The Brandon Dubinsky expectations thread

Discussion in 'Columbus Blue Jackets' started by Old Guy, Aug 16, 2018.

  1. Cyclones Rock

    Cyclones Rock Registered User

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    Last edited: Jan 7, 2019
  2. thebus88

    thebus88 18/19 Blue Jackets- Sustain the Unsustainability

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    Dubois is better on faceoffs, "intensity", defensively with his stick, and along the boards.

    And, arguably even this "defensive awareness".....

    No?
     
  3. Cyclones Rock

    Cyclones Rock Registered User

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    Whatever that really means.

    PLD is a year 2, 20 year old. If he makes a few more positional mistakes defensively than Wennberg (and I'm not saying that he does), it's just part of the growing process.

    Also, it's worth noting that as a #1C he's facing much tougher competition than Wennberg, so if certain stats make Wennberg look superior defensively to PLD than the difference *could* be attributed to QualofComp.

    Wennberg needs to be given away in a trade or bought out at 1/3rd. Actually-and I can't believe I'm saying this-if the decision had to made today, I'd buy out Wennberg and Nash and keep Dubinsky. Subject to change, of course:laugh:
     
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  4. Viqsi

    Viqsi where we're going we don't need draft picks

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    Well, yeah. You seem to be focused on One True Approach To The Game, and I'm looking more at Many Approaches Means You're Harder To Stop.

    The fact that he's getting similar results preventing goals and shots against despite a very different play style? Really, the only objection there is faceoffs, because of the obvious "it's easier to defend if you start with the puck" thing, and Dubi is measurably better in that regard. Wennberg does seem to be showing signs of improving of late, altho I hesitate to call him "improved" until he keeps it up for longer than a month. :)

    Oh, I completely agree. I'd put him in over Dubinsky as well, tho, so that's not saying much. ;)

    Do you have supporting data for that? 'Cause I could have sworn I'd seen him out there in those situations multiple times. Not starting, usually (because faceoffs), but IIRC he's usually one of the first guys over the boards in the lategame when a change is possible.
     
  5. Double-Shift Lasse

    Double-Shift Lasse Just post better

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    This is the Dubinsky thread?
     
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  6. Crede777

    Crede777 Deputized

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    He's become irrelevant even in his own thread. :sarcasm:
     
  7. Double-Shift Lasse

    Double-Shift Lasse Just post better

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    Behind Wennberg in defensive statement mentions.
     
  8. Viqsi

    Viqsi where we're going we don't need draft picks

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    I think it still qualifies so long as a majority of posts at least mention his name.
    at least, that's how I justify it to myself
     
  9. Cyclones Rock

    Cyclones Rock Registered User

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    Blue Jackets' Brandon Dubinsky grudgingly accepts 'utility'...

     
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  10. WerenskiRules

    WerenskiRules HFBoards Sponsor Sponsor

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    Dubi expected back tomorrow vs. Habs

    I liked that Stenland didn't seem intimidated at this level, but being able to finish the season at Cleveland isn't going to hurt him any
     
  11. PanarinDangles9

    PanarinDangles9 Registered User Sponsor

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    Sounds like Stenlund is staying in the lineup for now. Looks like Duclair is the one coming out of the lineup - which is absurd - for Dubi...
     
  12. WerenskiRules

    WerenskiRules HFBoards Sponsor Sponsor

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    I think it's the wrong move....but DuClair was terrible against the Devils
    He had been checking some the previous games, but refused to Tuesday night
    That line was terrible, and He was the worst player.

    He still gives the team break away speed the other team has to respect and can lead to CBJ goals
     
  13. MoeBartoli

    MoeBartoli Chex-to-Jax

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    Yeah, but Dubi is regularly among the worst players. He doesn't pass the eye test and Alison Lukan's recent story outlining WAR numbers tell me my eyes aren't lying.
     
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  14. thebus88

    thebus88 18/19 Blue Jackets- Sustain the Unsustainability

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  15. Cyclones Rock

    Cyclones Rock Registered User

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    At this point, it's really "which center other than PLD will hurt the team less". If it's a decision between playing 3 of the 4 of Dubinsky, Nash, Sedlak and Wennberg, it's pretty much flip of the coin. I'd probably rotate one out every 4 games for the next month and make my decision based on their play in the next month.

    I wouldn't give Wennberg one ounce of priority over Dubinsky. Dubinsky brings better goal scoring and grit and faceoff abilities and Wennberg has better speed and passing. Pretty much rock/paper/scissors on this one. I'd probably take Dubinsky if it were my decision.
     
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  16. Maylo

    Maylo It never happened.

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    The sky is falling.
     
