Rumor: The battle for Tarasenko is heating up

[CREW99AW]

I bet Army is keeping the price high because deep down he doesn’t want to trade him. He knows his shoulder is healthy and with a healthy and motivated Tarasenko, the Blues can make another run. Their roster is deep and talented. Adding Buchnevich and Saad just solidified it.

I disagree.
Many of the teams needing top 6 scoring, have either added ufas or made a trade.
No, I think the Blues held onto Taransenko too long. It would have been better for the team and Taransenko, if when he made his trade request, he simply agreed to go to any team and they moved him before the Seattle expansion draft.

With Eichel,Kessel and Dvorak also on the trade market, St Louis may well end up with Taransenko remaining with the team until the TDL.

 

[IslandersFan17]

Keeping a young player with upside in Dunn and having $7.5 million in free cap space is not "literally nothing," especially in the current financial environment.

No, having a player go one way and getting nothing in return is going for literally nothing.

 

[bleedblue1223]

No, having a player go one way and getting nothing in return is going for literally nothing.

If you can't understand the simplicity of how the expansion draft works, then I don't know what to tell you. We were going to lose Tarasenko and Dunn regardless this summer. If we traded both before the expansion, then we'd lose a 3rd player. Since a deal didn't materialize before the ED, we let Seattle determine who we'd trade post-ED. If Army was satisfied with getting absolutely nothing in return, he'd be a Devil by now.

Does Josh Bailey have 0 value too, I mean, come on...

 

[IslandersFan17]

If you can't understand the simplicity of how the expansion draft works, then I don't know what to tell you. We were going to lose Tarasenko and Dunn regardless this summer. If we traded both before the expansion, then we'd lose a 3rd player. Since a deal didn't materialize before the ED, we let Seattle determine who we'd trade post-ED. If Army was satisfied with getting absolutely nothing in return, he'd be a Devil by now.

Does Josh Bailey have 0 value too, I mean, come on...

Context matters, Josh Bailey didn’t ask to be traded, and the islanders needed to clear cap, there are different circumstance so…

 

[bleedblue1223]

Context matters, Josh Bailey didn’t ask to be traded, and the islanders needed to clear cap, there are different circumstance so…

Ok, so lets add more context. We don't need to clear cap, so if Army doesn't get a deal he likes, he'll do what Colorado did with Duchene. It's really not that complicated.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

CAN'T TAKE THE HEAT

 

[Em etah Eh]

Context matters, Josh Bailey didn’t ask to be traded, and the islanders needed to clear cap, there are different circumstance so…

So if Bailey had asked for a trade, they should have protected him?

 

[MissouriMook]

...St Louis may well end up with Taransenko remaining with the team until the TDL.

If you've been following along at all, you would know that this is not a bad outcome at all. All things being equal, we would be perfectly happy to have Vladdy back for the start of the season. If he wants out, there isn't much to be done about that. But if he has to come back and perform while a better deal forms between now and the TDL, that's a win-win for the Blues as opposed to trading him for nothing now and possibly having to retain salary and cap space. Just because a player asks to be traded does not mean the team has to accommodate him.

 

[MissouriMook]

No, having a player go one way and getting nothing in return is going for literally nothing.

Another way to put this is that if Seattle has selected Tarasenko, regardless of their intentions, it would be like the Blues traded Tarasenko for Dunn since they would no longer have Tarasenko but would still have Dunn and an additional $7.5M in cap space until they re-signed Dunn. So, again, not "nothing". Geez, why is this so hard to understand?

 

[bleedblue1223]

I don't see him lasting on the Blues to the TDL. I don't think it would take long into the season for a deal to materialize. Enough time for him to prove his shot is back, and for injuries on other clubs to hit, or a club either under/over achieving early on looking to shake things up or add to start competing.

 

[Em etah Eh]

Another way to put this is that if Seattle has selected Tarasenko, regardless of their intentions, it would be like the Blues traded Tarasenko for Dunn since they would no longer have Tarasenko but would still have Dunn and an additional $7.5M in cap space until they re-signed Dunn. So, again, not "nothing". Geez, why is this so hard to understand?

