The English Lower League thread (Part 2)

[Savant]

 

[S E P H]

It's disgusting that Norwich qualified, there so many other teams who deserve a chance for promotion in the EFL before this nonsense elevator club. This entire year has been a dud; Norwich already promoted, Watford having a good chance, and Swansea/Bournemouth also getting a respectable chance. Give me Barnsley or Brentford please.

 

[Savant]

It's disgusting that Norwich qualified, there so many other teams who deserve a chance for promotion in the EFL before this nonsense elevator club. This entire year has been a dud; Norwich already promoted, Watford having a good chance, and Swansea/Bournemouth also getting a respectable chance. Give me Barnsley or Brentford please.

Norwich is funny because every year they try to win the Championship. Even when they went in the Championship. And I for one will always welcome their yellow kits

 

[S E P H]

Norwich is funny because every year they try to win the Championship. Even when they went in the Championship. And I for one will always welcome their yellow kits

Nah, a club that gets promoted to just then get demoted is why I dislike their existence as a football club. Now I understand the probability of all teams eventually getting to stay in the EPL next seasons' are historically low, but just look at some of the success stories of Newcastle, Leeds, Steelers (before this season), Burnley, Brighton, Wolves, and even LC (though I admit that's pushing it). Norwich is the same reason why I dislike Fulham, elevator club taking the funds/resources against teams who deserve a chance to play with the top dogs.

 

[Savant]

Nah, a club that gets promoted to just then get demoted is why I dislike their existence as a football club. Now I understand the probability of all teams eventually getting to stay in the EPL next seasons' are historically low, but just look at some of the success stories of Newcastle, Leeds, Steelers (before this season), Burnley, Brighton, Wolves, and even LC (though I admit that's pushing it). Norwich is the same reason why I dislike Fulham, elevator club taking the funds/resources against teams who deserve a chance to play with the top dogs.

The low probability of staying up (as you’ve acknowledged) leaves me caring very little about who deserves it or doesn’t.

 

[HoseEmDown]

I don't have a problem with Norwich going back up I just don't like that they didn't spend last time so not sure if they will again. They spent more money this season after being relegated than they did the season before when they got promoted. They still have a few decent young pieces to work with, they need better CB's and a striker to not be worse than last time.

Was really hoping Brentford would get the 2nd automatic promotion spot but Watford went on an insane run, not including the loss today, while Brentford got cold down the stretch again. If Brentford would have won today it could've made the run in interesting but I think the gap is too big even with Brentford having a game in hand. Watford has a tough finish but Norwich is promoted so will be partying all week and may not be ready next week, Millwall has nothing to play for, so it could be settled before they play Brentford and Swansea the last two. If Brentford would have today and beat Rotherham in their game in the hand that head to head would've been insane.

 

[spintheblackcircle]

If Brentford can win today and Watford lose to Norwich, they can still get 2nd. They would be 5 points back with a game in hand and they still play Watford.

 

[Chimaera]

I will never complain about Norwich coming up.

They actually attempt to play football instead of bunkering and holding on. They won't have the talent to stick, but they get every drop out of what they have to get there.

 

[These Are The Days]

Derby better get their shit together or they're going down

 

[GabeTravels]

Can we just end the season now?

Despite being only a point out of the playoffs, I don't see any realistic way Pompey get back into the Top 6. Horrible play.

...I am thrilled for AFC Wimbledon's recent form though...looks like they could escape relegation yet again.

 

[HajdukSplit]

Watford one win away from promotion, they have done well since the arrival of Munoz (currently 12 wins out of 15) but knowing Watford he is always 1-2 bad results away from the sack; playoffs look largely set, only question is probably down to Barnsley/Reading for 6th place. At the bottom half, Wycombe is about down, Wednesday in bad shape, realistically probably down to Rotherham and Derby for the final spot with Derby having a four point edge but Rotherham have three games in hand and a better GD

In League One, Hull and Peterborough should achieve automatic promotion; very tight race for the playoff spots

In League Two, Southend in danger of back to back relegations out of the football league

 

[BMann]

I don't have a problem with Norwich going back up I just don't like that they didn't spend last time so not sure if they will again. They spent more money this season after being relegated than they did the season before when they got promoted. They still have a few decent young pieces to work with, they need better CB's and a striker to not be worse than last time.

Was really hoping Brentford would get the 2nd automatic promotion spot but Watford went on an insane run, not including the loss today, while Brentford got cold down the stretch again. If Brentford would have won today it could've made the run in interesting but I think the gap is too big even with Brentford having a game in hand. Watford has a tough finish but Norwich is promoted so will be partying all week and may not be ready next week, Millwall has nothing to play for, so it could be settled before they play Brentford and Swansea the last two. If Brentford would have today and beat Rotherham in their game in the hand that head to head would've been insane.

Why should they spend if it risks the clubs future ? Should they spend wildly without a rich sugar daddy or nation state behind them and then suffer the consequences afterwards of players on long contracts and exorbitant salaries.

