The Evolution of Our Teams

TheDevilMadeMe

Registered User
Aug 28, 2006
52,271
6,980
Brooklyn
Might it be time to bring this thread back, RB?

And I can't believe I remembered who started this thread when I went to search for it. Can't even remember where I leave my keys half the time, but remembered this...
 

ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,902
3,557
Edmonton
Probably, didn't realize the last post was in 2012

I'll post in here and talk about it my teams after the draft ends, just put it in the chat thread since it's current and to spark some discussion during the long wait
 

Dwight

The French Tickler
Jul 8, 2006
8,181
0
West Island
I was just looking for this thread last night! Time for an update.

EDIT: Update my post (on page 2). I also realize that my 3rd line this year is exactly the same as Reen's third line in 2013 when he won (Klukay-Luce-Amonte). Hopefully that helps me out :D
 
Last edited:

King Forsberg

16 21 28 44 68 88 93
Jul 26, 2010
6,192
59
Man I loved my 2014 team. Looking back at it now Id switch Sittler and Crosby and put Primeau on the wing and insert Kopitar as my fourth center. (He was undrafted back then!)

Steve Shutt --- Sidney Crosby --- Jaromir Jagr
Anatoli Firsov --- Darryl Sittler (C) --- Danny Gare (A)
Gilles Tremblay --- Jacques Lemaire --- Bobby Rousseau
Fleming MacKell --- Keith Primeau --- Kevin Dineen
Alexei Yashin, Anze Kopitar

Chris Pronger (A) --- Eric Desjardins
Shea Weber --- Jan Suchy
Frantisek Tikal --- Al Iafrate
Glen Wesley

Bill Durnan
Chris Osgood
 

Sturminator

Love is a duel
Feb 27, 2002
9,894
1,070
West Egg, New York
Yeah, that was a quality team, KF. The scoringlines have a bit of the old "two-stars-and-a-spear-carrier" syndrome with Shutt and Gare looking out of place, and I'm not sure about the chemistry of a Weber - Suchy pairing, but the talent is very solid, top-to-bottom.

Who did you have to coach this group?
 

King Forsberg

16 21 28 44 68 88 93
Jul 26, 2010
6,192
59
Yeah, that was a quality team, KF. The scoringlines have a bit of the old "two-stars-and-a-spear-carrier" syndrome with Shutt and Gare looking out of place, and I'm not sure about the chemistry of a Weber - Suchy pairing, but the talent is very solid, top-to-bottom.

Who did you have to coach this group?

Glen Sather was coach with Larry Robinson as an assistant.
 

ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,902
3,557
Edmonton
28 Team League (6th in the division) - First round 5 games in OT

EdmEskimos.jpg

Edmonton+Eskimos+1922.png


Edmonton Eskimos

Coach : Jacques Lemaire
Assistant coach: Pete Muldoon

Captain - Lanny McDonald
Alt : Adam Foote, Woody Dumart

Woody Dumart --- Stan Mikita --- Cam Neely
Vincent Damphousse --- Peter Stastny --- Lanny McDonald
Harry Watson --- Igor Larionov --- Marian Gaborik
George Mantha --- Pit Lepine --- Jerry Toppazzini

Ex - Glen Skov (C/LW), Billy Boucher (RW)

Bill Quackenbush --- Tim Horton
Si Griffis --- Adam Foote
Hamby Shore --- Gennady Tsygankov

Ex - Wade Redden (D)

Ed Belfour
John Vanbiesbrouck

PP1: Si Griffis - Bill Quackenbush - Peter Stastny - Stan Mikita - Lanny McDonald
PP2: Hamby Shore - Tim Horton - Marian Gaborik - Igor Larionov - Cam Neely

PK1: Bill Quackenbush - Tim Horton - Pit Lepine - Jerry Toppazzini
PK2: Gennady Tsygankov - Adam Foote - Stan Mikita - Woody Dumart



32 Team ATD (5th in a division of 8) - Bounced in first round 7 games OT

wha--lashar73.gif


Coaching Staff : Cecil Hart and Father David Bauer
Captains : Geoffrion, Cashman, Orr
Alternates :

Wayne Cashman (A) --- Peter Forsberg --- Bernie Geoffrion(A)
Vyacheslav Starshinov--- Vladimir Petrov --- Bernie Morris
Pavol Demitra --- Craig Conroy --- Ed Litzenberger
Dave Trottier --- Steve Kasper --- Mike Foligno

Ex. Billy Boucher(RW), Alexei Yashin (C)

Moose Johnson --- Bobby Orr (A)
Ted Green --- "Bullet Joe" Simpson
Dallas Smith --- Don Awrey

Ex. Doug Young (D)

Georges Vezina
Seth Martin

PP1
Vyacheslav Starshinov --- Peter Forsberg --- Bernie Morris
Bobby Orr --- Bernie Geoffrion

PP2
Pavol Demitra --- Vladimir Petrov --- Ed Litzenberger
Ted Green/Bobby Orr --- "Bullet Joe" Simpson