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  17. Forepar

    Forepar Registered User

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    Am I missing something? Not being smartass, we kind of forget Jenner is our de facto #2C. And while he may not be a premier 2C, his line has been very positive contributor since it became 77/38/71.

    It may be choosing 3 of the 4 listed to be in the lineup, but only 2 at C.
     
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  18. Cyclones Rock

    Cyclones Rock Registered User

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    Oops.:laugh: Redo.

    2 spots for the other 4. Flip them coins.
     
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  19. Cyclones Rock

    Cyclones Rock Registered User

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    Huge Wennberg wake up call if it were done.
     
  20. Maylo

    Maylo It never happened.

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    I mean considering your posts about Dubinsky last season and off season, that call on Wennberg was really LOUD! :D
     
  21. Cyclones Rock

    Cyclones Rock Registered User

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    \

    :laugh:

    #10 really needs something to wake his sorry a$$ up. If sitting while 2 of the 3 of Dubinsky, Nash and Sedlak are playing won't do it, then nothing will.

    I can't recall a CBJ in the past 6 or 7 years since I've been closely watching them who deserves the press box "treatment" more than Wennberg.
     
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  22. majormajor

    majormajor Registered User

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    I checked the Jackets' goals against rates for the most recent 30 games, and somehow Dubinsky got even worse.

    1. Dubinsky's dead last in the NHL in that period in GA/60. Also rock bottom in goals share (GF%).

    2. Wennberg has about 1/3 the goals against per minute. Nothing happens, good or bad, when that guy is on the ice. Folks in this thread are talking as if these two players are interchangeable, but putting Dubinsky in for Wennberg multiplies the goals against by a factor of 3. (See point 5, it's actually a factor of 6.6!)

    3. I'd love to know if anyone would dare give Torts the numbers on this one - Bjorkstrand, who Torts doesn't trust and benches for minor mistakes, has the lowest GA/60 on the team.

    4. Riley Nash would seem to also be struggling recently defensively, but I checked the "with you without you" for Nash and Dubinsky, and sure enough it's a "I have Dubinsky on my line please help" kind of problem. Nash is a plus player without Dubi but has 0 goals for and 8 goals against in just 90 minutes with him.

    5. This exercise prompted me to circle back to point number 2 and check how much of Wennberg's modest goals against is Dubinsky's fault. A lot of it! Wennberg's been on for 6 goals against in the last 30 games. In 270 minutes without Dubinsky, he's given up a shockingly low 3 goals. The other 3 came rapidly in just 30 minutes with Dubinsky.

    This is what a defensive liability is.
     
  23. MoeBartoli

    MoeBartoli Chex-to-Jax

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    Why do you keep pissing me off and posting what everyone should already know. :laugh::laugh::laugh: I've been advocating Dubinsky's departure for the past two and half seasons. In fact last year some pushed back so much that I said I would wait until the off season to restart my campaign. Glad you add some metrics.

    I did like how you I served the stat on Bjorkstrand's underrated defensive outcomes. Add this to his offensive abilities md I'm reminded how happy I will be when Torts is gone (or Bjorkstrand is given a chance with a new team if our current living-in-the-past coach returns.
     
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  24. mikeyp24

    mikeyp24 Registered User

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    Who are the D pairings when Dubi is out there? Who is with wennbetg or nash when they do better? It could be them pulling him up amd dragging Dubi down. The best part of stats is you look for stats to prove your points and you can twist stats very easily to show your points. For example people who hate guns say gun violence is the call of over 30k deaths a year. Thats a lot right? If you take out accidents and suicides its right at 10k give or take some depending on the year. Thats a lot of twisting that makes an issue seem like an epidemic that is in reality no worse then stabbings, drowning, car accidents, etc.

    Dubi is dominating in faceoffs sitting at #1 in the league since feb at 60%. When he is used soley as defense and pk mostly thats an important skill that no other player on the team can replicate. You dont want Milano type players of skill on the 4th line you want d minded checkers that can stop a play and start a rush to score or start the cycle for a line change to start a scoring chance.
     
  25. majormajor

    majormajor Registered User

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    Yes, seeing that made me think about how much of a disconnect between perception and reality there can be, not just in this situation but in so many things in life. Dubinsky is getting his minutes on reputation and image, and more minutes when we need defensive help. He's a veteran, he's strong, he's plied the penalty kills and been tasked with shutting down opponents for years now. Reputations have a mass to them, and they can outweigh results. And what exactly is Bjorkstrand's reputation for defense? He's a literal lightweight, and can occasionally get run over on the wall and fail to clear the zone. Torts seems to notice it every time. To be honest I was quite surprised that Bjorkstrand had such low goals against lately.
     

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