The End of "Hockey Night in Canada"?

discostu

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I assumed it to mean that the $35M is profit, with $100M being the net.

That's the most likely explanation, but, it's clearly not what is stated. If it's incorrect, it's bad reporting, and, makes any number in the article difficult to really believe. Bad reporting.

Does this mean Bell Globemedia is overbidding by $40M?

Or, will the private broadcaster do a better job of selling commercial time?

Hopefully this doesn't mean an increase in commercials.

If we assume the numbers in the article are true, it doesn't mean that Bell is overbidding. It means that they think they can generate more net revenue than CBC is. They think they can make money on this deal, otherwise, they wouldn't do it.

They likely think they can sell more ads, by getting more viewers, and charging their advertisers more money for those ads. They also likely believe they can do it at a cheaper cost. CBC is notorious for having higher production cost than its private counterparts.
 

Snap Wilson

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I enjoy many of their documentaries as well, but, as an American, you get the luxury of not seeing any of your tax dollars go to creating it.

It's one thing to be supportive of the programming they offer, it's another if you're willing to foot the bill.

We foot the bill for these projects in the U.S.

Federal oney goes towards the National Endowment for the Arts, to National Public Radio, to the Public Broadcasting System. I won't get into whether or not they should (wrong forum) but I do support it above and beyond my tax money.
 

no13matssundin

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I, too, am looking forward to CBC losing HNIC. CTV should do a much better job... picture TSN running HNIC and we should be getting a pretty sweet broadcast... plus, no CBC to deal with.
 

17*

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I am not convinced that TSN or CTV will do any better.

Furthermore, many of the personalities we are used to seeing on CBC will probably end up getting jobs at the new station, should the change occur.
 

Alain Racette

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I think the only thing that would be hard to stomach is the fact that HNIC on CBC has been a tradition for over half century. In my opinion, I don't see the problem in it switching to another network like CTV/TSN. In the past few seasons, TSN has been, BY FAR, superior in its hockey broadcasting. They have the right minds,personalities, approach and so on. Meanwhile, CBC has lagged badly.

Is it time for a change? I for one would like to see the move happen. Any word if the theme song will be kept?
 

Dolemite

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I don't know what the big deal is about. CBC stopped showing Hockey night in Canada well over 10 years ago and put Hockey Night in Toronto in it's place.
 

Egil

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I think the $140 mil bid needs to be compared to the 2 current contracts (TSN and CBC). I have no idea how much TSN currently pays, but it is a considerable amount as well.
 

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WHAT WILL EVER HAPPEN TO DON CHERRY???!!!
Please someone, get him a job at Leafs TV or NESN so I don't have to look at him anymore during a Habs game and talking about the Leafs or Bruins.
 

Darth Bangkok

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BTW, did anyone catch this tidbit in the article:



Unless the author isn't familiar at all with basic accounting terms, and is confusing profit and revenue, this article is saying that HNIC is a money loser for the crown corp, with a loss of $35M.

I have doubts if that is true, which indicates a poorly researched article, and a reason why hockey writers shouldn't venture into the realm of others news, like this guy has. If it is true, then it's further evidence that the NHL should be off CBC. Canadians shouldn't be subsidizing a broadcast of the NHL, when there are plenty of private broadcasters who are willing to do it, and make money on it.

As for the future of the CBC, the fact that their future is in jeopardy over the loss of the NHL is an indication that they haven't done a good job with their objectives. I do like their news programming myself, but, to survive as a broadcaster, they need other programming.

I always compare the CBC with the BBC. The BBC is able to produce a large number of successful shows with its budget. The CBC has virtually no success rate. In fact, the private broadcasters have a better success rates. Right now, the two most successful scripted Canadian shows are Trailer Park Boys (Showcase) and Corner Gas (CTV). I can't think of one successful scripted show the CBC has on the air right now.

They've done okay in the past (SCTV, Kids in the Hall, Red Green) but have never more than one or two successful shows on the air at a given time. With other private networks producing Canadian content, CBC is quickly becoming a dinosaur. If they can't make a case to stay on the air without NHL hockey, then, they simply don't deserve to be on the air.

I think the point about this is that its not supposed to make money. The money needed comes from tax revenues. Its like a public transit system, its always subsidized. So the fact that it only "loses" (which really means requires financing of) $35m is a good thing.

