OT: The Accomplishments Of The Original Ottawa Senators

[Flamingo]

I believe the Senators were technically "reinstated", were they not?

I think so too.

Besides, I claim that rich history of Stanley Cup and NHL achievement in my fandom history. I feel a great sense of pride, and obviously have unparalleled discernment of things sporty and Canadian, in owning this allegiance.

 

[Zorf]

"I remember back when I was a young whipper snapper, watching the likes of Alec Connell make daring saves, and defensive stalwarts like King Clancey, and Gene Bouchard manning the blueline, while being mesmerized by the skill of Franky Finnigan."

-Said no one alive in Ottawa today.


I don't think there's much of a connection to the 1920s teams and the modern-day team today.

Hell, CTC doesn't even have horse and buggy parking spaces anymore! We've lost that connection to the past too!

 

[Ray Kinsella]

"I remember back when I was a young whipper snapper, watching the likes of Alec Connell make daring saves, and defensive stalwarts like King Clancey, and Gene Bouchard manning the blueline, while being mesmerized by the skill of Franky Finnigan."

-Said no one alive in Ottawa today.


I don't think there's much of a connection to the 1920s teams and the modern-day team today.

Hell, CTC doesn't even have horse and buggy parking spaces anymore! We've lost that connection to the past too!

Actually, there were horse and buggy parking spaces. They were changed to regular vehicle parking spaces after a while as they were taking the space of about 3 cars and Melnyk realized he was losing money on that deal.

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

"I remember back when I was a young whipper snapper, watching the likes of Alec Connell make daring saves, and defensive stalwarts like King Clancey, and Gene Bouchard manning the blueline, while being mesmerized by the skill of Franky Finnigan."

-Said no one alive in Ottawa today.


I don't think there's much of a connection to the 1920s teams and the modern-day team today.

Hell, CTC doesn't even have horse and buggy parking spaces anymore! We've lost that connection to the past too!

To play devil's advocate, I don't think anyone alive in Toronto today is waxing eloquent about Harry Mummery, Alf Noble or Reg Skinner, but that doesn't make the city of Toronto's hockey history any less relevant.

 

[Grungy Remnant]

I believe the Senators were technically "reinstated", were they not?

Yea, what about the fabled "Certificate of Reinstatement" the NHL gave the Senators. I've heard it brought up through the years but have never seen it nor know what it says or means.

History of the Ottawa Senators (1992–) - Wikipedia

 

[Zorf]

To play devil's advocate, I don't think anyone alive in Toronto today is waxing eloquent about Harry Mummery, Alf Noble or Reg Skinner, but that doesn't make the city of Toronto's hockey history any less relevant.

They also didn't have 60+ years where there was no hockey team.


...not that many of their hockey teams were any good...but technically they still had hockey in Toronto.

 

[NyQuil]

The Montreal Alouettes count Grey Cups that were won by other franchises.

Something to remind Montreal fans about when they get uppity.

 

[saskriders]

To play devil's advocate, I don't think anyone alive in Toronto today is waxing eloquent about Harry Mummery, Alf Noble or Reg Skinner, but that doesn't make the city of Toronto's hockey history any less relevant.

Did you have to look up those names? Because I had no idea who any of them, but knew all the names in the post you quoted and could have even added a few more to it. I think the fact that Senators from the 20s are more of a household name to us than Leafs from the 20s is telling. Sure, enough time has passed that it is a completely different era and in most contexts it makes sense to keep them separate. But it is no doubt in my mind that that history belongs to Ottawa and Senators fans and it did not move with the St. Louis where nobody cares about what the team in Ottawa did.

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

Did you have to look up those names? Because I had no idea who any of them, but knew all the names in the post you quoted and could have even added a few more to it. I think the fact that Senators from the 20s are more of a household name to us than Leafs from the 20s is telling. Sure, enough time has passed that it is a completely different era and in most contexts it makes sense to keep them separate. But it is no doubt in my mind that that history belongs to Ottawa and Senators fans and it did not move with the St. Louis where nobody cares about what the team in Ottawa did.

