Tavares: He has yet to Dominate, yet......

[scott99]

He's tied for 2nd in the NHL in scoring, how the hell is that possible ? I've been on his case this year, because Tavares has yet to dominate, we haven't seen a hat trick, we haven't seen a big game from him. Yeah he had a 2 goal game, but I don't think he's even had a 3 point game yet. YET, look where he is , top 5. I don't know how he does it, must be the quietest superstar in hockey.

I remember Sidney saying there were junior games where Tavares looks invisible, yet you look at the boxscore and he has 1 goal and 1 assist. And now I see what he means. But despite the production, I still have an empty feeling, I still think he can do more, and I am still waiting for him to go beast mode like he sometimes did in 2011-12 and last year. Maybe I'm just spoiled, but it seems like he isn't doing what he's capable of.

Click to read more...

 

[lacunacoil777]

we could always trade him away for a older slower veteran who doesn't want to be here like we did with TUrgeon. ALso the reason you don't notice him is because his skating is below average, compared to most top six skaters, his hitting is below average, so all you would notice is the passes and goals.

 

[SI90]

I have been on his case too....

Some guys just have knack for scoring and Talent is Talent....

I think people want him to shoot more like he did last year....

 

[Sheva7]

I'm done judging players performances until Snow dumps Cappy. There's just no point. They are ALL playing well below the level they're capable of. No confidence, no jam, no nothing. Weak weak weak all of them - that's on the coach and he knows it.

 

[Paulinho]

He really needs to work on his faceoffs, my only complaint.

 

[PK Cronin]

I don't know what games you guys are watching, seriously. What do you want him to do? Don't know if you guys noticed, but no superstar dominates all the time and takes over every game. Crosby with his hot start has slumped. Malkin has been slumping all season. I just don't know what you guys want.

If you think other stars do more than he does, you're probably just watching highlights most of the time.

 

[Tavares2TheRescue]

Wow, pretty amazing that he's so high up in points. Doesn't feel like he's been that explosive so far this season (not that he's been bad or anything).

 

[Benedict Kovalchuk]

I don't know what games you guys are watching, seriously. What do you want him to do? Don't know if you guys noticed, but no superstar dominates all the time and takes over every game. Crosby with his hot start has slumped. Malkin has been slumping all season. I just don't know what you guys want.

If you think other stars do more than he does, you're probably just watching highlights most of the time.

I agree completely. Sure has had no huge multi point games, but let's be honest here, the guy is a threat every time he is on the ice.

At 2nd in the league for scoring I am certainly not complaining.

 

[steveat]

Jt is such a humble player. He only shines when his team mates shine. ie..whenever we've seen JT have a spectacular game, it's because everyone played a spectacular game. Lafontaine on the other hand was a one man show. Not saying he was greedy, he just had no one to play with.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

I don't get it.

Even if Johnny was pulling a Gretzky night in and night out some people would complain. The guy is putting up points and more than a ppg clip and you guys still want more. I'd love to see where this team is in the standings with out him. Get real.

 

[Riseonfire]

It's his style. He'll never wow you like Kovalchuk or Ovechkin can. He gets his points by setting up in the zone, cycling and finding the open man or open space.

If your looking for an end to end rush, putting the D's jockstrap in the rafters you'll be waiting a while.

I'm fine with that because it's harder to shut down intelligence.

 

[BTrotts19]

I don't get it.

Even if Johnny was pulling a Gretzky night in and night out some people would complain. The guy is putting up points and more than a ppg clip and you guys still want more. I'd love to see where this team is in the standings with out him. Get real.

This. He may not be dominating, he is just putting up 1-2 points almost every night. With the mugging he gets on a nightly basis, its pretty amazing how consistent he is. The only thing more he could do is work on his faceoffs--Cindy C. definitely is better in that aspect.

 

[SDIsles34]

It's his style. He'll never wow you like Kovalchuk or Ovechkin can. He gets his points by setting up in the zone, cycling and finding the open man or open space.

Speak for yourself.

John Tavares has wow factor. He is constantly making incredible moves to keep control of the puck and elude defenders. Most impressive is his ability to see the ice, find his teammates and anticipate the play. He is a WOW player in my opinion.

 

[Doshell Propivo]

They are ALL playing well below the level they're capable of.

Umm, no, they're not. Look at the roster objectively...

