Talented Team with some Fundamental Flaws

[TCB]

We were talking about UFA’s the B’s might be interested in within our text group. One name that DKH brought up was Brandon Tanev. The B’s supposedly really like him, and tried to sign him out of college.

He’s not an overly exciting name, but he is physical (278 hits) has an edge, can skate, blocks shots, can kill penalties, and chipped in 14 goals for WPG. He would be a better LH version of Wagner and would be a big upgrade on Acciari imo.

I'm sure Frederic would volunteer to pick him up at the airport.

 

[TCB]

They win tomorrow they are favorites to win the Cup

Year early but I’ll take it

I hope they don't go in with this kind of mentality. Playoffs is a whole new animal and though they probably would be the favorite on paper. As Tampa found out that doesn't mean $hit.

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

Why is Heinen included with a group of unproven rookies? I think he's proven that he is a solid middle 5-9 roster guy already. It's time to stop including him as this player who still has to prove whether he's an NHLer or not. He's proven it.

Hes definitely had 50-60 quality games in the nhl... and then around the same number where many were wanting him benched or sent back to ahl

Lets hope we see a consistent 60-65 games out of him this year where we arent all saying he needs to be better

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

So you didn't really learn anything from this year, where they still don't have a second line RW and while they had to only give up Donato for Coyle he was an asset that could have been used to address other needs.

Counting on unproven prospects hurt them this year and if they do the same thing next year it will hurt them again. What have any of the guys you mention (outside of Heinen who was overvalued and is a third line checker) shown to indicate they can step into middle of the roster spots. By all means give any of them a look over the course of the season on the fourth line but don't just think one of them is going to win a spot and become a top 9 player. If you give them that chance and one or two run with it that's great, not having alternatives is not a great idea.

They need to add a 2RW at minimum this off season, ideally they will add Michael Ferland as well, if not Tanev is a decent back up plan. Don't overvalue prospects when you have a GM who doesn't like trading young talent to get better and is not very good at adjusting during the season.

I dont mind your love affair with tough hockey players... i like them too

I do wonder how you plan to pay for your desired roster idea

If cap goes up... and if mcavoy doesnt completely blow the payscale... we should come in on budget

And i think we can afford debrusk next year too if we unload backes

But if you are planning to bring in additional 5 and 6 mill players you better have a plan

Also watch the expansion draft coming up... we are deep now and we are going to lose someone good. If we sign some guy with a nmc it just increases the guy we lose to expansion

Theres a reason why all teams are flawed. Cap is real. Tampa got deep by letting their kids fill holes. Washington and pittsburgh won cups by letting kids fill holes

We are an upcoming team because kids like pastrnak, mcavoy, carlo, debusk have jumped into holes the last 3-4 seasons but we still need 2-3 more kids to step up

Lets hope they do because thats when we might have a 2-3 cup run to celebrate

In meantime if an afforable free agent like john moore or jaroslav halak can help then sure... but look at our ufa signings the last 10 years since chara... honestly, you still think its the answer?

Develop kids... keep some... trade some... be good at that

Ufa land is where you add your next backes/lapointe

 

[Dr Hook]

Ufa land is where you add your next backes/lapointe

I think we can all agree this is not what we want

 

[GloryDaze4877]

I'm sure Frederic would volunteer to pick him up at the airport.

I’m a big Frederic fan, but he needs to earn his spot, just like everyone else.

 

[ODAAT]

I'm sure Frederic would volunteer to pick him up at the airport.

while I liked a few things from Frederic, his overall game tells me he needs more time and Tanev, at this stage, is a much better NHL player

 

[prizminferno]

We have plenty of time to wait on Frederic with Coyle signed for another year and Jack potentially a C

 

[TCB]

I’m a big Frederic fan, but he needs to earn his spot, just like everyone else.

 

[TCB]

while I liked a few things from Frederic, his overall game tells me he needs more time and Tanev, at this stage, is a much better NHL player

Slow down I wasn't compering the two.

I guess I should of used the

Ding/Ding
Frederic tuning up Tanev

 

[Fenian24]

I dont mind your love affair with tough hockey players... i like them too

I do wonder how you plan to pay for your desired roster idea

If cap goes up... and if mcavoy doesnt completely blow the payscale... we should come in on budget

And i think we can afford debrusk next year too if we unload backes

But if you are planning to bring in additional 5 and 6 mill players you better have a plan

Also watch the expansion draft coming up... we are deep now and we are going to lose someone good. If we sign some guy with a nmc it just increases the guy we lose to expansion

Theres a reason why all teams are flawed. Cap is real. Tampa got deep by letting their kids fill holes. Washington and pittsburgh won cups by letting kids fill holes

We are an upcoming team because kids like pastrnak, mcavoy, carlo, debusk have jumped into holes the last 3-4 seasons but we still need 2-3 more kids to step up

Lets hope they do because thats when we might have a 2-3 cup run to celebrate

In meantime if an afforable free agent like john moore or jaroslav halak can help then sure... but look at our ufa signings the last 10 years since chara... honestly, you still think its the answer?