I did, but I credit a very good hockey encyclopedia I read as a kid for that. Ultimate Hockey. Harry Mummery, especially, sticks in my mind because he once asked his team (I think Montreal at the time) for a per diem for cream and, when the owner asked if he kept cats, he answered "No, I just like drinking it."

But you're absolutely right – Ottawa's alum are rightfully more remembered. Hell, we had a year where Cy Denneny, a future hall of famer, was a substitute. Tells you all you need to know about the quality of players we had.

Also, just because it'd be a travesty to go any further in this thread without mentioning his name, Clint Benedict was phenomenal.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

They played in the NHL for 17 years and were part of the original six. History is history is history.

Original Four.

In 1917, The National Hockey League began play on November 26th with four member teams -- the Montreal Canadiens, Montreal Wanderers, Ottawa Senators and Toronto Arenas.

 

[Ray Kinsella]

Original Four.

In 1917, The National Hockey League began play on November 26th with four member teams -- the Montreal Canadiens, Montreal Wanderers, Ottawa Senators and Toronto Arenas.

I wondered how long it would take you...

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

I wondered how long it would take you...

Almost two hours ......... enough time to correct it.

 

[Ray Kinsella]

Almost two hours ......... enough time to correct it.

You’re an easy target.

 

[saskriders]

I did, but I credit a very good hockey encyclopedia I read as a kid for that. Ultimate Hockey. Harry Mummery, especially, sticks in my mind because he once asked his team (I think Montreal at the time) for a per diem for cream and, when the owner asked if he kept cats, he answered "No, I just like drinking it."

But you're absolutely right – Ottawa's alum are rightfully more remembered. Hell, we had a year where Cy Denneny, a future hall of famer, was a substitute. Tells you all you need to know about the quality of players we had.

Also, just because it'd be a travesty to go any further in this thread without mentioning his name, Clint Benedict was phenomenal.

Clint Benedict "accidentally" fell to the ice and happened to make a save so often that the NHL had to change the rules and allow goalies to leave their feet.

 

[saskriders]

Original Four.

In 1917, The National Hockey League began play on November 26th with four member teams -- the Montreal Canadiens, Montreal Wanderers, Ottawa Senators and Toronto Arenas.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

Kind of just want to say the 11 time Stanley Cup champions Ottawa Senators

If you wanted to be technically correct, about the number of times, a Hockey Team, representing Ottawa won the Stanley Cup, you could include the pre-NHL era, known as the Challenge Cup era, when a Hockey Team, representing Ottawa won the Stanley Cup 17 times between 1903 & 1912, and add them to the number of times a Hockey Team, representing Ottawa won the Stanley Cup in the NHL era.

Ottawa Hockey Club, March 1891
Source: Library and Archives Canada

Photographer: William James Topley
Date: 1891​

 

[tony d]

To me they're 2 different teams. Same name and city maybe but 2 different teams with different histories.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Local history from up the line

The Renfrew Hockey Club, also known as the Creamery Kings and the "Renfrew Millionaires" was a founding franchise in 1909 of the National Hockey Association, the precursor to the National Hockey League. The team was based in Renfrew, Ontario.

Its founder, Ambrose O'Brien, a millionaire from the then-current silver and mining boom in the Cobalt area of Ontario, sought to join the new Canadian Hockey Association with his existing Renfrew team in the semi-pro Federal Hockey League, and was rejected. With fellow rejectee Montreal Wanderers, O'Brien founded the NHA, along with franchises in Cobalt, Haileybury and Montreal.
With O'Brien's money backing the Creamery Kings, Renfrew iced a powerful team its first season, with Frank Patrick and Lester Patrick commanding salaries of $3,000 each, and Cyclone Taylor receiving a record-setting $5,250 for a two-month season. In consequence the team became widely nicknamed the "millionaires." In addition, O'Brien secured the services of Newsy Lalonde midseason from the Canadiens franchise, and Lalonde would wind up the season the NHA's first scoring champion. Coached by Ottawa Senators legend and future Hall of Famer Alf Smith, Renfrew finished in third place in the 1910 season with an 8-3-1 record.