 

[19NYSports91]

As usual people look at the negatives rather than the positives. Tavares has been consistently good, just because he didn't score 3 points in a game doesn't mean he hasn't been great. He had some great games this year, and some not so great.

He has at least 1 point in 17 out of 20 games, if that's not impressive then Idk what to tell you. Sidney Crosby has at least 1 point in 14 out of 18 games.

Did you guys not see that beauty of a pass last night? That pass was insanely good.

 

[19NYSports91]

It's his style. He'll never wow you like Kovalchuk or Ovechkin can. He gets his points by setting up in the zone, cycling and finding the open man or open space.

If your looking for an end to end rush, putting the D's jockstrap in the rafters you'll be waiting a while.

I'm fine with that because it's harder to shut down intelligence.

From last night, look how perfect this pass is in a lot of traffic.

 

[SDIsles34]

From last night, look how perfect this pass is in a lot of traffic.

I'm sure there are hundreds of videos like this showing JT's ability to WOW!

 

[scott99]

I'm not knocking the guy, you will never find a bigger JT fan than me. It just seems like he's not dominating like he did in 2011-12 and parts of last year, and yet despite that, he's tied for 2nd in scoring. I guess it's because he does it so effortlessly, it seems like he isn't doing much, yet you look at the stats, and there he is. It's quite possible the difference between those years and this year is, he's not going through those peaks and valleys (scoring a lot, then not scoring points for a bunch of games) he did those years.

Like I said, not knocking the guy, he's so smooth and effortless, that sometimes it looks like he's not doing much. I like the Howie Rose analogy, he said he's like Walt "Clyde" Frazier on skates. And those of you old enough to remember how smooth and creative Clyde was, you'd understand the analogy. Also to add, even though it looks effortless, it's JT's hard work at learning those skills that makes it look so smooth and effortless. JT is simply amazing, that pass to Ness was an elite move. Love the guy.

But like I said, there hasn't been that one JT Beast mode game yet, and when that comes, that may propel JT to the #1 spot in league scoring, that would be amazing.

 

[Moulstache]

Is this seriously a thread questioning JT? With all of the problems we currently have, he's the last guy that should be looked at. Especially when he's producing.

 

[redbull]

Is this seriously a thread questioning JT? With all of the problems we currently have, he's the last guy that should be looked at. Especially when he's producing.

scott99 is being misunderstood here. He's not suggesting JT isn't playing well or is having a bad season. The key point that he's trying to put forth is that it's AMAZING that Tavares is 2nd in league scoring considering he hasn't even played close to HIS BEST this season.

And I agree with him.

Tavares hasn't played even close to HIS BEST. I think he was at his best in 2011-12, even better than last year's "Hart-nomination" year. That first line sucked last year but Tavares was outstanding, he still carried that team for the first half and the line the whole year (the line sucked in the stretch run).

Tavares hasn't put together a hot streak this year, and he'll definitely go on one of those runs sooner than later. He hasn't slumped at all, which he's done in the past, but has had 2-3 "bad games" - by his standards. Games where he didn't get much done, had some giveaways, took long shifts, forced passes through sticks and low percentage shots. Yet, he's managed some points in those games.

The "beast mode" that is commonly referred to on these boards - well, we haven't seen that, YET.

But I'd say he's been excellent this year. His ability to create offensive opportunities is as good as anyone in hockey.

And I still think he's got terrible linemates that don't complement his game. I'd say Nelson is the closest he's had since he's been an Islander - but he's too inexperienced and raw at the NHL level.

Better linemates would get him more points, but he's still a superstar, whether he gets the extra 10-15pts or not.

Crosby plays with Dupuis and Kunitz and they aren't big names and aren't offensively talented (Kunitz is pretty good but certainly not elite) but they complement Sid's game nicely. JT would do better with those two than he does with KO-Moulson. With Vanek, well, it remains to be seen.

I also think TricycleDriveBy makes a great point. Sometimes we look at box scores and highlights of other players and think "oh, why can't Tavares have games like that"? - which is unfair. Because even Datsyuk, Toews, Crosby, Malkin, Giroux, Sedins, Kessel - they all go through games where they are ineffective.

And I watch a lot of hockey and other teams - I'd say JT is among the most consistent "superstars" out there. The best being, in my opinion, Crosby, Datsyuk, Toews, Bergeron and Tavares. These guys tend to stand out even when they aren't getting points. Tavares is one of the few who can often get points even though he doesn't stand out though.

