Helene St. James Tatar the latest Detroit castoff to disappoint

Hen Kolland

Registered User
Feb 22, 2018
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You're complaining about players that will be playing no part in this team's eventually turnaround. No one cares about Sheahan or Nielsen or Nyquist. Who cares? They need to be off the team and, in time, they will be. Complaining about contract signings from three years ago when this team is clearly headed in a different, younger direction, is a complete waste of time.

I'll disagree to an extent. You're just looking to argue for the sake of arguing, and that's fine. What's done is done, but why are you glossing over obvious mistakes from a management perspective? Yes a majority of our building needs to be able to build through the draft and it will take time to reach the end goal, but cap flexibility has always been a big deal, and it's going to continue being more and more and more invaluable. The trickle down impact of over-signing or over-spending can hurt for years, whether you are a contender or rebuilding.

Passively sitting on our asses waiting for bad contracts to expire in 5 years is pretty stupid when you consider that it all could have been prevented if we didn't have poor decisions in the past.
 

ShelbyZ

Registered User
Apr 8, 2015
3,812
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IMO, the Sheahan situation was going to bring heat to Holland no matter how it shook out, regardless of the cap situation. Let's look at different scenarios:

A. Holland finds a way to keep Sheahan and he has another terrible to mediocre season: His trade value goes down even lower and if they can't get rid of him, they face having to give him a $2.075M qualifying offer that he likely isn't worth. Obviously, Red Wings fans would be torching Holland for not taking what he could get when GMs were apparently calling at the 2017 trade deadline, or when the Pens were looking for a 3C candidate. "Poor asset management!"

B. Holland finds a way to keep Sheahan and he has a rebound year: During Sheahans resurgence, Holland would of course get heat for all the players (regardless of where their careers ended up) he seemingly gave up on at or younger than Sheahans age. "See that's why they should've kept guys like Pulkkinen and Mrazek around!" That all ends however, when Holland then rewards Sheahan with a contract of questionable value and term. Once into that contract, at the first sign of struggle, Sheahan never recovers from being "another bad contract", which becomes another stain for Holland. "That's why you never give depth guys a a big extension!"

C. Holland trades Sheahan and he continues to play poorly for his new team: Most would probably be accepting of the return, but Holland would none the less be unforgiven for not having a crystal ball at the 2010 draft to show him that Sheahan would be another wasted 1st round pick, and he'd probably even get heat for not trading Riley when he regressed a bit after the 15/16.

D. What actually transpired, Holland trades Sheahan, who rebounds playing for his new team: Red Wings fans who were likely vocal in their displeasure of Sheahans 16/17 usage and overall season and wanted him gone for the best possible return, now turn their frustration to Holland for putting the team in a situation where he had to get rid of a player those fans wanted gone anyway. Narratives start to shift from "Why are AA and Mantha getting benched while no goals Sheahan gets 15+ minutes a night?!" or "Sheahan isn't scoring, why do they continue to put him on the PP?" to "He just wasn't used properly. Too many centers. Not put in a role to use his best abilities. If Holland hadn't signed Daley he'd still be here."


No matter what Holland did with Sheahan, it was going to be like tossing a boomerang covered in razor wire in a completely dark room. It was bound to come back and draw blood.
 
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Cyborg Yzerberg

Registered User
Nov 8, 2007
11,151
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Philadelphia
I was always a Sheahan apologist, but it is what it is folks. This is a terrible team, 9 times out of 10, players are going to look a lot better on another team than they do here, just because they will have the supporting players to help nurture their game. Pittsburgh is a top 10 team in the league with the best center depth in the entire league, of course Sheahan's weaknesses would be a little more protected than playing behind 37 year old Zetterberg, Larkin, and Nielsen.
 