It's like saying Tampa got literally nothing for Gourde. Everybody had to lose something. Some teams had way better players on the fringe than others. Tampa could have traded Gourde for a decent return but then lose Palat or somebody else as well. So they chose to keep as much depth as they could. (in before the guy says that Gourde has way more value than Tarasenko, which is not what I'm saying at all).

 

[Oh Baby!]

Context matters, Josh Bailey didn’t ask to be traded, and the islanders needed to clear cap, there are different circumstance so…

Is this true for all teams or just the Islanders?

 

[Eggtimer]

I’m guessing that he hasn’t been traded because the Blues are not in a panic anymore to find cap room. I thought if they wanted Landeskog that they might let Tarasenko go for less assets with no retention. Now that they appear to have their roster set and are not in a panic for cap relief I bet they are sticking to their asking price and if they don’t get it then the go into the season with Tank on the roster . I guess it comes down to how disgruntled Tank is and if Armstrong is willing to accommodate ? At this point I’m not so sure he gets traded before training camps open . It would be the best move if the Blues were confident his shoulder is decent to just keep him until they get value they want in trade. Only thing that may force a trade is if Tarasenko flat out refuses to play snd the distraction is too much to warrant holding onto him . I can’t see him doing it but if he starts doging it on the ice like PLD then I think you’d have to move him . I can’t see that happening as you’d think Tarasenko would want to prove he is healthy snd still has it?

 

[bleedblue1223]

I would still bet on him being moved before training camp, but I wouldn't consider it a safe bet. Army will still want to add Bozak or some other depth piece to round out the roster and to not have the potential for locker room issues. And same goes for teams looking to acquire, you will want your new sniper to start developing chemistry with his center and on the PP. Mid-September is kind of the next "deadline".

 

[CREW99AW]

If you've been following along at all, you would know that this is not a bad outcome at all. All things being equal, we would be perfectly happy to have Vladdy back for the start of the season. If he wants out, there isn't much to be done about that. But if he has to come back and perform while a better deal forms between now and the TDL, that's a win-win for the Blues as opposed to trading him for nothing now and possibly having to retain salary and cap space. Just because a player asks to be traded does not mean the team has to accommodate him.

No , they don't have to accommodate him. We agree on that.

Do we also agree, that with many teams having filled scoring needs thru the ufa market and trades,hurts any Blues attempt to trade him?

Do you agree with me, that having Eichel,Kessel,Tatar and Dvorak also available hurts St Louis' attempts to get a bidding war going for Taransenko?

 

[blinkman360]

If you're the Isles you need to roll the dice, I think. Obviously there is a pretty big risk involved with Tarasenko due to the injury but at the same time, that's the only reason you'll ever be able to get a guy as talented as Tarasenko for as discounted of a price. Considering how difficult it seems to be for us to lure top UFAs, and considering how thin we are at high-end tradeable chips, Tarasenko does seem to make a lot of sense on paper(especially when you see that glaring hole on that Lee-Barzal top line).

If there is ANY way to make this work financially without losing a core piece, I think you have to do it. Now's the time for the Isles and IMO the only thing they're lacking is a truly dangerous top line. This could be their chance to fix that.

 

[bleedblue1223]

No , they don't have to accommodate him. We agree on that.

Do we also agree, that with many teams having filled scoring needs thru the ufa market and trades,hurts any Blues attempt to trade him?

Do you agree with me, that having Eichel,Kessel,Tatar and Dvorak also available hurts St Louis' attempts to get a bidding war going for Taransenko?

Too much unknowns. The only one in there that really impacts Tarasenko IMO is Kessel. I don't see too much overlap between the others.

Eichel has a huge contract and more serious injury concerns than Tarasenko. He wants a neck surgery that I don't think has been done on an athlete in a contact sport. His playing future is very much up in the air IMO. He's also a center, and if he was healthy, he'd be uber expensive in terms of assets.

