in goals and has had an excellent season. Dubinsky has 1 goal and has been injured much of season. Anisimov has been very good but has taken some huge hits and has been injured. Erixon has been a 6-7 damn.
Wonder what people will be saying next weekend.
Wonder what people will be saying next weekend.
Kakko
Formerly Chytil
I guess I'll offer some insight from a Rangers fan's perspective on everything
Anisimov: He's always been really inconsistent. Last season, he had a stretch of 20 games or so where he, Gaborik and Stepan were tearing **** up, and he had like 20 points. In the other 60 games he only had 15. And he needs to keep his head up. He generally got up and kept playing after getting hurt, but it can't end well in the long run.
Dubisnky: He's always had the talent to be a 60 point guy. Even played with Jagr in his rookie year. Two years ago, he was brilliant, and led our team in scoring, doing everything. Signed a big contract, and just never looked the same. Can't say what he'll turn out to be, but I love the guy, so I hope for the best.
Erixon: He looked great in the AHL. Good defense, great offense. When he came up for 18 games, he looked like a kid playing with men. Getting abused badly. It looks like he's gotten better, and there's not much else I can say about him.
1st rounder: Guess you might get something good out of the 30th pick
Gaborik: He's Gaborik. He can score 40 goals, scoring in 30 different games. Or he can score 20 goals spread out over just 10 games, mostly blowouts where his goals aren't necessary. For the sake of value, i hope you guys get something in between
Now what we got
Nash: 40 points in 40 games. If he hadn't been made useless on a line with Gaborik and Richards (who were playing like 4th liners) for a few games, he's have 45. Almost all of his goals have been clutch, tying the game or giving us the lead. At one point he lead the league in 3rd period goals. He might still, but it was before OV got hot.
Brassard: (note: this is likely a huge overreaction based on 9 games) I don't know what the hell you guys did to him in Columbus. HE'S BEEN AMAZING! Looks like he could easily be a 60 point guy. It probably helps that he's had a loot less pressure on him as our #3. Although, he's already moved into #2, passing Richards.
Moore: People are him for McDonagh when he's on the ice. Not much else needs to be said. Much better than Erixon ever was in NY. Like, MUCH better.
Bonus: We got Stralman for free, but's been absolutely brilliant as a #5, and filling in fine on the second pair with Staal out.
Anisimov: He's always been really inconsistent. Last season, he had a stretch of 20 games or so where he, Gaborik and Stepan were tearing **** up, and he had like 20 points. In the other 60 games he only had 15. And he needs to keep his head up. He generally got up and kept playing after getting hurt, but it can't end well in the long run.
Dubisnky: He's always had the talent to be a 60 point guy. Even played with Jagr in his rookie year. Two years ago, he was brilliant, and led our team in scoring, doing everything. Signed a big contract, and just never looked the same. Can't say what he'll turn out to be, but I love the guy, so I hope for the best.
Erixon: He looked great in the AHL. Good defense, great offense. When he came up for 18 games, he looked like a kid playing with men. Getting abused badly. It looks like he's gotten better, and there's not much else I can say about him.
1st rounder: Guess you might get something good out of the 30th pick
Gaborik: He's Gaborik. He can score 40 goals, scoring in 30 different games. Or he can score 20 goals spread out over just 10 games, mostly blowouts where his goals aren't necessary. For the sake of value, i hope you guys get something in between
Now what we got
Nash: 40 points in 40 games. If he hadn't been made useless on a line with Gaborik and Richards (who were playing like 4th liners) for a few games, he's have 45. Almost all of his goals have been clutch, tying the game or giving us the lead. At one point he lead the league in 3rd period goals. He might still, but it was before OV got hot.
Brassard: (note: this is likely a huge overreaction based on 9 games) I don't know what the hell you guys did to him in Columbus. HE'S BEEN AMAZING! Looks like he could easily be a 60 point guy. It probably helps that he's had a loot less pressure on him as our #3. Although, he's already moved into #2, passing Richards.
Moore: People are him for McDonagh when he's on the ice. Not much else needs to be said. Much better than Erixon ever was in NY. Like, MUCH better.
Bonus: We got Stralman for free, but's been absolutely brilliant as a #5, and filling in fine on the second pair with Staal out.
Like the Nash trade, hate the Gaborik trade still. Thought it was absolutely stupid to trade Moore who I think was going to be our 2nd best defender in a couple of years behind (hopefully) Murray. I also don't think Gaborik was anywhere in the ballpark of the right player to bring to Columbus. As far as the Nash trade, I like the pieces. Erixon should be a solid 2nd pairing defender in the future (should have sent him back to NY rather than Moore) Anisimov gives us a solid second line center that has the skill of a top line center but lack consistency and Dubinsky provides us with another solid top 6 winger or center. Stralman sucks so no loss there, Nash is Nash but the culture has shifted for the better since he has been gone; Brassard was never going to develop any further in Columbus in my opinion. I think we will see a 60 point Brassard in NY as well, because he certainly has the skill for it, it's just he really needed a change of scenery. Dorsett is just a 3rd or 4th line pest, nothing more, not that big of a deal to lose him. Moore, I've already said my piece on him.
What an incredibly ignorant post. Nash has been the Rangers' best player not named Lundqvist the length of the season. There have been a number of games this season where the Rangers could not get anything going until Rick Nash put the team on his back and brought them back into a game. The reason the Rangers have been poor is not because of him or the trade. Stop trying to make your ****** case for causation. It's not Nash. Watch the games.
Byrral
Registered User
Don't understand the need to pronounce a winner in every trade but thats the HF fanboy way. The trades helped both teams now and in the future,. The culture has changed in Columbus since the Nash trade so that's a win in itself. The guys that went to the NYR I wish luck now and in the future as long as it's not against us. I can't wait to go head to head with the Rangers and the other teams in our new division next season.
I said I was prepared to be wrong about it, and for the most part it looks like I am. Nash is doing well in NY overall. But the post wasn't made out of ignorance, it was made out of having watching Nash in Columbus for years and getting an impression of his role on a team. And for the hundredth time, that a player is the best player on an underperforming team is no argument at all. Nash was the best player on the Blue Jackets every year he was here, and you know how well those teams played. Trading him away was a good move by this organization.
Boy do I love Rangers fans
- Status
Ad
Latest posts
-
GDT: Game Three: Boston Bruins At Toronto Maple Leafs (7:00 PM EST - SN, CBC)- Latest: Jimmy Firecracker
Upcoming events
-
Series Winner Boston Bruins vs Toronto Maple LeafsWagers: 8Staked: $24,704.00Event closes- Updated:
-
Game 3 Boston Bruins @ Toronto Maple Leafs - Series tied 1-1Wagers: 17Staked: $31,002.00Event closes
- Updated:
-
Game 2 Vegas Golden Knights @ Dallas Stars - Vegas Golden Knights leads series 1-0Wagers: 12Staked: $10,874.00Event closes
- Updated:
-
-