the most overrated Hockey player of all time

[Dennis Bonvie]

Brodeur probably better places in the underrated thread because no one appreciates him it seems...they look at numbers, make some mental adjustment for a defensive system they probably don't understand and wonder why he didn't give up 1 goal per game instead of 2...so he probably shouldn't go in this thread...

Neither should Crosby, I can't imagine how anyone could come to that conclusion...he's done nothing but meet and exceed the lofty hype that was set forth for him...he's been the best player in the game all-around since he stepped onto the ice I gotta believe...

Dionne gets trashed for his playoff failures and never seems to get any respect...not sure who it is that's overrating him...but maybe, I'm not sure on that one...

Messier is overrated to me though, so is Forsberg (though, he's another one like Brodeur where now it's coming full circle and eventually he'll be underrated again), looks like we came to the conclusion that Sawchuk is/was, whatever that's worth...not a lot of respect for Richter on this board, but outside of it, yes, he's overrated (many believe he's top-10 ever it seems)...

I'll throw in Tim Thomas, Eddie Shore, Guy Lafleur might be a touch overrated in terms of what he accomplished vs. what he could do outside the dynasty years...

You're not serious, are you?

 

[BruinsNeedaRussian]

Begins and ends with Shore.

Considering he won the Hart four times and people consider Lidstrom better, you are in the wrong thread.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Considering he won the Norris four times and people consider Lidstrom better, you are in the wrong thread.

I think you mean 4 Harts.

 

[thom]

Guy Lafleur 3 time Art Ross 3 time Lester Pearson 2 time hart trophy led playoffs or tied 3 times in pts.Fastest 1000 in history at time.First player with 6 fifty goals seasons and 100 pts season in history.All time leader for habs in assists leader in pts.Had more assists in career than his centerman.Holds over 30 team records including game winning goals.Played during the separtist era where there were death threats to him and family.And to many in quebec he's the greatest hab ever to lace a pair of skates.

 

[BruinsNeedaRussian]

I think you mean 4 Harts.

Yeah, my bad. Would have won the Norris a lot more than four times

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

You're not serious, are you?

I think Brodeur is overrated by the mainstream media and people who like "career records!," but is underrated by fans who don't appreciate the value of his puckhandling, durability, and leadership. The latter applies to much of hfboards including yourself, my friend

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

I think Brodeur is overrated by the mainstream media and people who like "career records!," but is underrated by fans who don't appreciate the value of his puckhandling, durability, and leadership. The latter applies to much of hfboards including yourself, my friend

That's the problem with overrated/underrated discussions. It can vary greatly based on whom is rating.

 

[Ogopogo*]

Mario Lemieux.

Many people like to put him ahead of Gretzky, Howe and Orr and that is just simply blasphemous.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

I think Brodeur is overrated by the mainstream media and people who like "career records!," but is underrated by fans who don't appreciate the value of his puckhandling, durability, and leadership. The latter applies to much of hfboards including yourself, my friend

I most certainly do not underestimate the value of his puckhandling.

 

[Bexlyspeed]

Mario Lemieux.

Many people like to put him ahead of Gretzky, Howe and Orr and that is just simply blasphemous.

thats absurd. maybe he doesn't have the numbers, but all you have to do is watch mario to see he's got more skill than anyone thats ever played the game.

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

thats absurd. maybe he doesn't have the numbers, but all you have to do is watch mario to see he's got more skill than anyone thats ever played the game.

I wouldn't generally agree with the view this post is in response to but I still find it somewhat ironic in this thread.

 

[Ogopogo*]

thats absurd. maybe he doesn't have the numbers, but all you have to do is watch mario to see he's got more skill than anyone thats ever played the game.

Firstly, I disagree with that premise. Secondly, if skill does not translate to results, it is worthless.

Gretzky, Howe and Orr had the greatest career results in NHL history. Lemieux is a distant #4.

 

[saskganesh]

That's the problem with overrated/underrated discussions. It can vary greatly based on whom is rating.

If there is no measurable, objective criteria, then it's just a silly list of likes and dislikes.

 

[PB37]

I can't believe someone mentioned Bobby Orr as being overrated.

 

[RabbinsDuck]

If there is no measurable, objective criteria, then it's just a silly list of likes and dislikes.

It's the objective measurements which can be looked at subjectively. Brodeur is overrated by those that look at wins, Cups and records, but underrated by those who focus on SV%.

 

[Nalens Oga]

Mario Lemieux.

Many people like to put him ahead of Gretzky, Howe and Orr and that is just simply blasphemous.

I dunno about careers but Lemieux was a better player than Howe or Orr.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

I dunno about careers but Lemieux was a better player than Howe or Orr.

really? what makes you say that? did he win more cups or MVPs than them? did he dominate his competition to a greater degree?

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

i don't think i have an all time top ten list in me, but a few players that i thought were super overrated: kariya (an excellent game-changing player in his prime, but not the transcendent player he was considered to be; definitely in the sakic/forsberg/selanne tier, not higher than them), nieuwendyk (as mentioned above), kovalev (very very skilled, but not one of the most skilled players of all time by a long shot), and it pains me to say because i loved the guy but scott niedermayer.

guys who were underrated for so long they ended up being overrated: ron francis, rod brind'amour.