Dvorak will go to someone needing a center and won't be cheap because of age and contract. Completely different teams will be interested IMO.

Tatar is obviously the bargain bin consolation prize. Maybe you can argue less downside, but there is little upside IMO. He probably wants too much term, and might end up being this year's Hoffman where he just has to settle. Not really worried about the impact here, because to me the teams interested in Tarasenko likely prefer him, otherwise, they'd just sign Tatar.

Kessel is the only one where I see genuine overlap.

 

[MissouriMook]

No , they don't have to accommodate him. We agree on that.

Do we also agree, that with many teams having filled scoring needs thru the ufa market and trades,hurts any Blues attempt to trade him?

Do you agree with me, that having Eichel,Kessel,Tatar and Dvorak also available hurts St Louis' attempts to get a bidding war going for Taransenko?

I agree with your points to the degree that you're assuming that he has to be traded now. If the right deal isn't there now, you don't sell when the supply/demand equation isn't in your favor. You wait until he proves he is back to being a productive winger and wait for someone to have a need to fill a roster spot for an injured player or to see him as a missing piece at the TDL. Again, you're completely ignoring the fact that the team doesn't HAVE TO trade him now just because he demanded it. See Sakic, Joe and Duchene, Matt from several years ago.

 

[jimmythemick]

Too much unknowns. The only one in there that really impacts Tarasenko IMO is Kessel. I don't see too much overlap between the others.

Eichel has a huge contract and more serious injury concerns than Tarasenko. He wants a neck surgery that I don't think has been done on an athlete in a contact sport. His playing future is very much up in the air IMO. He's also a center, and if he was healthy, he'd be uber expensive in terms of assets.

Dvorak will go to someone needing a center and won't be cheap because of age and contract. Completely different teams will be interested IMO.

Tatar is obviously the bargain bin consolation prize. Maybe you can argue less downside, but there is little upside IMO. He probably wants too much term, and might end up being this year's Hoffman where he just has to settle. Not really worried about the impact here, because to me the teams interested in Tarasenko likely prefer him, otherwise, they'd just sign Tatar.

Kessel is the only one where I see genuine overlap.

Wonderfully put! Personally I don't want to lose Tarasenko. His skill set when healthy is going to be incredibly hard to replace. What I would love to see is a couple of the leaders in the room take him out for some cocktails and hash this out. Get him re-engaged in the team. That may very well be a pipe dream, but if he leaves I will have a closest full of named jerseys and only one player left on the team. My amusement in reading all these Tarasenko threads is that everyone will talk about how he isn't worth anything or has negative value and then out of the other side of their mouth talk about he will be playing on their top 2 lines.

 

[CREW99AW]

Too much unknowns. The only one in there that really impacts Tarasenko IMO is Kessel. I don't see too much overlap between the others.

Eichel has a huge contract and more serious injury concerns than Tarasenko. He wants a neck surgery that I don't think has been done on an athlete in a contact sport. His playing future is very much up in the air IMO. He's also a center, and if he was healthy, he'd be uber expensive in terms of assets.

Dvorak will go to someone needing a center and won't be cheap because of age and contract. Completely different teams will be interested IMO.

Tatar is obviously the bargain bin consolation prize. Maybe you can argue less downside, but there is little upside IMO. He probably wants too much term, and might end up being this year's Hoffman where he just has to settle. Not really worried about the impact here, because to me the teams interested in Tarasenko likely prefer him, otherwise, they'd just sign Tatar.

Kessel is the only one where I see genuine overlap.

I think Pagnotta is the source , who says Buffalo may be willing to retain on an Eichel trade. Eichel at $7m for a team that expects him to recover is a lot easier to swallow then Eichel at $10m.

Kessel's bonus was paid and he is due about $1m in salary. If Arizona retains 50% on a Kessel deal, his caphit is around $4m.

