Value of: Taylor Hall contract extension today

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

Let's suppose Taylor Hall was in contract negotiations right now, what you expect him to make with a long term contract (7/8 years)?

A couple notable comparables would be:
Tavares: 7 years, 11mil AAV
Seguin: 8 years, 9.85mil AAV

I would fully expect him to make 10-10.5 maybe more given the season he just had. Thoughts?

Note: I do realize I'm using two C's as comparables, maybe there are better choices but these are both somewhat recent contracts.

100% hypothetical scenario.

Click to read more...

 

[A91]

NJ has a state income tax unlike Texas so I would guess itd be closer to Tavares money.
10.5-11.5 range depending on how this season goes for him.

Final guess is 8 years @ 10.5 m

 

[AKL]

People are starting to put way too much thought into state income tax on contracts on this website.

 

[Mickey Marner]

That extension is two years from now. Hall would be turning 29 in November of that season. Paying him 10+ AAV for 7/8 years of his back nine would be brutal. I wouldn't go more than 5 or 6 years.

 

[Ragdoll]

It really depends on how he plays this year imo. If he can put up numbers similar to last year then he can probably ask for something around what Seguin got.

 

[shortfuze]

People are starting to put way too much thought into state income tax on contracts on this website.

In what way? When your in a low income tax state it’s better for the team because players will sign cheaper.

 

[zar]

8 years x $11m AAV (13.8% of cap hit)

He is one of the best wingers in the game and should/would be paid like one. He wouldn't have quite the same arguments that Kane (signed @ 15.2% cap hit) but he would have some very compelling ones of his own.

The OP says TODAY... so yeah, he would get an 8 year deal if that's what he wanted... he's only 26 years only for crying out loud.

 

[Alan Wake]

People are starting to put way too much thought into state income tax on contracts on this website.

Are they? Kuch signed to a sweetheart 9.5 million aav deal...

Factor in Stamkos' 8.5m aav deal, and Hedman's 7.8m... uhh... you sure you believe state tax has no factor whatsoever?

 

[A91]

People are starting to put way too much thought into state income tax on contracts on this website.

When it comes to millions of dollars over a multi year deal I think HF evaluates state income tax a reasonable amount.

 

[Mr Positive]

I'll guess 9 million AAV, full term

 

[AKL]

In what way? When your in a low income tax state it’s better for the team because players will sign cheaper.

Are they? Kuch signed to a sweetheart 9.5 million aav deal...

Factor in Stamkos' 8.5m aav deal, and Hedman's 7.7m... uhh... you sure you believe state tax has no factor whatsoever?

There are many other factors to your take home pay. State income tax is a relatively small percentage compared to federal income tax, and then you need to consider that sales taxes and property taxes often times are higher in those states with no state income tax.

I mean, it's common sense to say that if income tax was something most players consider in great detail when signing contracts, no free agents would ever sign in Canada or California. Yet We have three teams in California and seven teams in Canada who, for the most part, have no trouble signing free agents in general.

If you think a lower state income tax automatically equates to a higher take home pay, I would recommend some lessons in economics.

As an aside, using a few points of anecdotal evidence to try to prove a point is never ever a good approach. And if your only evidence is three guys from the same team, it might be smart to consider other factors as to why they took those alleged discounts. Correlation does not equal causation.

 

[Pi]

He's going to get an 8 year deal above 10M.

 

[AKL]

When it comes to millions of dollars over a multi year deal I think HF evaluates state income tax a reasonable amount.

Then explain why Dallas, Florida, Tampa, Nashville and Las Vegas aren't attracting all best free agents, and why anyone would ever sign in Canada, New York, or California.

 

[Slyfox]

Depends on the tax situation in NJ.

 

[A91]

Then explain why Dallas, Florida, Tampa, Nashville and Las Vegas aren't attracting all best free agents, and why anyone would ever sign in Canada, New York, or California.

There are so many factors in a UFAs decision. One may decide that living in Manhattan or LA is worth a the pay cut . Likewise with the league hovering around 50% Canadian players since forever, the paycut of living in your home country and drinking a double double every morning may be worth it for many players (Tavares).