PK1
Steve Kasper --- Dave Trottier
Moose Johnson --- Bobby Orr

PK2
Craig Conroy --- Peter Forsberg/Vladimir Petrov
Don Awrey --- Dallas Smith



26 Team League (2nd in division of 7) - Bounced in second round after a bye in 7 games double OT

colorado-rockies-nhl-profile.jpg


Colorado Rockies

Coaches: Dick Irvin Sr.
Captain: Sid Abel
Alternates: Bill Cook, Slava Fetisov

Toe Blake - Sid Abel (C) - Bill Cook (A)
Roy Conacher - Henrik Sedin - Bryan Hextall Sr
Boris Mayorov - Duke Keats - Vladimir Vikulov
Gilles Tremblay - Ken Mosdell - Blair Russel
Spares- Dennis Hextall, Ryan Walter, Alf Skinner

Slava Fetisov (A) - Alexei Kasatonov
Allan Stanley - Cy Wentworth
Si Griffis - Bert Corbeau
Spares - Albert Leduc

Billy Smith
John Vanbiesbrouck

Powerplay:
PP1: Roy Conacher - Henrik Sedin - Bill Cook - Slava Fetisov - Si Grifis
PP2: Toe Blake - Sid Abel - Bryan Hextall Sr - Bert Corbeau - Alexei Kasatonov

Penalty Kill:
PK1: Ken Mosdell - Gilles Tremblay - Allan Stanley - Alexei Kasatonov
PK2: Blair Russel - Toe Blake - Slava Fetisov - Cy Wentworth


Even though tdmm mentioned it never posted my teams in here, my third team without factoring in draft size is top to bottom the best team I've assembled. Really shows that having a clear vision is important in team building, something overlooked in the previous two iterations. I think if I was a little more prepared when building that third line this team might've been the best in my division. Hopefully can keep the trend going in ATD 2017
 
Last edited:

seventieslord

Student Of The Game
Mar 16, 2006
36,080
7,131
Regina, SK
Your third team better damn well be your best team! In a 24 team draft you'd have to try really hard to ice a worse roster than you did while a noob in your first two drafts.
 

ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,902
3,557
Edmonton
I would very much enjoy watching my Maroons play my Rockies

Yes there are differences in league size but I think the two teams would have an excellent series
 

ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,902
3,557
Edmonton
Adding the Cyclone Taylor saga, my latter two iterations traded a top 10 goalie for a top 2 coach

45.png


Coach: Peter Laviolette
Assistant Coach: Frank Patrick
Captain: Dit Clapper
Alternates: Sylvio Mantha, George Armstrong

Anatoli Firsov --- Cyclone Taylor --- Jarome Iginla
Dean Prentice --- Henri Richard --- Rod Gilbert
Smokey Harris --- Russell Bowie --- George Armstrong (A)
Bob Bourne --- Vladimir Shadrin --- Floyd Curry

Bill Gadsby --- Dit Clapper (C)
Frank Patrick --- Sylvio Mantha (A)
Kevin Lowe --- Yuri Liapkin

Georges Vezina
Chuck Rayner




Edmonton-Oilers-Logo-Font.jpg


Coach: Toe Blake

Patrik Elias (A) --- Cyclone Taylor --- Charlie Conacher
Sweeney Schriner --- Norm Ullman --- Cecil Dillon
Ed Sandford --- Cooney Weiland --- Corey Perry
Tony Leswick--- Derek Sanderson --- Ron Stewart

Ivan Johnson --- Doug Harvey (A)
Ebbie Goodfellow (C) --- Cy Wentworth
Bobby Rowe --- Art Duncan (A)

Hugh Lehman

Hap Holmes


boston-bruins-facebook-cover-timeline-banner-for-fb.jpg


Coach: Toe Blake
Captain: Ted Kennedy
Alternates: Valeri Vasiliev, František Pospíšil

Syd Howe --- Dale Hawerchuk --- Gordie Howe
Paul Kariya --- Ted Kennedy (C) --- Alex Maltsev
George Hay --- Vladimir Petrov --- Odie Cleghorn
John Madden --- David Backes --- Eddie Oatman

Valeri Vasiliev (A) --- Pierre Pilote
Cyclone Taylor --- Sylvio Mantha
František Pospíšil (A)--- Joe Hall

Roy Worters
Billy Smith
 

ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,902
3,557
Edmonton
eadf5204966681fe10ddc574b25d051be363190336c6b0d4d3ca80fa7e7d4215.jpg


Portland Rosebuds
Coaches: Lester & Frank Patrick

Nels Stewart --- Hooley Smith --- Blake Wheeler
Tommy Smith --- Mickey MacKay --- Todd Bertuzzi
Leon Drasaitl --- Bill Thoms --- Joe Pavelski
Don Lever --- Mel Bridgeman --- Pat Flatley

Paul Coffey --- Fern Flaman
Gary Bergman --- Art Duncan
Clem Loughlin --- Brent Seabrook