Scorers Tatar and Dvorak going to other teams further limits St Louis pool of teams looking for scoring. Tatar probably does want term,but the market doesn't look like he will get it

 

[bleedblue1223]

I think Pagnotta is the source who says Buffalo may be willing to retain on an Eichel trade.

Kessel's bonus was paid and he is due about $1m in salary. If Arizona retains 50% on a Kessel deal, his caphit is around $4m.

Scorers Tatar and Dvorak going to other teams further limits St Louis pote

Dvorak isn't a scorer, he's a 40-50 point 2-way center. I haven't really spent time figuring out all the teams linked to him, but I imagine he goes somewhere that isn't one of the teams connected to Tarasenko. Sure, Buffalo might be willing to retain, they'll have to, but again I don't see much overlap between teams interested in Eichel and teams interested in Tarasenko. Completely different players, financial commitment, asset cost, and even injury risk. If Eichel was healthy, I'd give a ton, but with serious neck injuries, there's no way I'd be interested, especially when there is an issue as to how it's going to be repaired.

Kessel is the competition, Tatar is the bargain bin consolation.

 

[CREW99AW]

I agree with your points to the degree that you're assuming that he has to be traded now. If the right deal isn't there now, you don't sell when the supply/demand equation isn't in your favor. You wait until he proves he is back to being a productive winger and wait for someone to have a need to fill a roster spot for an injured player or to see him as a missing piece at the TDL. Again, you're completely ignoring the fact that the team doesn't HAVE TO trade him now just because he demanded it. See Sakic, Joe and Duchene, Matt from several years ago.

I made similar points weeks ago, in an Eichel thread.
If teams aren't offering up what Buffalo wants, don't move him.

I could see Taransenko returning to the Blues. But, imo it will be because there is a weak market for him.

 

[CREW99AW]

Dvorak isn't a scorer, he's a 40-50 point 2-way center. I haven't really spent time figuring out all the teams linked to him, but I imagine he goes somewhere that isn't one of the teams connected to Tarasenko. Sure, Buffalo might be willing to retain, they'll have to, but again I don't see much overlap between teams interested in Eichel and teams interested in Tarasenko. Completely different players, financial commitment, asset cost, and even injury risk. If Eichel was healthy, I'd give a ton, but with serious neck injuries, there's no way I'd be interested, especially when there is an issue as to how it's going to be repaired.

Kessel is the competition, Tatar is the bargain bin consolation.

If the isles were one of the teams who feel Eichel will fully recover from his injury,imo his salary would be the biggest holdup ,not their depth at center.Buffalo saying they'll retain salary will bring teams back to the table. Taransenko's shoulder and Eichel's neck injury are both gambles for the team acquiring them.

 

[MissouriMook]

I made similar points weeks ago, in an Eichel thread.
If teams aren't offering up what Buffalo wants, don't move him.

I could see Taransenko returning to the Blues. But, imo it will be because there is a weak market for him.

You keep leaving off the word "now" when referring to the market for him. It may very well be true that the market for him is weak NOW, but that could change in the future and his current team has no reason to move him in a panic if it is currently a buyer's market. Maybe there is a better deal later, maybe not.

There is no cap crunch, nor any other motivation on the part of the team to move him in a bad deal. If he refuses to report to camp, he is suspended and the team gets cap relief. If the situation became acrimonious enough, they could agree to a mutual termination and make him a free agent. All of these outcomes are preferable to the team when compared to sending him somewhere with retention and getting little or nothing in return.

 

[Fataldogg]

In 2010-11 Gaborik had 22 goals in 62 games. He had one 2 goal game, two hat tricks and one 4 goal game which means he had 10 goals in 58 games.

Why do I remember that? Because that’s a real shitty thing to do your fantasy hockey team owners. That taught me an important lesson about owning stupid Rags players.

Admittedly, that doesn’t have much to do with Tarasenko.

So, he was a lot like Zibenejad this year who piled up all of his points against the Flyers in a few games.