IF HNIC goes to CTV and is free now, don;t expect it to last long. Big Business never equals good things for people who care about the issues. The only people who won't notice or won't care are casual fans. The rest of us will get alienated and pissed off somehow before too long. I can definitely this changing the face of hockey over the next 5-10 years. Big business controlling things in the US, where the hockey market is so small, has had bad affects on the NHL already - schedules, game times, kowtowing to NBC, etc.. Imagine what will happen when Big Business gets involved in a place where people care about hockey. I can't imagine any scenario that will be good.
 

iamcaper

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Wow, this thread took off. hehe

Currently the CBC annually pays approximately $65 million for the NHL rights. It is reported that on a good year the CBC profits by about $30 million from the NHL broadcasts.

Bell Globemedia, owners of CTV and TSN, are looking at offering $140million per year over a 10 year period to gain exclusive Canadian broadcast rights to NHL games. This would include Saturday night games.

BGM is bidding for both the English and French rights and would effectively cut off CBC and Radio-Canada from hockey broadcasts entirely. They are also seeking cable rights and internet streaming rights.

If they win the rights CTV would carry the Saturday night double headers during the regular season and TSN would have a full schedule of NHL games. Additionally they intend to air games on TSN2 pending CRTC approval of the launch of that seperate sports service.

The bulk of postseason games would air on TSN and TSN2, essentially ending the availability of OTA NHL broadcasts for sports fans. Since CTV does not have the OTA reach of CBC it would mean hockey fans would have little choice but to turn to cable and satellite services for their hockey fix.
 

discostu

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I think the point about this is that its not supposed to make money. The money needed comes from tax revenues. Its like a public transit system, its always subsidized. So the fact that it only "loses" (which really means requires financing of) $35m is a good thing.

IF HNIC goes to CTV and is free now, don;t expect it to last long. Big Business never equals good things for people who care about the issues. The only people who won't notice or won't care are casual fans. The rest of us will get alienated and pissed off somehow before too long. I can definitely this changing the face of hockey over the next 5-10 years. Big business controlling things in the US, where the hockey market is so small, has had bad affects on the NHL already - schedules, game times, kowtowing to NBC, etc.. Imagine what will happen when Big Business gets involved in a place where people care about hockey. I can't imagine any scenario that will be good.

Unless the television industry completely changes, HNIC would remain free. It'll stay wiht the same model it always has, put it on a high viewer network, and charge big money for ads.

CBC has run their hockey coverage the same way that a business would, which is why people are saying they should get out of the business. They charge ads for their programming, like any television network, and for your complaining about corporate interference on the game, CBC has a massive level of influence over the schedule of the NHL.

CBC doesn't want to lose hockey, not because they're worried about it being in the hands of greedy corporations, they want it, because they want to make money on it. If CTV thinks it can make more money off it than CBC can, by running a more efficient broadcast, and getting more ad dollars through higher viewership, then, they should win the broadcasting rights.
 

iamcaper

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I think the $140 mil bid needs to be compared to the 2 current contracts (TSN and CBC). I have no idea how much TSN currently pays, but it is a considerable amount as well.

TSN's cable deal is worth about $15-million. And CTV-owned RDS's Montreal Canadiens' French-language agreement is for about $12-million.

If the CBC is paying $65-million and make about $30-million in a good year, that amounts to $95-million. If Bell Globemedia is considering offering $140-million per year, they'll have to make up at least $45-million to cover the rights to air.
 

iamcaper

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I, too, am looking forward to CBC losing HNIC. CTV should do a much better job... picture TSN running HNIC and we should be getting a pretty sweet broadcast... plus, no CBC to deal with.

CBC owns the rights to HNIC so that show, as it is now, will die.

The CBC may still keep the rights. After all, Hockey Night has been on the network since 1952. The NHL, I hope, would be reluctant to end the viewing tradition.

If the league did re-sign with CBC, it would likely reward Bell Globemedia by improving TSN's deal. It could give the cable channel more regular-season Canadian content and also a share of postseason series involving Canadian teams. Right now, the CBC has full ownership of the Canadian playoff games.

The CBC's current deal with the NHL probably includes a right of first negotiation. That means the CBC would have a window in which it could cut a new deal without facing a competing bid.
 

discostu

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CBC owns the rights to HNIC so that show, as it is now, will die.