They are improving their facilities, their youth teams are very decent and they have great links in the city. I get sick and tired of hearing about the same elitism we have seen paraded by the creators of the ESL casually tossed out here.

Every club that comes up wants to survive and live off the gravy train especially in these financially parlous times where many clubs in the English pyramid are struggling badly because most rely on gate receipts and hospitality on match days. But is it also pertinent that many that have spent big and failed are still living with the consequences. The problem is of financial structure. There is too much of a gap between the PL and Championship and indeed between the Championship and League One.

This season has been unusual because of the pandemic which affected Championship clubs and benefited those teams relegated from the PL including my own. It is more than a remote possibility all three relegated sides will be promoted.

It is also tiresome to hear fans of the big six moan about how teams at the bottom end of the PL come to their grounds to try and defend. They forget the salient point that has been made in recent days that this is still a sport not an entertainment business for fans who have never even set foot inside a stadium here. Or the huge disparity in spending between the big six and the rest. If teams did attack they would get even more of a drubbing and would still get criticized for being naive. Teams like Leeds and Bielsa are a very rare exception.

The whole nature of competitiveness within the top division has changed markedly since the advent of the PL. Once upon a time teams could come up and compete. In some cases as with Clough win the title or as with Graham Taylor finish second. Those times are long gone thanks to the financial muscle of the so called big six.

Whoever comes up will come on merit although parachute payments do help and more so this season in these straitened times for most sides in the Championship.

 

[BMann]

Watford one win away from promotion, they have done well since the arrival of Munoz (currently 12 wins out of 15) but knowing Watford he is always 1-2 bad results away from the sack; playoffs look largely set, only question is probably down to Barnsley/Reading for 6th place. At the bottom half, Wycombe is about down, Wednesday in bad shape, realistically probably down to Rotherham and Derby for the final spot with Derby having a four point edge but Rotherham have three games in hand and a better GD

In League One, Hull and Peterborough should achieve automatic promotion; very tight race for the playoff spots

In League Two, Southend in danger of back to back relegations out of the football league

And Sutton United yet another London club could replace them. They have a game or two in hand on leaders Hartlepool. Stockport County after a long absence from the formerly professional divisions are also in the mix regarding the playoffs.

 

[robertmac43]

Don't think they will win the play-off, however, I'm fully behind Barnsley getting promoted this season.

 

[HoseEmDown]

Why should they spend if it risks the clubs future ? Should they spend wildly without a rich sugar daddy or nation state behind them and then suffer the consequences afterwards of players on long contracts and exorbitant salaries.

They are improving their facilities, their youth teams are very decent and they have great links in the city. I get sick and tired of hearing about the same elitism we have seen paraded by the creators of the ESL casually tossed out here.

Every club that comes up wants to survive and live off the gravy train especially in these financially parlous times where many clubs in the English pyramid are struggling badly because most rely on gate receipts and hospitality on match days. But is it also pertinent that many that have spent big and failed are still living with the consequences. The problem is of financial structure. There is too much of a gap between the PL and Championship and indeed between the Championship and League One.

This season has been unusual because of the pandemic which affected Championship clubs and benefited those teams relegated from the PL including my own. It is more than a remote possibility all three relegated sides will be promoted.

It is also tiresome to hear fans of the big six moan about how teams at the bottom end of the PL come to their grounds to try and defend. They forget the salient point that has been made in recent days that this is still a sport not an entertainment business for fans who have never even set foot inside a stadium here. Or the huge disparity in spending between the big six and the rest. If teams did attack they would get even more of a drubbing and would still get criticized for being naive. Teams like Leeds and Bielsa are a very rare exception.

The whole nature of competitiveness within the top division has changed markedly since the advent of the PL. Once upon a time teams could come up and compete. In some cases as with Clough win the title or as with Graham Taylor finish second. Those times are long gone thanks to the financial muscle of the so called big six.

Whoever comes up will come on merit although parachute payments do help and more so this season in these straitened times for most sides in the Championship.

Where did I save they have to spend exorbitantly? In the last 5 seasons they've had one season with a negative net income with transfers and that was 7M. They've made 96M in those past 5 seasons. 5 seasons ago they were just relegated so they were getting parachute payments and they were relegated again in the past 5 years.

They don't need to throw big money at players or offer big wages but they should at least try to add some more talent. Teemu Pukki leading your line is not a recipe for success at the top level. Selling Ben Godfrey and replacing him with Ben Gibson isn't going to cut it. They have a good youth set up and youth scouting but you can't rely on youth alone in the premier league. They need a Craig Dawson type who they can get on loan to give them a solid presence on the backline and someone up top to give them a few goals and hold up play to kill off games late. If they don't invest some they're going to just go back down.