 

[BMOK33]

Yup, this very thing shocked me a few days ago, its a combination of two things, scoring is down from what it was say 15-20 years ago when guys would score 60-75 goals like it was nothing and put up 130-150 points because 6 other guys on their team would also score 25 goals. But also, there are not a whole lot of true blow you away natural goal scorers right now in the league, Stamkos is about your only guy, Ovechkin was one of them but he is definitely past his prime now. Just look at some of the top guns like Toews, Crosby, Kane, or Tavares now...none of these guys have a blow you away shot, rarely will you see them score from 30-40 feet out like you saw a Kovalchuk, Ovechkin, Jagr or Heatley do. They are overall better play makers than any of those guys however minus Jagr who was damn good at both. I still say JT is 2nd in the league talent wise behind Crosby, both guys are so similar in how they always seem to be in the right place in front of the net and how most of their goals seem to come from within 10 feet of the net.

 

[scott99]

scott99 is being misunderstood here. He's not suggesting JT isn't playing well or is having a bad season. The key point that he's trying to put forth is that it's AMAZING that Tavares is 2nd in league scoring considering he hasn't even played close to HIS BEST this season.

And I agree with him.

Tavares hasn't played even close to HIS BEST. I think he was at his best in 2011-12, even better than last year's "Hart-nomination" year. That first line sucked last year but Tavares was outstanding, he still carried that team for the first half and the line the whole year (the line sucked in the stretch run).

Tavares hasn't put together a hot streak this year, and he'll definitely go on one of those runs sooner than later. He hasn't slumped at all, which he's done in the past, but has had 2-3 "bad games" - by his standards. Games where he didn't get much done, had some giveaways, took long shifts, forced passes through sticks and low percentage shots. Yet, he's managed some points in those games.

The "beast mode" that is commonly referred to on these boards - well, we haven't seen that, YET.

But I'd say he's been excellent this year. His ability to create offensive opportunities is as good as anyone in hockey.

And I still think he's got terrible linemates that don't complement his game. I'd say Nelson is the closest he's had since he's been an Islander - but he's too inexperienced and raw at the NHL level.

Better linemates would get him more points, but he's still a superstar, whether he gets the extra 10-15pts or not.

Crosby plays with Dupuis and Kunitz and they aren't big names and aren't offensively talented (Kunitz is pretty good but certainly not elite) but they complement Sid's game nicely. JT would do better with those two than he does with KO-Moulson. With Vanek, well, it remains to be seen.

I also think TricycleDriveBy makes a great point. Sometimes we look at box scores and highlights of other players and think "oh, why can't Tavares have games like that"? - which is unfair. Because even Datsyuk, Toews, Crosby, Malkin, Giroux, Sedins, Kessel - they all go through games where they are ineffective.

And I watch a lot of hockey and other teams - I'd say JT is among the most consistent "superstars" out there. The best being, in my opinion, Crosby, Datsyuk, Toews, Bergeron and Tavares. These guys tend to stand out even when they aren't getting points. Tavares is one of the few who can often get points even though he doesn't stand out though.

Thanks redbull for eloquently saying what I said, but apparently I butchered it. There were games in 2011-12 where JT would not be denied. I remmeber going to an Islander's-Ranger's game in October 2011, where JT singlehandedly dominated the game, scored 3 goals and 2 assists, and none of those plays where he got points were the most impressive part of the game. There was a play where JT came in 1-3 and and bulled his way through 3 Rangers, practically throwing them out of the way. That's when I knew he had truly arrived, it was a beast move and he was in beast mode.

Haven't really seen Tavares do that this year, though he's been incredibly productive, and done some amazing things.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

scott99 is being misunderstood here. He's not suggesting JT isn't playing well or is having a bad season. The key point that he's trying to put forth is that it's AMAZING that Tavares is 2nd in league scoring considering he hasn't even played close to HIS BEST this season.

And I agree with him.

Tavares hasn't played even close to HIS BEST. I think he was at his best in 2011-12, even better than last year's "Hart-nomination" year. That first line sucked last year but Tavares was outstanding, he still carried that team for the first half and the line the whole year (the line sucked in the stretch run).

Tavares hasn't put together a hot streak this year, and he'll definitely go on one of those runs sooner than later. He hasn't slumped at all, which he's done in the past, but has had 2-3 "bad games" - by his standards. Games where he didn't get much done, had some giveaways, took long shifts, forced passes through sticks and low percentage shots. Yet, he's managed some points in those games.