Terry Sawchuk
John Bouse Hutton

PP1: Coffey - Duncan - T.Smith - Stewart - MacKay
PP2: Loughlin - Pavelski - Bertuzzi - Drasaitl - Wheeler
PK1: Bergman - Flaman - H.Smith - Thoms
PK2: Loughlin - Seabrook - MacKay - Bridgeman


a1a990c42810efa48a1fc4f5ee9dba8fd1f96d916df6a6ac1c75bc29bd6a73ac.jpg

Victoria Cougars

Coach: Jack Adams

Ted Lindsay (C) --- Nicklas Backstrom --- Babe Dye
Alex Delvecchio (A) --- Tommy Dunderdale --- Shane Doan
Ray Whitney --- Ken Mosdell --- Terry O'Reilly
Don Maloney --- Mikko Koivu --- Dmitri Khristich


Ebbie Goodfellow (A) --- Bill White
Lloyd Cook --- Cy Wentworth
Jay Bouwmeester --- Bingo Kampman


Martin Brodeur
Gerry Cheevers

Spares: Art Gagne (RW), Adam Deadmarsh (LW)

PP1: Goodfellow - Cook - Lindsay - Backstrom - Dye
PP2: Bouwmeester - White- Devecchio - Dunderdale - O'Reilly
PK1: Bouwmeester - White - Mosdell - Koivu
PK2: Cook- Wentworth - Delvecchio - Maloney
 

ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,902
3,557
Edmonton
Eight ATD teams, seven years of my life.

Eskimos - The noob team, some notable mistakes like Neely in the top 100
Sharks - Forsberg, Boom Boom, Orr and garbage.
Rockies - Beginning my time as a wheeler and dealer. Moved around the board like crazy to assemble that collection of wingers. Had I grabbed a better goalie probably would've gone further
Maroons - The start of the Cyclone Taylor era. My most successful entry, made it to the conference finals before falling to @BenchBrawl had I had a better coach or slightly better #3D might've been able to sneak through
Oilers - Fell in the semis, just couldn't break through on Lehman. Probably my strongest Taylor team despite the earlier exit
Bruins - Greedyness. That defence is crazy, I think that team got the short end of the stick. Had I committed to the Taylor on D plan earlier I could've gotten a better goalie than Worters and gone a lot further IMO. Edit: Note to past RB, Step 1: Don't take Hawerchuk. Get a more conventional 3C and build an actual checking line. Play Petrov with the Howe's. Step 2: Using that increase in pick value get a better goalie. Keep that bonkers defence. Step 3: Profit
Rosebuds - Let's try something a little unique, might've gotten there if I didn't drop of around the middle for a bit. Just didn't have the time to bring it home
Cougars - See Rosebuds, not shocked they went further. Planned out which of my teams would make a meta team based divisions since we had such a restrictive playoff format. Turns out it paid off since we made it to the conference semis

Edit: 2020 the only year I've gotten a goalie among my first 5 players and I did it twice.
 
Last edited:

TheDevilMadeMe

Registered User
Aug 28, 2006
52,271
6,980
Brooklyn
Eight ATD teams, seven years of my life.

Eskimos - The noob team, some notable mistakes like Neely in the top 100
Sharks - Forsberg, Boom Boom, Orr and garbage.
Rockies - Beginning my time as a wheeler and dealer. Moved around the board like crazy to assemble that collection of wingers. Had I grabbed a better goalie probably would've gone further
Maroons - The start of the Cyclone Taylor era. Tied for my most successful entry, made it to the conference finals before falling to @BenchBrawl had I had a better coach or slightly better #3D might've been able to sneak through
Oilers - Fell in the semis, just couldn't break through on Lehman. Probably my strongest Taylor team despite the earlier exit
Bruins - Greedyness. That defence is crazy, I think that team got the short end of the stick. Had I committed to the Taylor on D plan earlier I could've gotten a better goalie than Worters and gone a lot further IMO. Edit: Note to past RB, Step 1: Don't take Hawerchuk. Get a more conventional 3C. Play Petrov with the Howe's. Step 2: Using that increase in pick value get a better goalie. Keep that bonkers defence. Step 3: Profit
Rosebuds - Let's try something a little unique, might've gotten there if I didn't drop of around the middle for a bit. Just didn't have the time to bring it home
Cougars - See Rosebuds, not shocked they went further. Planned out which of my teams would make a meta team based divisions since we had such a restrictive playoff format. Turns out it paid off since we made it to the conference semis

Your Oilers team got robbed, plain and simple. Probably the biggest robbery I've ever seen in the ATD. Heading into the playoffs, your team was my favorite in the entire draft, something that I don't even have every year. And to not even make the division finals... Not saying that team had to win - rmartin's eventual champion was very good too, definitely a top team that year or any year. But for that team to not even make the division finals was mindboggling to me.

I think your were victim of the fact that GMS were displeased that you picked your starting goalie multiple rounds after the second to last team picked their starter, and ignored the fact that Lehman was just as good as any of the other of the lower tier of starters that year.
 
  • Like
Reactions: rmartin65

ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,902
3,557
Edmonton
Your Oilers team got robbed, plain and simple. Probably the biggest robbery I've ever seen in the ATD. Heading into the playoffs, your team was my favorite in the entire draft, something that I don't even have every year. And to not even make the division finals... Not saying that team had to win - rmartin's eventual champion was very good too, definitely a top team that year or any year. But for that team to not even make the division finals was mindboggling to me.

