Tavares in Arizona

Jamieh

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Apr 25, 2012
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Like Cobra said, money and term. Players have a short career so providing for their families is front and center most times.
Money and term for guys like this thread is about are kind a irrelevant. He can get both from half the teams in the League.
 

Jamieh

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Apr 25, 2012
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You must have a heated pool. It's hard to swim here in April and Oct. let alone in Canada. I lived in Alberta for 40+ yrs. so don't try to BS me about the weather. IF you see guns at least twice a week you must be living in the worst part of Arizona because I have lived her over 23 yrs. and I don't think I have seen someone with a gun more than five times, and if you play golf a 100 times each summer that would be playing on consecutive days which equal 3 months. I do agree with you on family. There is a reason many players retire here after their career is over, and if some prefer frigid Saskatchewan, so be it. Oh, don't forget to apply Off while playing your 1800 holes of golf.:laugh: Like they say, you have mosquitoes as big as horse flies. Excuse me while I take a dip in my pool and look at my palm trees.
Heated pool of course, although the heater rarely comes on from mid June to early Sept. I suspect people on the Prairies enjoy outdoors more in the 4 months of winter than most AZ residents do in the 4 months of summer but hey let's mot compare that right?? I play golf pretty much everyday in summer and winter and I have the gun conversation in AZ at least once a week with visitors who don't understand why they see people wearing guns in public?? I guess you have been gone awhile Jakey as It's been a few years since I have applied Off as mosquitoes just aren't what they used to be. I don't recall saying I preferred winter?? As a matter of fact I said I hate it and love AZ, but that doesn't take away the fact that plenty of people don't agree with me or you.
 
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Jakey53

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Heated pool of course, although the heater rarely comes on from mid June to early Sept. I suspect people on the Prairies enjoy outdoors more in the 4 months of winter than most AZ residents do in the 4 months of summer but hey let's mot compare that right?? I play golf pretty much everyday in summer and winter and I have the gun conversation in AZ at least once a week with visitors who don't understand why they see people wearing guns in public?? I guess you have been gone awhile Jakey as It's been a few years since I have applied Off as mosquitoes just aren't what they used to be. I don't recall saying I preferred winter?? As a matter of fact I said I hate it and love AZ, but that doesn't take away the fact that plenty of people don't agree with me or you.
Like I said each to their own. :nod:
 

mouser

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Jul 13, 2006
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Not sure of the accuracy of this, but it's a neat little tool that compares the tax rate of each NHL province/state.

Personal Income Tax Rates in NHL Cities | Gavin Group

For example, if both Toronto and Arizona offered Tavares $12M, he'd pay $5.25M tax in AZ and $6.39M in Ontario.

I didn't look through all of the teams but I believe the lowest is Florida (39%) and the highest in Quebec/Montreal (53%).

It’s highly simplistic and probably doesn’t accurately reflect what the players in different locations actually pay in taxes. Some examples being:

- Players are often taxed by other states/cities/provinces when they play there on the visiting team.

- Many locations with lower income taxes may offset those with higher taxes on other things. For example Texas has a lower income tax but significantly higher property tax rate compared to Arizona by my understanding.

- Players may have many other tax reduction tools available such as deferring salary or having salary paid into tax reducing options, tax deductions that differ by region, tax treaties between Canada or the US with other mostly European countries.


To make a long post longer: it’s a heck of a lot more complicated then someone doing a list of nominal tax rates in each NHL market.
 
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Bonsai Tree

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There is no doubt in my mind that I twisted some feathers with my comments about Arizona being a nicer place to live than Canada due to lack of media attention. My comment stems from my experience on a professional basis with about 10 to 15 families of baseball and football players. A small sample to be sure, but they were all pleased that they and their families weren't approached in my office, in Fry's or at the kids soccer/little league games. (Mods please feel free to IM me if you need details of my claim). Now most basketball players can't blend in due to their height, but the baseball players and football players, and I assume hockey players can blend in because they look like they are in really good shape and some are taller than average, but not basketball height.
 

The Feckless Puck

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Bottom line is that living and playing here is highly desirable but it comes down to term and money.