Renfrew Millionaires: History of Hockey's first Millionaires

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

To me they're 2 different teams. Same name and city maybe but 2 different teams with different histories.

They both represented Ottawa, and the former's banners now hang in the rafters of the Senators Arena..... with the NHL's approval, so I suspect most people are okay with a shared history, because they represented Ottawa.

The Ottawa Senators were founded in 1883, and due to financial issues, they had to suspend operations in 1931, and did not play for a season.

The Financial issues were directly related to having the smallest NHL market in the NHL at that time ( sound familiar?)

After a year out of the NHL, and after selling off their best player, to save cash, they played only two more seasons, and it became apparent that the franchise could not survive in Ottawa, so they relocated to St Louis, and became the Eagles.

But again, the costs of operating the franchise in St Louis was too much so the Eagles were forced to sell players to other teams to meet its financial obligations.

So after just one season in St Louis, the NHL actually bought the franchise, dispersed the players around the league and shut down the franchise ........ so I guess one could argue that when the Senators returned to the NHL, the "Senators Franchise" that was bought by the NHL in 1935 was resurrected in the Modern day Senators, and are one and the same.

 

[thinkwild]

When the Cleveland Browns Owner wanted to move the team to Baltimore because the city wouldn’t build him a new state of the art stadium, the fans were part of a law suit to ensure that the Cleveland Browns history stayed in the city, not following whatever rich white guy’s ownership paper trail could be followed.

And this thinking has carried forward to the NHL with Wpg and Que. As well as the city of Ottawa which had an NHL team at the time of the very start of the NHL. A team that won Stanley Cups. That history belongs to this city and our current franchise. A city, sure, with a 60 year break with no team. But with historical records of our origin story. That identity doesn’t flow with the men who owned the team. It belongs to the city, the team, and us the fans.

And so I proudly take the award of those 1917-34 Ottawa Senators accomplishments as rightfully ours, on behalf of the city of Ottawa and fans of the Ottawa Senators and consider them worthy. Strange that we can sometimes be hesitant to acknowledge that as if ownership paper trails are more deserved.

 

[Upgrayedd]

When the Cleveland Browns Owner wanted to move the team to Baltimore because the city wouldn’t build him a new state of the art stadium, the fans were part of a law suit to ensure that the Cleveland Browns history stayed in the city, not following whatever rich white guy’s ownership paper trail could be followed.

And this thinking has carried forward to the NHL with Wpg and Que. As well as the city of Ottawa which had an NHL team at the time of the very start of the NHL. A team that won Stanley Cups. That history belongs to this city and our current franchise. A city, sure, with a 60 year break with no team. But with historical records of our origin story. That identity doesn’t flow with the men who owned the team. It belongs to the city, the team, and us the fans.

And so I proudly take the award of those 1917-34 Ottawa Senators accomplishments as rightfully ours, on behalf of the city of Ottawa and fans of the Ottawa Senators and consider them worthy. Strange that we can sometimes be hesitant to acknowledge that as if ownership paper trails are more deserved.

Works for me...add in those random challenge cups Count brought up a couple posts up, what does that bring our cup total up to? 28?

The Ottawa Senators, the most successful NHL team of all time!

 

[dumbdick]

I don't want to sully the original team with our shitty record.

 

[Inkling]

I think it's enough to acknowledge and celebrate the hockey history of the City of Ottawa, and not the current Ottawa Senators who were reborn in 1992. I think it was too long a gap to really join the histories of both franchises. I'd be fine with the Jets reclaiming their history from Arizona; it was basically the same set of fans who cheered for both. With a few exceptions (people who were in their 80's or older) it's a completely new generation of fans. I didn't like that they had the new Senators logo on the Cup banners in the CTC and was happy when they changed them.

Next to Montreal, Ottawa probably has the richest history of hockey in the NHL and its predecessors. Nothing wrong with celebrating that.

 

[Back in Black]

Long Live the Ottawa Senators.