The All Encompassing JR Thread

[mpp9]

Id hook up with Tampa this offseason. Palat, Johnson and Miller might be on the move, and they'd all be varying levels of good with Malkin. Certainly better track records on scoring lines than McCann, Rust, Simon, etc. They all make about 5 mil, Palat gives you a bit more defense and playmaking. Johnson is a better Sheary who can play center as well. And Miller seems a lot like Saad for a mil cheaper.

 

[Gurglesons]

Id hook up with Tampa this offseason. Palat, Johnson and Miller might be on the move, and they'd all be varying levels of good with Malkin. Certainly better track records on scoring lines than McCann, Rust, Simon, etc. They all make about 5 mil, Palat gives you a bit more defense and playmaking. Johnson is a better Sheary who can play center as well. And Miller seems a lot like Saad for a mil cheaper.

And what exactly are you trading them?

 

[Ogrezilla]

And what exactly are you trading them?

Adam Johnson is basically Hagelin, so him plus the cap space they clear seems like a good deal

 

[mpp9]

And what exactly are you trading them?

They want to shed cap space. So picks we get for moving some of our older core pieces.

I'd imagine a 2nd rounder for Miller would do the trick.

Won't be easy to navigate because we have to trade players to bring new ones in obviously.

 

[Ogrezilla]

They want to shed cap space. So picks we get for moving some of our older core pieces.

I'd imagine a 2nd rounder for Miller would do the trick.

Won't be easy to navigate because we have to trade players to bring new ones in obviously.

the thing that makes that hard is that those guys are clearly better than the guys we are trying to dump. That's why we want to dump ours and add these guys. So I can't imagine we'll be finding many takers on our guys before Tampa's guys are already gone. Even if we can move ours before then, we likely won't get as much back as these guys will cost to acquire.

The fact that they need to trade them likely won't be lowering their costs much since there will still be competition to acquire these guys. That will drive the cost up just as much as Tampa's need to move them will drop it.

 

[Gurglesons]

They want to shed cap space. So picks we get for moving some of our older core pieces.

I'd imagine a 2nd rounder for Miller would do the trick.

Won't be easy to navigate because we have to trade players to bring new ones in obviously.

You think JT Miller is going to cost a 2nd?

Ooooooooooookay

 

[mpp9]

You think JT Miller is going to cost a 2nd?

Ooooooooooookay

He makes 5 mil coming off a poor season on a team needing to shed cap.

What do you think he's going to bring back bub?

 

[mpp9]

the thing that makes that hard is that those guys are clearly better than the guys we are trying to dump. That's why we want to dump ours and add these guys. So I can't imagine we'll be finding many takers on our guys before Tampa's guys are already gone. Even if we can move ours before then, we likely won't get as much back as these guys will cost to acquire.

The fact that they need to trade them likely won't be lowering their costs much since there will still be competition to acquire these guys. That will drive the cost up just as much as Tampa's need to move them will drop it.

Na. NHL GMs are like vultures. They sense a team needs to move a player/s, they make the cost to acquire as cheap as possible.

If we were talking Tampa trying to shed Kucherov, Point, etc, then yeah, that's one thing.

We're talking 2nd line caliber players coming off meh to poor seasons.

Obviously that applies to us to in terms of shedding cap, but if we're acquiring forwards, Kessel is likely gone and I don't see him going for anything less than a 1st+. More than enough to flip for more complementary younger players like the ones I listed.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Na. NHL GMs are like vultures. They sense a team needs to move a player/s, they make the cost to acquire as cheap as possible.

If we were talking Tampa trying to shed Kucherov, Point, etc, then yeah, that's one thing.

We're talking 2nd line caliber players coming off meh to poor seasons.

so what are we getting for the guys we are trying to get rid of?

 

[mpp9]

so what are we getting for the guys we are trying to get rid of?

I edited my post, but if we're acquiring forwards, Kessel is gone IMO. He's netting more than any of the players I mentioned.

Rust can probably bring back a 2nd rounder since he doesn't make a ton and has recent playoff pedigree as well as fitting what this league is now to a T. PH to the right team could net a late 1st.

 

[Ogrezilla]

I edited my post, but if we're acquiring forwards, Kessel is gone IMO. He's netting more than any of the players I mentioned.

Not sure I agree with that, especially since he has control over where we can send him.

Rust can probably bring back a 2nd rounder since he doesn't make a ton and has recent playoff pedigree as well as fitting what this league is now to a T. PH to the right team could net a late 1st.

The reasons Rust has value are also reasons why I don't want to move Rust

As for Horny, I'm not sure we can move him for just picks. I think we'd be taking salary back. Not until he gets a chance to play again and prove whether he can bounce back from the concussions.

 

[Gurglesons]

He makes 5 mil coming off a poor season on a team needing to shed cap.

What do you think he's going to bring back bub?

He just put up 47 points. At worst he’s getting the two seconds and a garbage prospect. You do realize teams like Buffalo and Edmonton will be frothing at the mouth for Tampa’s players.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

He just put up 47 points. At worst he’s getting the two seconds and a garbage prospect. You do realize teams like Buffalo and Edmonton will be frothing at the mouth for Tampa’s players.