The CBC may still keep the rights. After all, Hockey Night has been on the network since 1952. The NHL, I hope, would be reluctant to end the viewing tradition.

What will be interesting, is if TSN asks to purchase the rights to the name, HNIC. If CBC is pushed out of the sports arena, they'll no longer have any use for it. Any money they do get from it, is less money that they need from tax payers. By giving the name, they continue the HNIC tradition, which would be their biggest arguement for keeping it on their network.
 

17*

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As an aside, what would happen if a network went to a PPV format for Saturday Night games, and eliminated all the commercials.

According to the Globe and Mail, the last HNIC Leafs game had over 1 million viewers.

If you charged everyone a dollar, you would make a million dollars per Saturday Night Leaf game.

But, you wouldn't charge 1 dollar.

If you charged $5, make $5M, $10, make $10M etc. etc. all for 1 game.

How much would people be willing to spend for their Saturday Night fix?

Especially with no commercials, the game would be better to watch.
 

iamcaper

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As an aside, what would happen if a network went to a PPV format for Saturday Night games, and eliminated all the commercials.

According to the Globe and Mail, the last HNIC Leafs game had over 1 million viewers.

If you charged everyone a dollar, you would make a million dollars per Saturday Night Leaf game.

But, you wouldn't charge 1 dollar.

If you charged $5, make $5M, $10, make $10M etc. etc. all for 1 game.

How much would people be willing to spend for their Saturday Night fix?

Especially with no commercials, the game would be better to watch.

I believe that teams have been doing this since 2002, at least on the west coast in Canada. The price did range in the $9-$11 range.

A PPV would cost, I"m guessing $25,000, to produce so at $10 you'd need at least 2500 viewers per game to cover costs. The Canucks averaged just over 2000 per game back in 2002 so it is attainable. However, after 50+ years of free Saturday night coverage, would people be willing to pay for it when they can pay a monthly fee to a service provider (NHL Network) and choose what game they want to watch?
 

Tb0ne

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I can't believe any fan of any team other than Toronto or Montreal could ever possibly consider CBC loosing HNIC as a good thing.

You think you don't get to see your own team enough now, just wait until a Private for profit channel is running the show.
For the CBC, welcome to Hockey Night in Toronto.
For Radio Canada, welcome to Hockey Night in Montreal.

And really, it's not like TSN does a better job with their broadcasts.
 

iamcaper

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I can't believe any fan of any team other than Toronto or Montreal could ever possibly consider CBC loosing HNIC as a good thing.

You think you don't get to see your own team enough now, just wait until a Private for profit channel is running the show.
For the CBC, welcome to Hockey Night in Toronto.
For Radio Canada, welcome to Hockey Night in Montreal.

And really, it's not like TSN does a better job with their broadcasts.


As much as I like TSN, when you stack HNIC up to a TSN covered game, HNIC will win on most occassions. It's nice to get to see some different teams though. TSN has more time to play with than CBC simply because it's a "sports station"
 

discostu

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I can't believe any fan of any team other than Toronto or Montreal could ever possibly consider CBC loosing HNIC as a good thing.

You think you don't get to see your own team enough now, just wait until a Private for profit channel is running the show.
For the CBC, welcome to Hockey Night in Toronto.
For Radio Canada, welcome to Hockey Night in Montreal.

And really, it's not like TSN does a better job with their broadcasts.

I enjoy TSN's broadcasts more. THey've got more intelligent hockey people. They have better commentators. They broadcast more of their games in HD.

TSN has done a better job of packaging the NHL as a whole, rather than treating national broadcasts as a local game. Hence, I can watch a game like last nights Wings-Sharks on their network, and enjoy it.

Whether TSN will become more Leaf focused or not remains to be seen, but, to date, they've been focused on pushing the NHL as a whole, not the Canadian teams. That strategy has allowed them to strong ratings for their games, even when non-Canadian teams are playing. The CBC's strategy to go with an extremely pro-Leaf line-up does well for them at times, but, they were practically in financial crisis when the Leafs didn't make the playoffs. The fact that BGM thinks it can generate more money off HNIC than CBC does, tells me they plan on doing some things a little differently.
 

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