I think your were victim of the fact that GMS were displeased that you picked your starting goalie multiple rounds after the second to last team picked their starter, and ignored the fact that Lehman was just as good as any of the other of the lower tier of starters that year.

That was very difficult to stomach, because I put all the work into researching Lehman trying to answer all of the questions people had of him and didn't matter. The research hardly moved the needle, I spent all that time trying to help persuade people that just because he was that low on the HOH list that he wasn't garbage. But it seemed like people thought of him as a shooter tutor out there.

Spent all the draft talking to several current and past GMs trying to figure out the best fits reading all the bios I could, and it just didn't seem to matter at all. Hindsight clearly the inflection point for my effort and commitment levels

Edit: Doesn't help that debating isn't my forte in this, so eventually I was just so defeated because my work wasn't getting the job done.

Double Edit: Then when Sturm came in to try and help defend Lehman from some his biggest detractors like people who openly wouldn't vote for me because "I didn't value possibly the most important position" he was shelled for trying to tip the scales
 
Last edited:

TheDevilMadeMe

Registered User
Aug 28, 2006
52,271
6,980
Brooklyn
That was very difficult to stomach, because I put all the work into researching Lehman trying to answer all of the questions people had of him and didn't matter. The research hardly moved the needle, I spent all that time trying to help persuade people that just because he was that low on the HOH list that he wasn't garbage. But it seemed like people thought of him as a shooter tutor out there.

Spent all the draft talking to several current and past GMs trying to figure out the best fits reading all the bios I could, and it just didn't seem to matter at all. Hindsight clearly the inflection point for my effort and commitment levels

Edit: Doesn't help that debating isn't my forte in this, so eventually I was just so defeated because my work wasn't getting the job done.

Double Edit: Then when Sturm came in to try and help defend Lehman from some his biggest detractors like people who openly wouldn't vote for me because "I didn't value possibly the most important position" he was shelled for trying to tip the scales

The curse of Hugh Lehman is real...

May have also been what demoralized Nalyd Psycho, who had been my pick for "next GM in line" after arrbez finally broke through and won.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ResilientBeast

ChiTownPhilly

Not Too Soft
Feb 23, 2010
2,095
1,381
AnyWorld/I'mWelcomeTo
Guess this is as good a place as any for a post-mortem...

OPPF-2020
Cherry Hill Knights of Kní, Regular Season:
#27 Frank Mahovlich- #11 Mark Messier (C)- #12 Jarome Iginla [The Thunder Line]
#9 Paul Kariya- #91 Sergei Fedorov- #10 Pavel Bure [The Lightning Line]
#20 Johnny Bucyk (A)- #21 Brent Sutter- #18 Dave Taylor
#28 Claude Giroux- #17 Frank Fredrickson- #8 Jimmy Ward

#2 Viacheslav Fetisov (A)- #3 Earl Seibert
#4 Bill Gadsby- #88 Brent Burns
#6 František Pospišíl (A)- #72 Teppo Numminen

#29 Ken Dryden
#35 Pekka Rinne


PP-1 Pospišíl, Burns, Mahovlich/Messier, Giroux, Bure
PP-2 Fetisov, Seibert, Kariya/Mahovlich, Fedorov, Iginla

PK-1 Messier, Iginla, Fetisov, Seibert
PK-2 Fedorov, Kariya, Gadsby, Nummine
n


The spine of the team is intact... but there are some liabilities. Brent Sutter on 3rd line in a league of this level is, at the very minimum, a casting-stretch. It might even be worthy of the 'e' word (eyesore). The fault is, of course, mine- thought I could wait longer than I really could afford to. By the opening of the 13th Round, all of Kopitar/Bergeron/Peca were gone and I found myself reactively chasing need- never a good thing in a dozen-player draft.

Heaven help me, I was pretty happy with the way the 2nd line came together. I wasn't entirely surprised to see it brickbatted as soft-ish. What is it about me and fondness for soft-ish, slick 2nd lines?! Maybe it's too many years watching Patrick Kane(?) The vibe I was looking for was like that Russian National Team line, except:

RW Bure>LW Bure
Kariya>>Mogilny
Fedorov=Fedorov

It would be fun on an International ice surface(!) Maybe I should have included Olympic-size rink-dimensions as part of Cherry Hill Arena's Capital Improvements!

The criticism that kind of caught me by surprise was Brent Burns. I would take a while to come to grips with that one.