Develop kids... keep some... trade some... be good at that

Ufa land is where you add your next backes/lapointe

I agree with draft and develop just not counting on unproven players to fill top spots. A year or two in Providence then break in on fourth line. See if they can play before counting on a prospect to step into a top 6 roll.

Someone mentioned that I was looking at Ferland as a second line RW, if that is how my statement came across that was not my goal. Ferland can compliment and fill in on a top 6 when needed but I like the idea of making a third line around him and Coyle, same with Tanev if Ferland is too expensive. To fill the second line spot it will have to be thru trade.

 

[BruinsFanSince94]

Hes definitely had 50-60 quality games in the nhl... and then around the same number where many were wanting him benched or sent back to ahl

Lets hope we see a consistent 60-65 games out of him this year where we arent all saying he needs to be better

So.... 160 career NHL Games:

50-60 = Quality
50-60 = Not quality

So that's 100-120 games played..... What about the other 40-60 games (depending on whatever route you go) that you seem to have ignored with your point?

This was a very odd way to go about making your point to try and argue that Heinen still fits in with unproven rookies who have barely a sniff at the NHL level, or none at all.

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

So.... 160 career NHL Games:

50-60 = Quality
50-60 = Not quality

So that's 100-120 games played..... What about the other 40-60 games (depending on whatever route you go) that you seem to have ignored with your point?

This was a very odd way to go about making your point to try and argue that Heinen still fits in with unproven rookies who have barely a sniff at the NHL level, or none at all.

I guess the other games are probably somewhere in the middle and rather forgettable either way? did you see something different when you were watching?

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

I agree with draft and develop just not counting on unproven players to fill top spots. A year or two in Providence then break in on fourth line. See if they can play before counting on a prospect to step into a top 6 roll.

Someone mentioned that I was looking at Ferland as a second line RW, if that is how my statement came across that was not my goal. Ferland can compliment and fill in on a top 6 when needed but I like the idea of making a third line around him and Coyle, same with Tanev if Ferland is too expensive. To fill the second line spot it will have to be thru trade.

if you can make it happen... I wont be unhappy

 

[BruinsFanSince94]

I guess the other games are probably somewhere in the middle and rather forgettable either way? did you see something different when you were watching?

Unlike you, I'm not going to sit here and act like I remember every one of Heinen's games. I just find it highly comical that you can say he's played 50-60 high quality NHL games and 50-60 duds (benched or sent back to the AHL) and then say that the remaining 40-60 career NHL games are forgettable either way.

What kind of measurement is this to argue that a player belongs in the NHL or not? You lumped him in with a bunch of unproven rookies for some terrible reason and this is your argument why?

162 NHL games -- 81 points -- 0.50 PPG

The sample size is good. The production over that span is good. When you watch Heinen play, you can see a two-way forward who plays a smart game. He can make plays, is responsible in his own end. He brings versatility to the lineup. He's a guy who has a good shot but doesn't use it nearly enough and lacks that extra gear when skating. There is still upside with this player.

I don't know... I take all that and come away with, "Danton Heinen is an NHL player". Yet, I see someone like you still lumping him in with players who aren't NHLers yet and your reasoning being that he's played X amount of good games, Y amount of bad games, and Z amount of games you don't really remember. Like what???

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

Unlike you, I'm not going to sit here and act like I remember every one of Heinen's games. I just find it highly comical that you can say he's played 50-60 high quality NHL games and 50-60 duds (benched or sent back to the AHL) and then say that the remaining 40-60 career NHL games are forgettable either way.

What kind of measurement is this to argue that a player belongs in the NHL or not? You lumped him in with a bunch of unproven rookies for some terrible reason and this is your argument why?

162 NHL games -- 81 points -- 0.50 PPG

The sample size is good. The production over that span is good. When you watch Heinen play, you can see a two-way forward who plays a smart game. He can make plays, is responsible in his own end. He brings versatility to the lineup. He's a guy who has a good shot but doesn't use it nearly enough and lacks that extra gear when skating. There is still upside with this player.