The biggest factor for UFAs right now signing or not signing here is the future of the team in the market, more than term or money. These guys don't want to relocate their families to Arizona, only to have to move again in another year or two. You may believe that the team's here forever, and that's fine, but UFAs see the headlines and don't want to make a commitment here until they know they're not in a Slap Shot situation.
 

cobra427

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May 6, 2012
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The biggest factor for UFAs right now signing or not signing here is the future of the team in the market, more than term or money. These guys don't want to relocate their families to Arizona, only to have to move again in another year or two. You may believe that the team's here forever, and that's fine, but UFAs see the headlines and don't want to make a commitment here until they know they're not in a Slap Shot situation.
The team is staying here, all players know that. The NHL isn't moving the team. They would have moved the team at least 3 times already. If you never read this forum or the BOH, you wouldn't think the team is moving either. It's not a factor for UFA's.

Name a player that said "AZ offered me 6 years and 6 mill, but I took the same deal or a lesser deal like 5 years and 5 mill from whoever, because I wasn't sure the team was staying in AZ". I am telling you it has never happened. We don't make the best offer ever for high end UFA's because we have no money.
 

MIGs Dog

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In all seriousness: good Lord, man, where do you go? (And followup: why on earth do you keep going back twice a week?)

I was walking down Allen St the other day and saw this.

OK-Corral.jpg
 
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Jamieh

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Apr 25, 2012
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In all seriousness: good Lord, man, where do you go? (And followup: why on earth do you keep going back twice a week?)
Grocery stores, motorcycles on freeway, movie theater, and Wal-Mart are places I've seen people with guns recently. Why do you suppose there are so many businesses with signs out saying guns not allowed if people don't wear their guns? I've been on golf courses where guys have guns in their golf bags.
 

MIGs Dog

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Grocery stores, motorcycles on freeway, movie theater, and Wal-Mart are places I've seen people with guns recently. Why do you suppose there are so many businesses with signs out saying guns not allowed if people don't wear their guns? I've been on golf courses where guys have guns in their golf bags.

Do you travel to other states? It's not just Arizona.
 

Jamieh

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Apr 25, 2012
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Do you travel to other states? It's not just Arizona.
Don't recall saying it was just AZ? It was just one simple example of something someone might not like about AZ. I love AZ but I don't assume everyone else does as it has It's warts like every other place. But too be honest in my travels I don't recall ever seeing ordinary Joe wearing a gun while grocery shopping like I do in AZ.
 

Jakey53

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Aug 27, 2011
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The biggest factor for UFAs right now signing or not signing here is the future of the team in the market, more than term or money. These guys don't want to relocate their families to Arizona, only to have to move again in another year or two. You may believe that the team's here forever, and that's fine, but UFAs see the headlines and don't want to make a commitment here until they know they're not in a Slap Shot situation.
Show we the money! That's what it comes down to most of the time. Players want to set up their families for financial freedom when their career is over.
 

Jakey53

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Aug 27, 2011
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The team is staying here, all players know that. The NHL isn't moving the team. They would have moved the team at least 3 times already. If you never read this forum or the BOH, you wouldn't think the team is moving either. It's not a factor for UFA's.

Name a player that said "AZ offered me 6 years and 6 mill, but I took the same deal or a lesser deal like 5 years and 5 mill from whoever, because I wasn't sure the team was staying in AZ". I am telling you it has never happened. We don't make the best offer ever for high end UFA's because we have no money.
Give this man a $5 cigar.:laugh:
 

Jamieh

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Apr 25, 2012
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Show we the money! That's what it comes down to most of the time. Players want to set up their families for financial freedom when their career is over.
For top end free agents such as Tavares the money will be there from numerous teams, he isn't picking based on contract. Every year lately there is a player that takes less contract go pick his destination. They don't always work out such as Lucic, Clarkson, and so on. Last year it was Stamkos choosing to stay in Tampa and turning down higher offers from Toronto as an example.
 

Jakey53

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Aug 27, 2011
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Grocery stores, motorcycles on freeway, movie theater, and Wal-Mart are places I've seen people with guns recently. Why do you suppose there are so many businesses with signs out saying guns not allowed if people don't wear their guns? I've been on golf courses where guys have guns in their golf bags.
Time to get out of Dodge.
 

