The market for Gardiner is being evaluated

Silver91

Agent 0091
May 27, 2007
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Really don't get why this is happening. Sure Carlyle and Gardiner may not be a good match with each other but surely they can get over it, trading him because of the relationship is so stupid. It's not like it's ugly or anything. Unless I hear about an argument between the two or something affecting the locker room, I will refuse to believe this.

Honestly, this is kind of like those Bobby Ryan rumours a few years ago. A case of a young player not playing to his full potential, Carlyle giving him sheltered minutes and the media thinking there's something there when other teams are supposedly calling on him, figuring he's not in our plans anymore.

Now, it could be possible that Gardiner is traded, but I don't think it will happen. If it does, it'd be for a young player with equivalent upside and nobody few will argue that it's at least a fair deal, if not be happy with it.
 
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slozo

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Aug 28, 2011
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You know, we're all (most of us here anyways) Leafs fans, and I get it that many of look at everything as a micromanager when discussing possibilities like this . . . Carlyle this and Nonis that. Lots of talk about Carlyle being a coach who "butts heads too much with certain players" and accusations that he holds a grudge too much. Nonis being short-sighted, etc.

But facts are facts folks - Carlyle is the coach that led a team that was supposed to finish out of the playoffs, well into the playoffs, almost knocking off the vaunted Bruins in fact (save for a 3rd period collapse). He has improved the defensive stats a 100%, while having a very similar group of players that the last coach had.

You might all consider that . . . Carlyle KNOWS WHAT HE IS DOING.

If this was Wilson, with a great pedigree but terrible results . . . I'd be all with you. Mismanaging this or that, etc. But honestly, I look at this as Carlyle knowing where Gardiner needs to improve, and trying to get the most from him. At this pro level . . . it's extremely rare I think that a coach is blinded by his own ego or is too short-sighted to see a talented player for what he is. Gardiner has some defensive deficiencies! And he's young! Carlyle is his coach, it's exactly his JOB to manage him positively into a place where he can be successful, both personally and for the team.

Shop away, I say. No one on the D corps is sacred, IMHO.
 

Leafski

Registered User
Jun 29, 2011
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2 points in 2 games and a +4 rating aint bad. Thought he was useless though according to Randy, scratched in the playoffs and regular season numerous times.

*Cough* Caryle's stubborn decision making *Cough*

Wowww, give your head a shake. Mac even admitted himself that last year he didn't play well...

So as a coach, if a player isn't playing well, they're looking lazy, their production has slowed down alot, and he doesn't really fit your bottom lines you play him more right?.... RIGHT??!?!?!?!
 

ULF_55

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Feb 27, 2002
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#1 C, or #2 two-way D or else it is pointless to trade him

Well, Gardiner as part of a package for a #1 C, unless a salary dump / expiring contract center. Gardiner doesn't land you a young #1 center, but might land you a "potential" #1 center.

Of course there is the Cap to take into consideration ... example Joe Thornton wouldn't fit on the team even if he was traded straight up for Gardiner.
 

hockeywiz542

Registered User
May 26, 2008
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http://www.theglobeandmail.com/spor...s-really-trade-jake-gardiner/article14740880/

The problem here is that the Leafs really don’t have any cap space – it’s getting down into five digits territory – so they can’t exactly move Gardiner for a more established centre or defenceman (their two biggest needs) that makes more than his modest base salary ($875,000).

That means swapping a young player for a young player, and in the case of Gardiner – who barely played in the NHL last season due to concussion, consistency and coaching issues – they’d be selling low.

Gardiner looked remarkably poised and relatively mistake-free under Ron Wilson in his rookie season two years ago but has never had that comfort level under Carlyle, either because he is still readjusting to coming back to the NHL or he is being asked to play out of his personal comfort zone.

He’s not a big guy and not used to playing with much physicality, something this coaching staff is asking for repeatedly.

He is also still only 23 years old, and many, many capable top four NHL defencemen don’t become what they’re going to be until a couple more years into their careers.

But his gifts are obvious – and it’d be a mistake to give up on those too soon.
 

BeleaVing

Registered User
Feb 24, 2013
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am not really keen on trading Gardner at this time.....

But the team that is really stacked with young center prospects is Florida
With Barkov, Huberdeau, Grimaldi, Bjugstad, Shore and even Trocheck.

I would take one of Barkov, Huberdeau, Bjugstad straight across or nearly so.
Grimaldi is too small for my liking.....
would consider Shore or Trocheck in a package of other prospects or futures

Only trouble with this is it is within Leafs own division/ am not sure Fla is looking for a pmDef?
 

sanitysrequiem

Registered User
Nov 14, 2009
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How about Gardiner for Erik Gudbranson from Florida? Similar age, good upside as a steady shutdown AND right handed defenseman. Florida gets a good deal too with Gardiner.
 

Durrr

Registered User
Sep 11, 2012
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You know, we're all (most of us here anyways) Leafs fans, and I get it that many of look at everything as a micromanager when discussing possibilities like this . . . Carlyle this and Nonis that. Lots of talk about Carlyle being a coach who "butts heads too much with certain players" and accusations that he holds a grudge too much. Nonis being short-sighted, etc.