The "beast mode" that is commonly referred to on these boards - well, we haven't seen that, YET.

But I'd say he's been excellent this year. His ability to create offensive opportunities is as good as anyone in hockey.

And I still think he's got terrible linemates that don't complement his game. I'd say Nelson is the closest he's had since he's been an Islander - but he's too inexperienced and raw at the NHL level.

Better linemates would get him more points, but he's still a superstar, whether he gets the extra 10-15pts or not.

Crosby plays with Dupuis and Kunitz and they aren't big names and aren't offensively talented (Kunitz is pretty good but certainly not elite) but they complement Sid's game nicely. JT would do better with those two than he does with KO-Moulson. With Vanek, well, it remains to be seen.

I also think TricycleDriveBy makes a great point. Sometimes we look at box scores and highlights of other players and think "oh, why can't Tavares have games like that"? - which is unfair. Because even Datsyuk, Toews, Crosby, Malkin, Giroux, Sedins, Kessel - they all go through games where they are ineffective.

And I watch a lot of hockey and other teams - I'd say JT is among the most consistent "superstars" out there. The best being, in my opinion, Crosby, Datsyuk, Toews, Bergeron and Tavares. These guys tend to stand out even when they aren't getting points. Tavares is one of the few who can often get points even though he doesn't stand out though.

You can have Dupuis and his sand wedge he uses for a hockey stick if you want.

 

[redbull]

Thanks redbull for eloquently saying what I said, but apparently I butchered it. There were games in 2011-12 where JT would not be denied. I remmeber going to an Islander's-Ranger's game in October 2011, where JT singlehandedly dominated the game, scored 3 goals and 2 assists, and none of those plays where he got points were the most impressive part of the game. There was a play where JT came in 1-3 and and bulled his way through 3 Rangers, practically throwing them out of the way. That's when I knew he had truly arrived, it was a beast move and he was in beast mode.

Haven't really seen Tavares do that this year, though he's been incredibly productive, and done some amazing things.

2010-11 there were a few weeks at a time where JT looked almost Gretzky-like. Maybe not CLOSE, but closer than a lot of players I've seen since Mario. Specifically how dominant he was along the boards, winning puck battles, spinning off checks and setting up players with a tape-to-tape pass. Unreal.

He also went through some slumps though. The slumps seem to be gone and he's able to produce even when he's not dominant. But when he starts to dominate (and it will happen) we'll see a whole other level. Especially if he can get some chemistry with a talented guy like Vanek.

You can have Dupuis and his sand wedge he uses for a hockey stick if you want.

looks more like a 60 degree lob wedge. Dupuis has hands of stone, he costs Crosby a few assists each week. But I do love his hustle and tenacity on pucks, that whole line really!

I know Pens fans can't stand Bylsma, his line choices, and it's the same on a lot of boards (especially after losses)....but Sid gets largely underrated for how good he is because of his linemates as well. He's a one-man-show on that line just as much as Tavares is for the Islanders. I'm just glad Boyes and Moulson are gone, those two were unwatchable 5on5.

I really wanted to see Tavares - Crosby - Stamkos in Sochi.

 

[Goombha]

Yup, this very thing shocked me a few days ago, its a combination of two things, scoring is down from what it was say 15-20 years ago when guys would score 60-75 goals like it was nothing and put up 130-150 points because 6 other guys on their team would also score 25 goals. But also, there are not a whole lot of true blow you away natural goal scorers right now in the league, Stamkos is about your only guy, Ovechkin was one of them but he is definitely past his prime now. Just look at some of the top guns like Toews, Crosby, Kane, or Tavares now...none of these guys have a blow you away shot, rarely will you see them score from 30-40 feet out like you saw a Kovalchuk, Ovechkin, Jagr or Heatley do. They are overall better play makers than any of those guys however minus Jagr who was damn good at both. I still say JT is 2nd in the league talent wise behind Crosby, both guys are so similar in how they always seem to be in the right place in front of the net and how most of their goals seem to come from within 10 feet of the net.

Here's an analogy for you: you're watching two teams playing hockey, all the players on both teams are wearing white - except one player - he's wearing black. As you watch the game, what do you see? You see the guy in black, everything else is invisible. That's what it was like watching Mario Lemieux play. I love the Islanders, love Tavares, I'm just much more critical when throwing around the elite word.