I'm referring more to players re-signing with their current teams. GMs base contract negotiations from player comparables when trying to sign their players. Taylor Hall and Seguin have been compared since they were teens. Halls agent will surely bring up the fact that Seguin lives in a state where there is 0% income tax while NJ has 9% state income tax. For 41 games of the season Hall is getting his earnings taxed 9% more than Seguin is. It's definitely a factor, im not sure how someone can think its not one.

 

[zar]

There are so many factors in a UFAs decision. One may decide that living in Manhattan or LA is worth a the pay cut . Likewise with the league hovering around 50% Canadian players since forever, the paycut of living in your home country and drinking a double double every morning may be worth it for many players (Tavares).

I'm referring more to players re-signing with their current teams. GMs base contract negotiations from player comparables when trying to sign their players. Taylor Hall and Seguin have been compared since they were teens. Halls agent will surely bring up the fact that Seguin lives in a state where there is 0% income tax while NJ has 9% state income tax. For 41 games of the season Hall is getting his earnings taxed 9% more than Seguin is. It's definitely a factor, im not sure how someone can think its not one.

Exactly... and, from my understanding, his home state tax would apply to any signing bonuses as well.

 

[Captain Controversy]

Hall will get 10.
No less.

 

[shortfuze]

There are many other factors to your take home pay. State income tax is a relatively small percentage compared to federal income tax, and then you need to consider that sales taxes and property taxes often times are higher in those states with no state income tax.

I mean, it's common sense to say that if income tax was something most players consider in great detail when signing contracts, no free agents would ever sign in Canada or California. Yet We have three teams in California and seven teams in Canada who, for the most part, have no trouble signing free agents in general.

If you think a lower state income tax automatically equates to a higher take home pay, I would recommend some lessons in economics.

As an aside, using a few points of anecdotal evidence to try to prove a point is never ever a good approach. And if your only evidence is three guys from the same team, it might be smart to consider other factors as to why they took those alleged discounts. Correlation does not equal causation.

THe difference in signing in Canada compared to California is that players get paid in American money converted to Canadian. Tavares gets paid 20 million Canadian in bonuses I believe.

 

[AKL]

There are so many factors in a UFAs decision. One may decide that living in Manhattan or LA is worth a the pay cut . Likewise with the league hovering around 50% Canadian players since forever, the paycut of living in your home country and drinking a double double every morning may be worth it for many players (Tavares).

I'm referring more to players re-signing with their current teams. GMs base contract negotiations from player comparable when trying to sign their players. Taylor Hall and Seguin have been compared since they were teens. Halls agent will surely bring up the fact that Seguin lives in a state where there is 0% income tax while NJ has 9% state income tax. For 41 games of the season Hall is getting his earnings taxed 9% more than Seguin is. It's definitely a factor, im not sure how someone can think its not one.

Because as I said, state income tax is not the only factor affecting your take home pay or how much your money is worth on a state to state basis.

 

[rent free]

Then explain why Dallas, Florida, Tampa, Nashville and Las Vegas aren't attracting all best free agents, and why anyone would ever sign in Canada, New York, or California.

there's more than just money that attract a free agent to a team. duh

 

[AKL]

there's more than just money that attract a free agent to a team. duh

Yeah, thanks for proving my point. No one cares about state income tax which usually varies by 2-3% per state. You also don't see players in general "taking discounts" to play in states with no state income tax. And no GM is going to overpay a player because some other player him and his agent think are comparable got X dollars playing in one of those states, so he should be compensated for tax.

 

[Devilsrock17]

8 years for 10 mil

 

[My3Sons]

That extension is two years from now. Hall would be turning 29 in November of that season. Paying him 10+ AAV for 7/8 years of his back nine would be brutal. I wouldn't go more than 5 or 6 years.

So then you wouldn’t sign him.

 

[Kcb12345]

I'm gonna say 8 years at $10.5m if he can maintain this level of play.

 

[rent free]

Yeah, thanks for proving my point. No one cares about state income tax which usually varies by 2-3% per state. You also don't see players in general "taking discounts" to play in states with no state income tax. And no GM is going to overpay a player because some other player him and his agent think are comparable got X dollars playing in one of those states, so he should be compensated for tax.

a lot of people carry about state income. to say no one cares about it is stupid. the more money you make, the higher discount you get and players know that. the discount is probably why seguin signed for less than 10 million. it's probably part of why kucherov and stammer signed for less than 20 million combined