Preliminary Playoff Round Modifications
#27 Frank Mahovlich- #11 Mark Messier (C)- #12 Jarome Iginla [The Thunder Line]
#9 Paul Kariya- #91 Sergei Fedorov- #10 Pavel Bure [The Lightning Line]
#20 Johnny Bucyk (A)- #21 Brent Sutter*- #18 Dave Taylor
#28 Claude Giroux- #17 Frank Fredrickson*- #8 Jimmy Ward
*Fredrickson will poach occasional shifts on 3rd line, & Sutter will increase PK duties

#2 Viacheslav Fetisov (A)- #3 Earl Seibert
#4 Bill Gadsby/Pospíšil- #88 Brent Burns/Gadsby
#6 František Pospíšil- #72 Teppo Numminen

#29 Ken Dryden
#35 Pekka Rinne


PP-1 Gadsby/Pospíšil, Burns, Mahovlich/Messier, Giroux, Bure
PP-2 Fetisov, Seibert, Kariya/Messier, Fedorov, Iginla

PK-1 Messier, Iginla, Fetisov, Seibert
PK-2 Fedorov/Brent Sutter, Kariya, Pospíšil/Gadsby, Numminen
By this time, I was helped by two key bits of advice:
1) @BenchBrawl helping me realize what a diamond-in-the-rough I had with Fredrickson
2) @Hawkey Town 18 reminding me that Gadsby was a bilateral Defenceman.

In this match-up, I faced Habsfan 18's Houston Aeros- and another team liability was noted- Cherry Hill (for a 12-person draft) just doesn't have that marquee/wow consensus top-20 player you'd expect to find. In reality, though, I think both Messier AND Fetisov are top-20 players (if just barely)- but anyone can see that it's a minority opinion.

Houston was a strong team... and my reading of the tea-leaves suggests Cherry Hill survived a 4-4 vote on tie-break. [Somebody thought the Knights of Kní would win in 6? I guess it was something like that.] Honest truth is- it's a series that absolutely could have gone either way.

Quarter-Final Playoff Round modifications
#27 Frank Mahovlich- #11 Mark Messier (C)- #12 Jarome Iginla [The Thunder Line]
#9 Paul Kariya- #91 Sergei Fedorov- #10 Pavel Bure [The Lightning Line]
#20 Johnny Bucyk (A)- #17 Frank Fredrickson- #18 Dave Taylor
#28 Claude Giroux- #21 Brent Sutter- #8 Jimmy Ward

#2 Viacheslav Fetisov (A)- #3 Earl Seibert
#6 František Pospíšil- #4 Bill Gadsby

Gadsby- #88 Brent Burns will be our 2b/3a pairing, switching off with
Pospíšil- #72 Teppo Numminen

#29 Ken Dryden
#35 Pekka Rinne

PP-1 Burns, Gadsby/Pospíšil, Mahovlich/Messier, Giroux, Bure
PP-2 Seibert, Fetisov, Kariya/Messier, Fedorov, Iginla

PK-1 Brent Sutter, Fedorov, Fetisov, Numminen
PK-2 Messier/Kariya, Iginla, Pospíšil/Gadsby, Seibert

At this point, I'm now all-in on the idea of Fredrickson on the 3rd line, and Pospíšil taking top-4 shifts. I'm still not entirely convinced Brent Burns deserved all the stick he got-- but no-one has to use silver-tongued persuasion to convince me that Pospíšil is worthy of a Top-4 D-role at this level. Also, after further consideration, I'm taking-to-heart @ImporterExporter 's oblique advice about getting some non-top-Units presence on the Penalty-Kill.

The Knights of Kní's run ended with our narrow loss to IE's Maroons. It was a close Vote, but not as close as the previous Round, which was as proximate to a true coin-flip as we're likely to see for a while.

Again- thanks to everyone who helped make the experience enjoyable!
 
Last edited:

ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,902
3,557
Edmonton
Taylor 4: A New Hope

Kachina-1180x598-1bc338ed82.jpg


Coach: Anatoli Tarasov

Busher Jackson --- Cyclone Taylor --- Daniel Alfredsson
Tommy Smith --- Newsy Lalonde (A) --- Mickey MacKay
Gordon Roberts --- Pit Lepine --- Eddie Oatman
Dean Prentice --- David Backes --- Jack Walker

Ebbie Goodfellow (A) --- Dit Clapper (C)
Ken Reardon --- Jack Crawford
Frank Patrick --- Lennart Svedberg

Patrick Roy
Hugh Lehman

Spares: Bruce MacGregor (RW/C), Glen Harmon (D), Patrick Sharp (F)

PP1: Jackson - Lalonde - Smith - Taylor - Goodfellow
PP2: Clapper - MacKay - Roberts - Patrick - Alfredsson

PK1: Lepine - Walker - Reardon - Clapper
PK2: MacKay - Prentice - Goodfellow - Crawford
 

ChiTownPhilly

Not Too Soft
Feb 23, 2010
2,095
1,381
AnyWorld/I'mWelcomeTo
Post-Mortem #2

Philadelphia Phantoms
Home Rink: Philadelphia Spectrum
Coach: Tommy Gorman

#10 Cy Denneny - #6 Frank Nighbor - #7 Hooley Smith
#40 Henrik Zetterberg (A) - #26 Milan Nový - #20 Vaclav Nedomanský
#11 John Madden - #37 Patrice Bergeron (A) - #32 Claude Lemieux
#22 Daniel Sedin - #33 Henrik Sedin - #27 Odie Cleghorn

#5 Denis Potvin (C) - #16 Shea Weber
#4 Alexander Ragulin - #17 Jan Suchý
#46 Mark Giordano- #2 Terry Harper