Jamieh

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Apr 25, 2012
11,231
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Time to get out of Dodge.
It's all good now, my Wife and I are back home in the safety of not seeing guns while living in the murde capital of Canada!!!! The guns don't bother me, I don't undestand the need to carry them, but they don't bother me.
 

Jakey53

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Aug 27, 2011
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Don't recall saying it was just AZ? It was just one simple example of something someone might not like about AZ. I love AZ but I don't assume everyone else does as it has It's warts like every other place. But too be honest in my travels I don't recall ever seeing ordinary Joe wearing a gun while grocery shopping like I do in AZ.
I guess if your travels are Saskatoon, Prince Albert, Swift Current, Maple Creek, Regina, Meadow Lake and Prince Albert you may not see the ordinary Joe wearing guns, UNTIL the hunting season.
 

cobra427

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May 6, 2012
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For top end free agents such as Tavares the money will be there from numerous teams, he isn't picking based on contract. Every year lately there is a player that takes less contract go pick his destination. They don't always work out such as Lucic, Clarkson, and so on. Last year it was Stamkos choosing to stay in Tampa and turning down higher offers from Toronto as an example.
Lucic and Clarkson signed to the highest bidder and so did Stamkos. The tax savings in Florida plus the 8 year term made it the highest bid.

I think Tavares will go to the highest bidder. If it isn't on the Island, somebody will have to pay more per year because they can't match 8 years. His avg could be less on the Island but more in total dollars. The equation is total dollars divided by years multiplied by tax rate= winning bid. Every dollar still matters when your talking 10 mill roughly per year. It's not like the NBA where you get 25 mill from one team and 28 mill from another, because at those levels, what's the difference.

Doan is the only player I can think of that took a home town discount to stay here 5 years ago. i am sure there are others, but its in the few percent range just like anyone that would rather live in Edmonton versus AZ because of the weather.
 

Jamieh

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Apr 25, 2012
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Lucic and Clarkson signed to the highest bidder and so did Stamkos. The tax savings in Florida plus the 8 year term made it the highest bid.

I think Tavares will go to the highest bidder. If it isn't on the Island, somebody will have to pay more per year because they can't match 8 years. His avg could be less on the Island but more in total dollars. The equation is total dollars divided by years multiplied by tax rate= winning bid. Every dollar still matters when your talking 10 mill roughly per year. It's not like the NBA where you get 25 mill from one team and 28 mill from another, because at those levels, what's the difference.

Doan is the only player I can think of that took a home town discount to stay here 5 years ago. i am sure there are others, but its in the few percent range just like anyone that would rather live in Edmonton versus AZ.
Wrong. Clarkson was offered more by Edmonton which has better taxes than Toronto. Lucic was offered more by Montreal, not sure if it was enough to compensate for tax difference?? Stamkos was offered $3 million more per season by Toronto, combine that with increased marketing opportunities and he left some major coin on the table.
 

Jamieh

Registered User
Apr 25, 2012
11,231
6,259
Lucic and Clarkson signed to the highest bidder and so did Stamkos. The tax savings in Florida plus the 8 year term made it the highest bid.

I think Tavares will go to the highest bidder. If it isn't on the Island, somebody will have to pay more per year because they can't match 8 years. His avg could be less on the Island but more in total dollars. The equation is total dollars divided by years multiplied by tax rate= winning bid. Every dollar still matters when your talking 10 mill roughly per year. It's not like the NBA where you get 25 mill from one team and 28 mill from another, because at those levels, what's the difference.

Doan is the only player I can think of that took a home town discount to stay here 5 years ago. i am sure there are others, but its in the few percent range just like anyone that would rather live in Edmonton versus AZ because of the weather.
Danny Cleary took a major discount to stay in Detroit rather than sign in Philly.
 

Jakey53

Registered User
Aug 27, 2011
29,977
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It's all good now, my Wife and I are back home in the safety of not seeing guns while living in the murde capital of Canada!!!! The guns don't bother me, I don't undestand the need to carry them, but they don't bother me.
:)I agree, there is a gun problem in the US. I thought Winterpeg has that title?
 

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