But facts are facts folks - Carlyle is the coach that led a team that was supposed to finish out of the playoffs, well into the playoffs, almost knocking off the vaunted Bruins in fact (save for a 3rd period collapse). He has improved the defensive stats a 100%, while having a very similar group of players that the last coach had.

You might all consider that . . . Carlyle KNOWS WHAT HE IS DOING.

If this was Wilson, with a great pedigree but terrible results . . . I'd be all with you. Mismanaging this or that, etc. But honestly, I look at this as Carlyle knowing where Gardiner needs to improve, and trying to get the most from him. At this pro level . . . it's extremely rare I think that a coach is blinded by his own ego or is too short-sighted to see a talented player for what he is. Gardiner has some defensive deficiencies! And he's young! Carlyle is his coach, it's exactly his JOB to manage him positively into a place where he can be successful, both personally and for the team.

Shop away, I say. No one on the D corps is sacred, IMHO.

I'm a huge Carlyle fan and I'd like to think that he isn't blinded by his ego BUT there is an increasing list of players that he seems to have scapegoated and chased out of where he is. This doesn't include players that lost their roles to others like Grabo and Cmac but to players like Lupul and Ryan who were not used properly because they were in Randy's dog house and couldn't get out.

Maybe it's not even ego exactly, but Randy knows what he wants in a defencemen and it really seems like Gardiner's creativity is not it.
 

TimeZone

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Sep 15, 2008
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am not really keen on trading Gardner at this time.....

But the team that is really stacked with young center prospects is Florida
With Barkov, Huberdeau, Grimaldi, Bjugstad, Shore and even Trocheck.

I would take one of Barkov, Huberdeau, Bjugstad straight across or nearly so.
Grimaldi is too small for my liking.....
would consider Shore or Trocheck in a package of other prospects or futures

Only trouble with this is it is within Leafs own division/ am not sure Fla is looking for a pmDef?

Yuck...
 

DD03

3D
Mar 15, 2010
21,734
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Hey how about:

Johansson or Johansen

It isn't like we haven't see these names before?

Sure neither one is a guaranteed 1st. line center, but Gardiner isn't a guaranteed 1st. pairing defender.

I'll skip on Johansson but I'll take a flyer on Johansen. Just his size alone makes him more valuable to the team down the middle.


Something around Kulikov + a young C from Florida would be interesting.
 

hockeyfanz*

Guest
IF Morgan Reilly stays with the team...one of Gardiner or Franson will be traded. Because neither guy is 5/6 type of D.

Phaneuf-Reilly/Gardiner/Franson
Franson/Gardiner/Reilly- Gunnarsson
Fraser-XXXX

Just a numbers game. The Leafs need a better mix of tough stay at home D and puck moving finesse guys. They also have Liles waiting in the wings who is NOT an AHL defenseman like Finger and Komisarek were.
 

sommervr

Registered User
Feb 25, 2013
1,709
19
Something I noticed is completely lost in this posts.

Nonis and Carlyle want pieces that fit into this team so they can win.

Not whiners that cry about roles, playing time, or accommodating players for their own stats.

We are not interested in building a team for poolies.

So the leafs are "softening the beach" for a potentially unpopular move with Gardiner.
 

hockeyfanz*

Guest
Shop away, I say. No one on the D corps is sacred, IMHO.

Nor should they be. This team is getting better and better. No time to be complacent now. Surplus of D...and short on forward depth/talent. If they could use some of their D and package them with others to land a big front line C....I'm all for it.
 

JackJ

Registered User
Feb 7, 2012
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Nor should they be. This team is getting better and better. No time to be complacent now. Surplus of D...and short on forward depth/talent. If they could use some of their D and package them with others to land a big front line C....I'm all for it.

NHL D, Prospect D + 1st for ??
 

Phion Keneuf

Bang Bang
Jul 4, 2010
35,224
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Why yuck? Bjugstad is a big bodied centre with a lot of potential. Obviously it sounds like another Colborne but he's already showed more two-way ability as well as puck control than Joe has to date.

agree, big fan of Bjugstad
 

Glenn Isildur Healy

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Oct 8, 2013
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I wouldn't trade Gardiner unless we get one of Giroux, Stamkos or Taveras.

Maybe something like:

Gardiner + Reimer + 3rd round pick (2nd round if we win the cup)

for

Giroux
 

ULF_55

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Feb 27, 2002
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I'll skip on Johansson but I'll take a flyer on Johansen. Just his size alone makes him more valuable to the team down the middle.

Something around Kulikov + a young C from Florida would be interesting.

Kulikov has been a top 4 for about 2 years now and as a rookie played almost 18 minutes a night.

He only had 5 shifts the other night, so his average ice time is skewed right now. Injured maybe no looks like he might have been thrown out of a game, 15 minutes in penalties.

I can't see Gardiner being enough to land Kulikov.
 

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