The almost 3/4 of the season Hart talk.

Discussion in 'National Hockey League Talk' started by daver, Feb 14, 2020 at 5:31 AM.

  1. McRpro

    McRpro Call the rulebook!

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    Two of those players aren't making the playoffs, therefore they won't be on the ballot.
     
  2. b in vancouver

    b in vancouver Registered User

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    He's right there for me also. Not sure if I'd vote for him today but it'd be a coin-flip.
    Not sure why people want to change The Hart Trophy into 'The Best Player On The Worst Team To Make The Playoffs' award.
     
  3. sugarspice

    sugarspice Registered User

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    Panarin nor Eichel will win it. They won't be on the ballet. Why? No playoffs. Is it fair? No. But it's the way it'll go.
     
  4. Vex

    Vex Registered User

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    It's about being most valuable to your team. If you are surrounded by great players who are producing, then one can easily argue that player is less valuable.

    We have a "best player" award already. The Hart is pointless if it doesn't differentiate from the Lindsay.
     
  5. McShogun99

    McShogun99 Registered User

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    Pasta won't win it for a few reasons. His team is to good, as are his linemates and he probably won't win the Rocket or the Art Ross. It's stupid reasons but that's how the voting seems to work. Right now the front runner is Mackinnon but if Draisitl wins the Art Ross while carrying the Oilers to the playoffs then the Hart is his. Voters love the story line of a team thats been bad for years sneaking into the playoffs as well as Draisaitl rising to the challenge when Mcdavid got injured.
     
  6. Mez

    Mez Registered User

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    This thread really shows how big peoples homer glasses are....so much misinformation, obscure stats, and lack of understanding. The Hart will go to a playoff player. And most likely the Art Ross winner if that player makes the playoffs.....thats how it always is.
     
  7. BCNate

    BCNate Registered User

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    Markstrom will be in the running if the Canucks maintain or improve their position in the standings. Not likely to win, but will certainly be in the 5 or 6 player conversation.
     
  8. b in vancouver

    b in vancouver Registered User

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    The Hart is pointless if players like Gretzky, Lafleur, Orr, Lemieux, Crosby, Clarke, Howe, etc. never won it because they were on great teams - and that the list was Peter Statsny, Perrault, Federko, Syl Apps, Shane Doan, Phil Kessel, etc.
    Look at the list of Hart winners and, outside of goalies and the odd outlier, tell me how many weren't on great teams. You're trying to change what the award has always been.
     
  9. a mangy Meowth

    a mangy Meowth NOTENOUGHBREWER fan

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    Why are people so obsessed with hijacking the Hart to turn it into the Art Ross 2.0?
     
  10. Vex

    Vex Registered User

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    It should look different to the Lindsay. There are absolutely cases where a player should win both, but the NHL needs to change the definition of the award if they're just going to give it to the Art Ross winner. You're saying I'm changing what the award means when I'm actually going by the definition that's engraved on the trophy!
     
  11. Dicky113

    Dicky113 Registered User

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    If pasta wins the rocket and the art Ross, he’ll get the hart
     
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  12. The Winter Soldier

    The Winter Soldier NHL FAN

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    If I was voting today. I’d vote Draisaitl. HM Pastrnak
     
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  13. onetweasy

    onetweasy Registered User

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    Drai can’t win because McDavid is on his Team.....

    McDavid cannot win because well I am not sure what the media and fans will come up with this year.....probably because he has Drai on his team...

    So Nathan Mack......playing on a better and deeper team and having 10 points less than Drai clearly gets the nod......
     
  14. duul

    duul Registered User

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    It's silly to claim MacKinnon is 'driving the bus' when his goal% is significantly lower than both Draisaitl and McDavid. Remove Mackinnon from Colorado and they still have more goals than the Oilers. Remove one of Drai/McDavid from the Oilers and they are in Detroit/Ottawa territory. Basement of the league.

    If you want to go purely on most points generated compared to ALL of his teammates, then Draisaitl and McDavid both are more valuable to their teams success than Mack is. You can say 'Mackinnon doesn't have Draisaitl or McDavid to play with'. The counter argument is that Colorado has like 9 forwards who would be 4th on the Oilers in scoring. Their depth is ridiculous, and they would still be producing enough to be in a playoff spot without Mack. Without Drai or Davo's scoring, the Oilers would be in the basement. It's that simple. Most valuable players in the league right now are Drai, Davo, Panarin, and Eichel.
     
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  15. The Winter Soldier

    The Winter Soldier NHL FAN

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    I just don’t buy the teammate argument. If you are going to say Draisaitl can’t win because McDavid is on the same team. Why not say Pasta can’t because Bergy and Marchand are on the team? Its just not an argument that makes sense.
     
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  16. danpantz

    danpantz Registered User

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    Bergeron and Marchand were not the offensive forces they have become since Pastrnak joined them. I think he deserves some credit for helping great players become elite players.
     
  17. EdmFlyersfan

    EdmFlyersfan Registered User

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    Drai can't win it because he was -26 in December alone...how is that helping your team?

     
  18. Vex

    Vex Registered User

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    I said exactly that though. Neither of them should get it.

    Yeah, he's phenomenal. I know this is oversimplifying the situation, but think of it in numerical value. If Pastrnak's value is, say, a 9 out of 10, then his linemates are surely a 7 or 8. Panarin would be a 10, but even if he was a 9 as well, you should take into consideration the players on his team. These numbers are ultimately pointless, but that is my thought process on the Hart trophy.

    My point being a player having a better season =/= more valuable to their team necessarily.

    A player on a better team =/= more valuable to their team.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2020 at 9:47 PM
  19. tucker3434

    tucker3434 HFBoards Sponsor Sponsor

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    Drai 100% would win today. I think the question is where will he be by the time McDavid gets back in 2-3 weeks. Will he still have a commanding lead in points? Will the oilers still be clinging to a playoff spot? People expect the answer to be no for both.
     
  20. Vex

    Vex Registered User

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    Which people?
     
  21. Regal

    Regal Registered User

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    Players who stand out among their peers are almost always the winner if they make the playoffs. Kucherov for instance won pretty easily last year. The idea of value to team only usually comes into play when the top players are close or the best doesn't make the playoffs. It just happens that teo of the last three years have been ones without that separation.
     
  22. tucker3434

    tucker3434 HFBoards Sponsor Sponsor

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    Well, I haven’t even seen many oiler fans on here that seem very confident Drai will carry the team to the playoffs. Then there’s this thread where MacKinnon is getting most of the support despite the fact the Drai would win today.
     
  23. MrThomas

    MrThomas Registered User

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    Tuukka Rask and Elvis
     
  24. Three On Zero

    Three On Zero Oh Jesus!

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    Draisaitl scenario makes zero sense, he was already leading in points and Edmonton was in a playoff position before mcdavid went down. He deserves some votes but shouldn’t be in the top 3
     
  25. Apotheosis

    Apotheosis Registered User

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    Mackinnon for me. Was dominating even with Rantanen not signed and a slew of injuries. Will eclipse well over 100 points and the clear best player on the team. If Drai continues to produce as well as he has with McDavid injured, it will be close. Don't want to derail the thread at all with Matthews talk, but if the Leafs make the playoffs after a horrid start, I think he might get some votes. Might get 55-60 goals and 100 points despite playing under black hole Babcock. But for now Mackinnon is my rather easy pick.
     

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