Avery Rule

Registered User
Jun 1, 2010
1,046
194
I will never feel bad about Tatar being successful considering what we were able to get for him. Good for him. I hope he keeps it up.
Same, I liked him and remember when they drafted him how anxious I was for him to play in Detroit.
 

golffuul

Registered User
Oct 24, 2011
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If anyone feels bad it should be Vegas.
Yeah...not sure that Vegas didn't panic a bit at the loss of Neal and Perron and give up too much for Pacioretty considering Tatar's play, plus they also got Suzuki AND a 2nd round pick. Seriously doing Montreal a huge favor on a number of levels. Not surprised at Montreal's record. The last 2 seasons felt like a gong show was going on in the locker room, considering the team was usually a playoff contender every year and hadn't lost THAT much talent to suddenly look like a bottom 3 team.
 

Flowah

Registered User
Nov 30, 2009
10,249
547
Yeah...not sure that Vegas didn't panic a bit at the loss of Neal and Perron and give up too much for Pacioretty considering Tatar's play, plus they also got Suzuki AND a 2nd round pick
Plus the picks they gave to us for Tatar in the first place.

If they'd held on to Tatar maybe he gels better with a full camp and practice and whatever. Instead they gave up more decent assets to trade him for someone who isn't doing nearly as much for them as Tatar is for Montreal.
 
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golffuul

Registered User
Oct 24, 2011
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Plus the picks they gave to us for Tatar in the first place.

If they'd held on to Tatar maybe he gels better with a full camp and practice and whatever. Instead they gave up more decent assets to trade him for someone who isn't doing nearly as much for them as Tatar is for Montreal.
Yeah...considering we parlayed the 1st rounder into Veleno and we still have next draft's 2nd and 2021's 3rd....that's a lot of assets to lose for a guy labeled as a "Black Cloud" in Montreal.
 

Shaman464

No u
May 1, 2009
10,252
4,454
Boston, MA
Wait, a player that is traded on a team that is built on extreme chemistry is having a hard time? In other news water is wet. HSJ if you are reading this don't scoop me on that one.

Quoting myself from April. This article was way way way too soon and demonstrated a complete lack of understanding of what made Vegas special last season.
 

Lil Sebastian Cossa

Opinions are share are my own personal opinions.
Jul 6, 2012
11,436
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I mean, it's sports reporting. Are you really expecting Woodward and Bernstein?

And frankly, I'd rather take a non-story version of article that HSJ or Khan or whoever writes over the ass-dribblings that the hack Carlos Monarrez puts out. If I want unbiased hockey news about Detroit, I'll go to the Athletic, I'll go to ESPN, I'll listen to stuff like the Bobcast. If I'm reading the Detroit News or Free Press or a new release on Fox Sports Detroit, I kinda know what I'm in for.

The whole "they only ask softball questions" thing is nonsense to me. I guess that's mostly because I know that if you ask the team, you're just gonna get a bull**** answer because most of the times the question is merely a matter of opinion. If something happens that is objectively wrong (like the Wings sign a dude who hits on his wife like Probert hit on Domi), there will be outcry.

Something I never understand is the complaints about a homer-istic lean to regional sports coverage. FSD covers basically only Detroit, has several former Detroit athletes as personalities, and has exclusive rights to cover everything but the NFL in Detroit. So, they, I'd think reasonably so, want Detroit to win or to sell to the fans that watch that Detroit has a chance to win. So, what do they have to gain by going on the air and lambasting the team (absent the current team giving up or playing in an embarrassing manner)?

If I want "hard questions" asked, I'll let the national guys do it. What successful team has ever changed a damn thing they do because the papers said mean things to them?
 

Claypool

Registered User
Jan 12, 2009
13,670
4,352
I mean, it's sports reporting. Are you really expecting Woodward and Bernstein?

I expect unbiased and agenda-less reporting. HSJ pushes agendas about certain players. She loves Jimmy Howard so much that she can't bring herself to write one negative article about him. Meanwhile, she wrote at least one article every season about how the Red Wings should trade Tatar and re-sign Dan Cleary. She's god awful.
 

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