#1 Bernie Parent
#31 Vladimír Dzurilla

Extras:
#19 Vesvolod Bobrov
#12 Jack Darragh
#25 Yury Lyapkin

PK-1: Madden-Bergeron-Giordano-Weber
PK1a: Nighbor-H. Smith-Potvin-Harper
Spare PKers: Zetterberg, Suchý, Ragulin

PP1: Denneny (Net Front)- Nighbor (Facilitator/Office Manager)- H. Smith (Half-Wall)
Suchý (QB)- Potvin (Trigger)

PP2: C. Lemieux (L Net-Front to Corners)- H. Sedin (Top of Circle to Slot)- D. Sedin (R Net-Front to Top of Circle) >> Weber (L Point)- Nový (R Point)
Spare PPers: Zetterberg, Nedomanský, O. Cleghorn, Giordano

This was my first Main-ATD team... and it was created in-the-wake of an abandoned position, although (as I pointed out before) it was a sound position. I was bequeathed the entire First Unit- so anything that went sideways from there was all on me.

Where I went wrong-
A)
I waited too long to get offense for my second line. I thought I could delay, and watched in amazement as some squads that already had two scoring-line Centers drafted a THIRD scoring-line Center. I was all
personally all right with installing Nový into that role- but personal comfort doesn't translate into successful ATD-salesmanship.
B) Maaaybe I could have waited one more round on Bernie Parent- or (at least) made a play to trade down. That said, I noticed that early on, the more experienced folks were mostly looking to trade down- so it felt like there was an excess-supply of trade-down offers on-the-table.
C) All told, I don't think I did as good a job acquiring talent as I did in the previous draft. I don't feel like I overpaid for chemistry
per se, but it seems clear enough that I guess I value chemistry more-than-most.

Where I went right-
A) I was heartened that I wasn't on the receiving end of one of those "pretty-good-team-for-first-time-in-the-main-ATD" compliments.

B) With my first opportunity to draft extras, I like the way the spares look- for as little as that counts for.
C) I've noted that (surprisingly, to me) I had no "repeats" from my OPPF Team. This is (at least) evidence that I'm not falling into a pattern of picking personal favorites and risking loss-of-value through emotional connections.
D) I liked the balance of the squad. Nobody was going to be in any jeopardy of overuse/overwork.
E) [What I consider to be my biggest improvement] I had a clearer vision of how to put together the Special Teams. Of course, with a defensively-oriented squad, I had limited materials to work with on the Man Advantage. This time, I wasn't shy about asking for advice. For all of the private assistance I received in putting together a passable Power Play- thanks! The Penalty Kill, though- I REALLY like the Penalty Kill. Maybe I should have pimped it more in the match-up phases.

I'm going to look at this a couple more times- and see if I'm gaining traction or spinning wheels.

 
Last edited:

overpass

Registered User
Jun 7, 2007
5,254
2,736
Post-mortem on the ATD 2021 Ottawa Senators.

17. Leonard “Red” Kelly, D/F
32. Mike Bossy, RW
65. Dickie Moore, LW
80. Sergei Fedorov, C
113. Alexei Kasatonov, D
128. Marian Hossa, RW
161. Bill Durnan, G
176. Jonathan Toews, C
209. Sergei Gonchar, D
224. Scotty Bowman, coach
257. Denis Savard, C
272. Igor Larionov, C
301. Bob Goldham, D
320. Sergei Kapustin, LW
353. John Carlson, D
368. Pavol Demitra, RW/LW/C
416. Leo Reise Jr, D
449. Ron Ellis, RW
464. Derek Sanderson, C
492. Percy LeSueur, G
497. Wendel Clark, LW
512. Ivan Hlinka, C
545. Steve Thomas, RW/LW
560. Mattias Ohlund, D

Power Play 1: Moore - Savard - Bossy - Kelly - Gonchar
Power Play 2: Kapustin - Fedorov - Larionov - Kasatonov - Gonchar/Carlson

Penalty Kill 1: Sanderson-Fedorov-Reise-Kasatonov
Penalty Kill 2: Toews-Hossa-Kelly-Goldham
Other PKers: Larionov, Ellis, Carlson

Coach Scotty Bowman will have the option to run out an all-Russian five man unit, designed on the model of the Soviet Green Unit of the 1980s and the Russian Five of the Detroit Red Wings in the mid-90s. Kasatonov played in the Green Unit with Larionov, and Fedorov played in the Russian Five with Larionov.

Kapustin-Fedorov-Larionov
Kasatonov-Gonchar

I had a great time building this team. I felt like I really got to build a balanced team with a consistent style that matches what I would like to see in my team.

I put less priority on drafting new players this time around, so I took a few players that I've drafted before. I had Sergei Kapustin, Sergei Fedorov, Pavol Demitra, and Alexei Kasatonov in ATD 2009. And I drafted Hossa in ATD 2014.

Why did I lose? I drafted for style/fit over value a few times and it probably added up enough to cost me against the best teams. I would say it's the same reason I lost in the final in ATD2011.

I also would have liked to draft a few more pre-WWII players, and I was pretty close a few times. I would have taken Nighbor at 32 if he didn't go at 31, for one. I just ended up seeing the best value and fit more often with more modern players. And when I chose to go with the Russian unit that meant a certain percentage of my team was going to be more recent.