 

[PhillyBluesFan]

1.Nick Lidstrom
2.Sidney Crosby
3.Mark Messier
4.Mario Lemiuex

 

[trentmccleary]

Sergei Fedorov... for not really being the elite offensive player and #1 center that people generally describe him as for most of his career.

pre-Dead Puck (6 Seasons)
- he started with a few solid seasons in years that were easy to score in (28th, 22nd and 36th in scoring).
- Then he had a very short peak near the top of the scoring leaders (~ 2.5 seasons, including the lockout shortened season). These seasons also overlap perfectly with Coffey's stay in Detroit.

post-Dead Puck (12 Seasons)
- he only had one season above 70+ points in his last 12 years, starting from the age of 26 years old.

He really didn't sustain his offensive prowess very long in his career. Was a top-20 scorer, maybe 4 times.

 

[SilverSeven]

Erik Karlsson

Location: Nashville

Eric Karlsson...

Giroux is behind by a hairball.

Name: BruinsHockey74

Shocking!

 

[SilverSeven]

I find it hard to call Messier overrated.

2nd all time in points
2nd all time in games played
6 Stanley Cups
2 Hart Trophies
1 Conn Smythe
13- 80+ pnt seasons
17- 20+ goal seasons
15 all star games
Played a strong chippy two way game and was always on the 1st power play and penalty kill units
Also known as one of the greatest captains in the history of the game.

Messier is constantly ranked in the 20-30 range all time. Hardly overrated

Agreed. Ive always found him under rated, but its become fashionable to trash him.

 

[mike14]

Agreed. Ive always found him under rated, but its become fashionable to trash him.

I think he gets trashed a bit due to over exposure. he gets his face in the media a lot, they named that 'leadership award' after him and he gets name dropped on places like NHL.com a lot and when columnists are looking for readers they put him in 'top 10' lists. Couple that with the fact that a lot of people just think of the Messier that went to Vancouver and then came back as an old man to a terrible Rangers team and they begin to question why his face is everywhere.

Ranking Messier in the 20-40 all time group (depending on how you try to sort them) seems right to me. he has an incredible resume but it tails away dramatically (although longevity is a trait of its own).

Overall I would say Messier is:
- over exposed
- under appreciated by the majority of HF posters (who seem to have a mad hate-on)
- ranked about right outside of stupid articles who list well known players to get readers.

Full disclosure: Messier is my favourite all time player, but I can never get him higher than 26th in a 'best of all time' list

 

[Czech Your Math]

I think he gets trashed a bit due to over exposure. he gets his face in the media a lot, they named that 'leadership award' after him and he gets name dropped on places like NHL.com a lot and when columnists are looking for readers they put him in 'top 10' lists. Couple that with the fact that a lot of people just think of the Messier that went to Vancouver and then came back as an old man to a terrible Rangers team and they begin to question why his face is everywhere.

Ranking Messier in the 20-40 all time group (depending on how you try to sort them) seems right to me. he has an incredible resume but it tails away dramatically (although longevity is a trait of its own).

Overall I would say Messier is:
- over exposed
- under appreciated by the majority of HF posters (who seem to have a mad hate-on)
- ranked about right outside of stupid articles who list well known players to get readers.

Full disclosure: Messier is my favourite all time player, but I can never get him higher than 26th in a 'best of all time' list

The over-exposure is a big part of it. His compiling in later years and prime in a high scoring era enabled him to post some great totals. I can't see why he stuck around for so many years on teams that couldn't make the playoffs. Either he was washed up or his effect on teams was overrated, but I don't see his last few years helping his legacy at all, despite his higher career rankings.

In his favor, I will say I was impressed with the difference in record of his teams with or without him in the lineup. I probably used to underrate him, but have come around to a more realistic rating of him in recent years.

Messier, Lindros, and Crosby have to be 3 of the most hyped players I can remember. Maybe that's why they would be rather low on my list of favorite hockey superstars, but I think it has more to do with their perceived personalities.

 

[MS]

The over-exposure is a big part of it. His compiling in later years and prime in a high scoring era enabled him to post some great totals. I can't see why he stuck around for so many years on teams that couldn't make the playoffs. Either he was washed up or his effect on teams was overrated, but I don't see his last few years helping his legacy at all, despite his higher career rankings.

In his favor, I will say I was impressed with the difference in record of his teams with or without him in the lineup. I probably used to underrate him, but have come around to a more realistic rating of him in recent years.

Messier, Lindros, and Crosby have to be 3 of the most hyped players I can remember. Maybe that's why they would be rather low on my list of favorite hockey superstars, but I think it has more to do with their perceived personalities.

The problem with Messier is the end of his career.

Most guys just lose effectiveness and fade away - it happens, doesn't really tarnish your legacy.

Messier completely lost the plot, became caught up in his own myth, demanded to be a quasi-GM of teams toward the end of his career and wouldn't recognize his own declining skills in the process. Became a cancer and a player who made his teams worse.

The question becomes how much the last 7 years of his career take away from the first 15.