 

[HajdukSplit]

CHAMPIONSHIP
- Watford promoted (Norwich already promoted but need one more win to secure the league title)
- Playoffs teams are all but known, Reading playing Swansea tomorrow and if Reading fail to win there will be no more chances for them, only things to play for is placement
- Wycombe all but relegated, their GD is too poor even if they win the final two matches; Derby failed to beat Birmingham at home and are still involved in the relegation fight; its essentially down to Derby/Rotherham for the final relegation spot, Wednesday in a tough spot. Theoretically Huddersfield could still go down but unlikely

21. Derby 43
22. Rotherham 39 (two games in hand)
23. Sheffield Wed 39

Derby go to Swansea next week and host Wednesday on the final day
Rotherham have four games left: Brentford (A), Blackburn (H), Luton (A), Cardiff (H)
Wednesday host Forest and then go to Derby, must win both matches to have any hope

LEAGUE 1
- Hull City promoted; Peterborough very close, only need one point from final three matches
- Bristol Rovers and Swindon relegated

 

[BMann]

Where did I save they have to spend exorbitantly? In the last 5 seasons they've had one season with a negative net income with transfers and that was 7M. They've made 96M in those past 5 seasons. 5 seasons ago they were just relegated so they were getting parachute payments and they were relegated again in the past 5 years.

They don't need to throw big money at players or offer big wages but they should at least try to add some more talent. Teemu Pukki leading your line is not a recipe for success at the top level. Selling Ben Godfrey and replacing him with Ben Gibson isn't going to cut it. They have a good youth set up and youth scouting but you can't rely on youth alone in the premier league. They need a Craig Dawson type who they can get on loan to give them a solid presence on the backline and someone up top to give them a few goals and hold up play to kill off games late. If they don't invest some they're going to just go back down.

Exorbitantly for a club like Norwich would be fifty million pounds. Something one of the big six might just spend on a single player. As I said the owners are responsible and have said they are guardians for whoever comes next. Norwich experienced a financial meltdown the previous time before last when they were relegated that threatened the clubs future when they spent in terms of their income far more than they could afford.

There are bargains and the occasional find or great coach that could help survival but for the most part a lot of potential signings are simply out of their price bracket in terms of transfer fee or wages or simply do not want to come to a side they think lacks glamour. My team Watford are in the same boat although we have had a link with Udinese and a tremendous scouting network that helped in our recent stint in the PL along with a comprehensive network of contacts that the Pozzo family use.

Don't forget both clubs will also need to make up a financial shortfall from this pandemic affected season which will also limit spending.

 

[BMann]

CHAMPIONSHIP
- Watford promoted (Norwich already promoted but need one more win to secure the league title)
- Playoffs teams are all but known, Reading playing Swansea tomorrow and if Reading fail to win there will be no more chances for them, only things to play for is placement
- Wycombe all but relegated, their GD is too poor even if they win the final two matches; Derby failed to beat Birmingham at home and are still involved in the relegation fight; its essentially down to Derby/Rotherham for the final relegation spot, Wednesday in a tough spot. Theoretically Huddersfield could still go down but unlikely

21. Derby 43
22. Rotherham 39 (two games in hand)
23. Sheffield Wed 39

Derby go to Swansea next week and host Wednesday on the final day
Rotherham have four games left: Brentford (A), Blackburn (H), Luton (A), Cardiff (H)
Wednesday host Forest and then go to Derby, must win both matches to have any hope

LEAGUE 1
- Hull City promoted; Peterborough very close, only need one point from final three matches
- Bristol Rovers and Swindon relegated

​

 

[SSF]

Delia Smith would love to splurge and guarantee PL survival I am sure, but there is no amount of money that guarantees that. If she wants to spend 5 million this transfer season, who cares? Her biggest battle will be replacing Buendia, Cantwell, and Aarons; not breaking the club record transfer fee.

 

[HajdukSplit]

Reading failed to beat Swansea so the playoff teams are known, though they are currently separated by one point so we don't know yet their placement (Brentford have a game in hand)

3. Brentford 78 (Rotherham H; Watford H; Bristol A)
4. Bournemouth 77 (Wycombe A; Stoke H)
5. Swansea 77 (Derby H; Watford A)
6. Barnsley 77 (Preston A; Norwich H)

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

Rooting for Brentford and Swansea

 

[SSF]

Brentford won, Rotherham still in serious trouble.

Grimsby lost and are gone from the EFL for at least a year.

 

[GabeTravels]

An absolutely wild Portsmouth / Accrington game today.

Pompey went down 2-0 at the half, likely ending any chance of finishing Top 6.

They battled back to a 2-2 draw early in the second half, and seemingly get a winner in the 92nd... Before giving up the equalizer in the 95th on an own goal.

Still have a chance at 6th, but they'll need to win their last two and get a bit of help.

AFC Wimbledon likely safe, but can guarantee it with one point in their last 2.

 

[al secord]

Hoping Brentford can do it this year. Not just because i have money on them to do so. I really love their manager. They took a hit with Ollie Watkins and Benrahma, but still have managed to put together a good promotion run.

 

[SSF]

Byeeeeee Wednesday, enjoy League 1 next year

Edit: actually jumped the gun on this one, they still have a chance