Notes on a few picks.
  • No regrets on taking Kelly at 17.
  • Mike Bossy at 32 over Cook and Makarov probably raised a few eyebrows. I'd become higher on Bossy in the past year, especially his ability to maintain his scoring against the best competition and his ability to fit with other top players without taking anything off the table. I felt like he was underrated and wanted to boost him a bit.
  • Interesting to look back and see that I ended up going with the Russian Five but passed up Fetisov at 17 and Makarov at 32. I don't regret either of those picks, I liked my Moore-Bossy combo with Kelly at the back, and I like the ability to have the Russian Five be a second line instead of a first line.
  • I like Dickie Moore at 65 as well, I think he's like Bossy in that he also scales really well with other good players and doesn't take anything off the table.
  • I was always thinking of Fedorov as a second liner when I picked him, and I was going to pick my first line centre later, but I was still keeping a lot of options on the table.
  • Kasatonov ended up being a key pick for my Russian Five, but I probably would have picked J.C. Tremblay if Leaf Lander hadn't picked him right before me. Obviously in that case I wouldn't have been able to pick Gonchar later.
  • Toews-Hossa on a third line is one of the ATD builds I've had in mind for some time and I pulled the trigger here. It's a bit earlier than they went before, maybe a case where I left some value on the table, but I think they were an absolute monster together IRL and worth the picks.
  • I never know what to do with goalies. In this case I just grabbed Durnan during a run on goalies. I do like the fact that he got some buzz as best goalie in history when he played. Not so much the playoff record, although it seems a bit unfair to boil his whole career down to a handful of games. In hindsight, maybe I should have picked the other player I was considering at this point -- Vladimir Krutov, who went to nabby12 with the very next pick. Krutov instead of Kapustin on that second line would have been sick. In that case I would have taken Hugh Lehman or Roberto Luongo as a low end starter later in the draft. This is probably my biggest regret.
  • The Sergei Gonchar pick is what really set the course for the rest of my team. I was also considering taking a top defensive partner for Kelly, but at this point I decided "I'm going to take Gonchar at 209, Bowman at 224, a #1 C at #257, Larionov at #272 and do a Russian Five." And it played out just how I had planned.
  • Unfortunately I got scooped on Bob Goldham as a partner for Kelly, and my backup plan Cy Wentworth, so I had to trade some value for Goldham.
  • I had John Tonelli and Gary Roberts in mind at #368 for the LW of Toews and Hossa, with the goal of making that a really hard physical line in addition to the EV scoring and two way play. Unfortunately they both went in the previous 10 picks, so I went with Demitra, doubling down on the EV scoring but leaving me without a physical line in my top 3 lines.
 

ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,902
3,557
Edmonton
The final of my love affair with Cyclone Taylor

vm6.gif


Coach: Lester Patrick

Syd Howe --- Phil Esposito --- Hooley Smith (A)
Gordon Roberts --- Connor McDavid --- Nikita Kucherov
Fred Harris --- Patrice Bergeron --- Mickey MacKay
Ilya Kovalchuk --- Igor Larionov --- Eddie Oatman

Eddie Gerard (C) - Bobby Orr
Cyclone Taylor - Valeri Vasiliev (A)
Mike Grant - Cy Wentworth


Vladislav Tretiak
Andrei Vasilevskiy

Spares: Frank Patrick, D ; Tommy Smith, LW/C ; Mark Stone, RW

PP1: McDavid --- Esposito --- Kucherov --- Taylor --- Orr
PP2: Howe --- MacKay --- Roberts --- Kovalchuk --- Orr/Taylor
PK1: Smith --- Bergeron --- Gerard --- Orr
PK2: MacKay --- Howe --- Vasiliev --- Wentworth
 

ChiTownPhilly

Not Too Soft
Feb 23, 2010
2,095
1,381
AnyWorld/I'mWelcomeTo
Post-mortem on the ATD 2021 Ottawa Senators.

17. Leonard “Red” Kelly, D/F
32. Mike Bossy, RW
65. Dickie Moore, LW
80. Sergei Fedorov, C
113. Alexei Kasatonov, D
128. Marian Hossa, RW
161. Bill Durnan, G
176. Jonathan Toews, C
209. Sergei Gonchar, D
224. Scotty Bowman, coach
257. Denis Savard, C
272. Igor Larionov, C
301. Bob Goldham, D
320. Sergei Kapustin, LW
353. John Carlson, D
368. Pavol Demitra, RW/LW/C
416. Leo Reise Jr, D
449. Ron Ellis, RW
464. Derek Sanderson, C
492. Percy LeSueur, G
497. Wendel Clark, LW
512. Ivan Hlinka, C
545. Steve Thomas, RW/LW
560. Mattias Ohlund, D
Power Play 1: Moore - Savard - Bossy - Kelly - Gonchar
Power Play 2: Kapustin - Fedorov - Larionov - Kasatonov - Gonchar/Carlson

Penalty Kill 1: Sanderson-Fedorov-Reise-Kasatonov
Penalty Kill 2: Toews-Hossa-Kelly-Goldham
Other PKers: Larionov, Ellis, Carlson

Coach Scotty Bowman will have the option to run out an all-Russian five man unit, designed on the model of the Soviet Green Unit of the 1980s and the Russian Five of the Detroit Red Wings in the mid-90s. Kasatonov played in the Green Unit with Larionov, and Fedorov played in the Russian Five with Larionov.