I don't know... I take all that and come away with, "Danton Heinen is an NHL player". Yet, I see someone like you still lumping him in with players who aren't NHLers yet and your reasoning being that he's played X amount of good games, Y amount of bad games, and Z amount of games you don't really remember. Like what???

lets say you are lumping food into groups

you got your meats and protiens
you got your wheats
your veggies...

im sure there are other groups too... but lets say you arent getting too deep into your catagories and want to keep things more simple

someone gives you a cookie and tells you to catagorize it... its not quite a veggie... and its not quite a protein... but you need to put it into one of your groups

its kind of made out of a flour and sugar product... those are more wheat than veggie

if that cant satisfy your itch to argue i will put it to you more simple

is Heinen closer to Bergeron and marchand or closer to Bjork right now? you tell us

 

[finchster]

I really want the Bruins to win the cup now so this thread becomes an all time funny.

 

[BruinsFanSince94]

is Heinen closer to Bergeron and marchand or closer to Bjork right now? you tell us

From now on, I'm going to just eliminate all the rambling nonsense to your post, and focus on the point. That was one of the worst lead ups I have ever read. It's even more hilarious that you still found a way to try and insult my intelligence. I don't need it made "more simple". I just need you to get the f*** off that high horse and get to the point. I think a majority of the forum feels the same. Get to the f***ing point, dude.

Marchand/Bergeron = Proven NHL players
Bjork = Unproven NHL player

Heinen is closer to Marchand/Bergeron than he is to Bjork because at the end of the day, they are all proven NHL players. Bjork hasn't proven anything yet.

I look forward to your 20 page thesis breaking this post down, trying/failing to insult my intelligence, working in how you're a sweeper at a car wash, and finally getting to a counter that is easily refuted because the whole argument is based off a terrible point.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

Slow down I wasn't compering the two.

I guess I should of used the

Ding/Ding
Frederic tuning up Tanev

Took me awhile to get the reference

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

From now on, I'm going to just eliminate all the rambling nonsense to your post, and focus on the point. That was one of the worst lead ups I have ever read. It's even more hilarious that you still found a way to try and insult my intelligence. I don't need it made "more simple". I just need you to get the **** off that high horse and get to the point. I think a majority of the forum feels the same. Get to the ****ing point, dude.

Marchand/Bergeron = Proven NHL players
Bjork = Unproven NHL player

Heinen is closer to Marchand/Bergeron than he is to Bjork because at the end of the day, they are all proven NHL players. Bjork hasn't proven anything yet.

I look forward to your 20 page thesis breaking this post down, trying/failing to insult my intelligence, working in how you're a sweeper at a car wash, and finally getting to a counter that is easily refuted because the whole argument is based off a terrible point.

I take 20 pages if its worth it
I spend less time when its beyond my caring to bother

this will be the last time I waste on this. sorry you couldnt understand but I find that is rather common in 99% of my exchanges with you so you didnt lesson yourself in my opinion this time

 

[BruinsFanSince94]

I take 20 pages if its worth it
I spend less time when its beyond my caring to bother

this will be the last time I waste on this. sorry you couldnt understand but I find that is rather common in 99% of my exchanges with you so you didnt lesson yourself in my opinion this time

 

[prizminferno]

Heinen hate makes no sense. Back to back full seasons with positive possession stats playing out of position for a lot of it and without set linemates a lot of the time and has shown the ability to play against elite competition and pretty much never get scored on. Okay...

 

[GloryDaze4877]

lets say you are lumping food into groups

you got your meats and protiens
you got your wheats
your veggies...

im sure there are other groups too... but lets say you arent getting too deep into your catagories and want to keep things more simple

someone gives you a cookie and tells you to catagorize it... its not quite a veggie... and its not quite a protein... but you need to put it into one of your groups

its kind of made out of a flour and sugar product... those are more wheat than veggie

if that cant satisfy your itch to argue i will put it to you more simple

is Heinen closer to Bergeron and marchand or closer to Bjork right now? you tell us

How long have you watched hockey? If you can’t admit that Heinen has established himself as an everyday NHL player, I’m not sure what to say.

I see some of these pointless back and forth discussions and all I can think of is this:



You continue on with ridiculous statements (it’s just a scratch) just so you don’t have to admit you are wrong about a player. Half the time, I don’t even think you believe what you the point you are arguing, you just like the debate.

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

How long have you watched hockey? If you can’t admit that Heinen has established himself as an everyday NHL player, I’m not sure what to say.

I see some of these pointless back and forth discussions and all I can think of is this:



You continue on with ridiculous statements (it’s just a scratch) just so you don’t have to admit you are wrong about a player. Half the time, I don’t even think you believe what you the point you are arguing, you just like the debate.

I do like the debate... studied practical logic in university... spent some time on the old debate club in highschool…

that said I believe what im saying here... sorry if it bothers you

 

[Spoked-B]

Since no one has bothered to revive this thread. Curious: is coaching no longer our #1 flaw?