JR's probably licking his chops as the prospects of adding Dan Girardi if Tampa needs to dump salary.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

What is Girardi's pushback for/against percentage?

 

[Gurglesons]

JR's probably licking his chops as the prospects of adding Dan Girardi if Tampa needs to dump salary.

He’s a UFA. We probably trade Maatta and sign him for “pushback”

 

[Andy99]

He’s a UFA. We probably trade Maatta and sign him for “pushback”

I have no doubt if there is bad defenseman who’s big and physical but does nothing else well JR will be out there trying to trade for him or sign him...

 

[Turin]

I’d boycott if the D included Johnson, Girardi and Gudbranson. I wouldn’t watch a single game so long as Rutherford was GM. I’m almost at that point already with just JJ.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

He’s a UFA. We probably trade Maatta and sign him for “pushback”

Even better! At least now JR has something to spend the cap space on after trading Kessel.

 

[Peat]

I think all the talk about where our wingers should be playing is based on a bad hypothesis, and that is that we should be assigning places semi-permanently based on their aggregated level rather than assigning and re-assigning based on the form curve, which in the case of most of our wingers is quite extreme.

I'd love to get more players who have lesser form curves but until that's the case I think its best to stay flexible and rotate regularly.

Also, while I appreciate that we're looking to win Cups and that means looking to be better than average, but I'm pretty sure that if the entire NHL redrafted again based on current players, a lot of our wingers that people think shouldn't be in the top 6/top 9 would end up in someone's top 6/top 9.

They want to shed cap space. So picks we get for moving some of our older core pieces.

I'd imagine a 2nd rounder for Miller would do the trick.

Won't be easy to navigate because we have to trade players to bring new ones in obviously.

We don't have a 2nd for the next two years and in a world where Andrew Shaw cost 2 2nds, Miller's going to require more.

 

[EliteGoaltending]

I’d boycott if the D included Johnson, Girardi and Gudbranson. I wouldn’t watch a single game so long as Rutherford was GM. I’m almost at that point already with just JJ.

Honestly, I stopped watching games already this season.

It's been one line+one d-pair + a goalie show for almost entire of season.

If JR and Sully will still rule the ship, that's might be it for 87/71 era. I don't see them(managment/coaching) saddenly change to a good direction again.

 

[SouthGeorge]

I’d boycott if the D included Johnson, Girardi and Gudbranson. I wouldn’t watch a single game so long as Rutherford was GM. I’m almost at that point already with just JJ.

I'm at that point with Letang. I know how it ends. Get a lead, he gets aggressive for no reason and pinches and blows lead or game. Until he's traded there's really no point.

 

[Burn]

The Jets have to be in win now mode.

Hornqvist and a 3rd
For
Lowery Samberg and a 2nd

 

[MtlPenFan]

Why would JR add to the defense when he's already stated it's the best he's ever had?

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Who? Teddy looked lost as a 4th line wing and Johnson was fine, but ZAR actually produced.

Blueger did not look lost as a 4th line wing.

Not a ZAR fan, but acting like AJ in and ZAR out is the secret to our identity is foolish especially consider Kuhnhackl and Rowney played nearly all of each cup run.

It's not "the secret to our identity". But AJ and TB clearly better fit the speed/aggressive forecheck identity better than ZAR and Wilson, a couple of plodders who aren't fast enough to force the opposition.

# 1. Wilson and ZAR are nothing like Glass Adams and is the laziest argument on here. They’re fringe NHL talent, but they play creative games and don’t just punch faces.

What the

# 2. Rust - Malkin - Kessel was used in the playoffs and was mediocre and was used in the regular season for 50ish minutes was pretty mediocre as well.

For 8 minutes.

Line Stats - Natural Stat Trick

I feel like you’re insistence on RMK is because we have not seen it rather than any merit reason.

Precisely.

Because we haven't seen it, the idea that Rust isn't as good on LW is baseless, and we have a surplus of RWs.

That's 3 compelling reasons right there.

So McCann is your best LWer then? That's even worse

I fail to see the problem here. We're living in a cap world, you're not going to have stars at every position.

The mix of our forward group is off right now, but there's nothing inherently wrong talent-wise with having complementary two-way wingers like McCann and Rust in the top 6 if you have elite offensive wingers like Guentzel and Kessel opposite them.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I fail to see the problem here. We're living in a cap world, you're not going to have stars at every position.

The mix of our forward group is off right now, but there's nothing inherently wrong talent-wise with having complementary two-way wingers like McCann and Rust in the top 6 if you have elite offensive wingers like Guentzel and Kessel opposite them.

You don't need to want a star at every position to say that a fringe 2nd/3rd liner as your best LWer isn't good enough.

In an ideal world, I think you have one of McCann or Rust in the top-6 and one on the 3rd line. I'd probably say McCann in the top-6 and Rust on the 3rd line would be my preference, because I think McCann's upside is higher.