Kapustin-Fedorov-Larionov
Kasatonov-Gonchar

I had a great time building this team. I felt like I really got to build a balanced team with a consistent style that matches what I would like to see in my team.

I put less priority on drafting new players this time around, so I took a few players that I've drafted before. I had Sergei Kapustin, Sergei Fedorov, Pavol Demitra, and Alexei Kasatonov in ATD 2009. And I drafted Hossa in ATD 2014.

Why did I lose? I drafted for style/fit over value a few times and it probably added up enough to cost me against the best teams. I would say it's the same reason I lost in the final in ATD2011.

I also would have liked to draft a few more pre-WWII players, and I was pretty close a few times. I would have taken Nighbor at 32 if he didn't go at 31, for one. I just ended up seeing the best value and fit more often with more modern players. And when I chose to go with the Russian unit that meant a certain percentage of my team was going to be more recent.

Notes on a few picks.
  • No regrets on taking Kelly at 17.
  • Mike Bossy at 32 over Cook and Makarov probably raised a few eyebrows. I'd become higher on Bossy in the past year, especially his ability to maintain his scoring against the best competition and his ability to fit with other top players without taking anything off the table. I felt like he was underrated and wanted to boost him a bit.
  • Interesting to look back and see that I ended up going with the Russian Five but passed up Fetisov at 17 and Makarov at 32. I don't regret either of those picks, I liked my Moore-Bossy combo with Kelly at the back, and I like the ability to have the Russian Five be a second line instead of a first line.
  • I like Dickie Moore at 65 as well, I think he's like Bossy in that he also scales really well with other good players and doesn't take anything off the table.
  • I was always thinking of Fedorov as a second liner when I picked him, and I was going to pick my first line centre later, but I was still keeping a lot of options on the table.
  • Kasatonov ended up being a key pick for my Russian Five, but I probably would have picked J.C. Tremblay if Leaf Lander hadn't picked him right before me. Obviously in that case I wouldn't have been able to pick Gonchar later.
  • Toews-Hossa on a third line is one of the ATD builds I've had in mind for some time and I pulled the trigger here. It's a bit earlier than they went before, maybe a case where I left some value on the table, but I think they were an absolute monster together IRL and worth the picks.
  • I never know what to do with goalies. In this case I just grabbed Durnan during a run on goalies. I do like the fact that he got some buzz as best goalie in history when he played. Not so much the playoff record, although it seems a bit unfair to boil his whole career down to a handful of games. In hindsight, maybe I should have picked the other player I was considering at this point -- Vladimir Krutov, who went to nabby12 with the very next pick. Krutov instead of Kapustin on that second line would have been sick. In that case I would have taken Hugh Lehman or Roberto Luongo as a low end starter later in the draft. This is probably my biggest regret.
  • The Sergei Gonchar pick is what really set the course for the rest of my team. I was also considering taking a top defensive partner for Kelly, but at this point I decided "I'm going to take Gonchar at 209, Bowman at 224, a #1 C at #257, Larionov at #272 and do a Russian Five." And it played out just how I had planned.
  • Unfortunately I got scooped on Bob Goldham as a partner for Kelly, and my backup plan Cy Wentworth, so I had to trade some value for Goldham.
  • I had John Tonelli and Gary Roberts in mind at #368 for the LW of Toews and Hossa, with the goal of making that a really hard physical line in addition to the EV scoring and two way play. Unfortunately they both went in the previous 10 picks, so I went with Demitra, doubling down on the EV scoring but leaving me without a physical line in my top 3 lines.
I think these things get posted in the hope of getting some feedback. I'm super, super tardy with this... but better late than never. Here are some nutshell thoughts about the draft and team set-up:

Bossy over Cook bypasses the "ATD 'grit-and-toughness' dividend" that has redounded through-the-years. I liked how you leaned into the 'Bossy's a capable independent actor' argument.
Sergei Fedorov @ 80- I love 'im... but a lot of people don't. There's always a risk element to drafting someone who divides opinions so sharply. Sometimes, I think it just comes down to the Voting Panel.
Prime Kasatonov has puck-control abilities. Maybe a case of finally getting respect he deserves.
Durnan felt a little "reach-y" [This comes from the guy who picked Parent too soon.] I find Goalies hard to work out in this format, too. I can present statistical exhibit after statistical exhibit showing they don't matter as much as people think- and it's just so many seeds on barren ground.
Toews is another opinion-splitter. Loved mating him with Hossa- but there are people (including at least one previous Champion) who just completely dismiss real-life chemistry. Don't understand it, but it happens.

Curious about the placing of Larionov at RW. Seems like Larionov/C Fedorov/RW is more credible... but then, that seems like a bit of a waste of Fedorov.

I'll hang up and listen.
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->