Transfer: Summer transfer rumours

[Savant]

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[Chimaera]

I mean, Liverpool is basically batting a 1000 with Klopp and transfers.

Even someone like Klavan (for what they paid) has been a decent buy. Matip, for all his warts, is a free player that cost nothing.

You can talk about youth production (and I think that's going to improve as Klopp and the club invest more) but if you basically haven't messed up a transfer, you don't always need youth players.


I don't expect it to continue forever, but if you look at every transfer under Klopp, it's been pretty ridiculous.

 

[S E P H]

Wenger runs the club completely, the same way Ferguson did. There will be a void of leadership and there already is to some extent. Moreover the squad as a whole just isn't very good anymore. They have a group of four talented players, some of whom are on the decline, two who really aren't (and they play the same position). The rest of the squad, as I said, isn't very good. My opinion is largely based upon no longer rating Mkh to be a difference maker to the extent a team would need to have a good season in England. He has one good game since he joined and a bunch of brutal ones, the same way he was playing in a better team. Their side as a whole is clearly declining and getting worse. Remember that they started alright and have fallen off a cliff since then. Kolasinac has done absolutely nothing to help their defense either. Realistically they need around five new defenders. A backup RB for sure, another LB because Maitland-Niles isn't very good anyway, and three CB. That's a tough job.

Arsenal not only doesn't have a great first XI but their bench is poor. If anyone besides their attackers gets hurt, they have no quality to step in and do a job. Jardim isn't a complete miracle worker. He had a very good squad full of young talent that was bought for him to work with. Every quality team has everything pulling in the right direction in order for them to get there. Liverpool and Tottenham for example simply rarely make bad signings anymore and are bringing youth players into the first team. Arsenal will need to prove that before I think they'll be fine.

I get what you're saying and I don't disagree, but with all the problems you listed here we're still in 6th place and that is with Arsenal losing 4 of the past 5 games and having one of the worst away records in the EPL. A new manager will rejuvenate the squad and allow players to play to their strengths instead of incorporating awful tactics and switching from a back 3 to a back 4 and playing Xhaka every single game.

 

[bluesfan94]

Woodburn and soon Curtis Jones and Rafa Camacho train with the first team, in addition to Brewster who would have played by now this season if he didn't injure his knee.

Training with the first team hardly counts. A ton of Arsenal players have done that. Nelson, AMN, Willock, Mavropanos, JRA, etc.

Also, I don't think that UEFA Youth League quarterfinal is exactly the end all be all predictor of future success

 

[YNWA14]

Woodburn has already scored for Liverpool and Wales in important games. They're nurturing him and trying to bring him along properly under Klopp's guidance.

The purpose of the 'elite' youth squad is to integrate them with the first team and prepare them for that eventual next step.

 

[bluesfan94]

Gotcha so he's Alex Iwobi.

 

[Stray Wasp]

Credit to teams like Burnley, but it is the likes of Everton, Newcastle, West Ham, Southampton etc. that really should have built stronger teams. Leicester made as much money as AM last season! And all of those clubs except Newcastle are richer than AC Milan, Roma etc. Shocking that they can't get more from it.

Though it's a sideshow from your point, purely for the record please note that while the financial results for 2017/18 won't appear for some time, back in 2015/16 Newcastle's turnover exceeded that of Everton and Southampton- despite finishing 18th.

As you would imagine, this makes it rather sickening when the owner appears on TV and blathers, 'I can't compete with Manchester City', and the so-called journalist feeding him carefully vetted questions doesn't immediately ask, 'But why can't you compete with clubs whose financial resources are smaller?'

Not that anyone interested in NUFC doesn't already know the answer to that question, and not that anyone expects Ashley to do anything other than tell an untruth. But given how quick journalists are to play the 'We represent the fans' card whenever players or managers don't do what they want, it's vexing to see one of them providing a shameless liar free PR.

 

[Live in the Now]

There's one specific reason I post this here. Tottenham will also get a figure around this much money even if they don't advance tomorrow, I believe. The table is also looking very favorable for them to be back there again. That money is also going straight into the transfer market and both teams will probably spend a ton next season, which will have a big trickle down effect. Also explains why those English teams are so desperate to be there.

 

[Edo]

Woodburn has already scored for Liverpool and Wales in important games. They're nurturing him and trying to bring him along properly under Klopp's guidance.

The purpose of the 'elite' youth squad is to integrate them with the first team and prepare them for that eventual next step.

What important games?

 

[hatterson]

The problem is that the rest of the league is so poor, especially this season. Massively poor.

I don’t think the bottom 1/3 to 1/2 of the league is that much different than it normally is. I think the big difference is that second tier of teams has fallen back to join the bottom instead of pushing to the top.

Instead of Everton, Southampton, Leicester and West Ham pushing for 6th they’ve all had spurts in the relegation zone this year. Southampton or West Ham may still end up going down.

 

[Havre]

I don’t think the bottom 1/3 to 1/2 of the league is that much different than it normally is. I think the big difference is that second tier of teams has fallen back to join the bottom instead of pushing to the top.

Instead of Everton, Southampton, Leicester and West Ham pushing for 6th they’ve all had spurts in the relegation zone this year. Southampton or West Ham may still end up going down.

Agree.

Arguably some of the "smaller" clubs are doing very good work. Burnley, Bournemouth and Leicester have built something. Watford kind of have as well. If there was a layer between Arsenal and Burnley with the likes of Everton, Newcastle etc. the PL would have been as strong as the financial situation indicates it should be.

I kind of grew up with the old top 4. Since then City have bought a place at the table, while teams like Leeds, partly Aston Villa, Newcastle and Everton have faded (too different degrees). The only team that has step by step been able to become competitive in the top is Spurs (without outside money). It's shocking how poorly that "tier 2" of very well supported teams (with the exception of Spurs) have been ran.

Strangely enough it doesn't seem to be changing. Newcastle might see a quick turn around with new owners. But they have massively lost momentum. In the 90s you could see Newcastle shirts all over Scandinavia. I have more friends supporting Newcastle than teams like Arsenal and Spurs. Now I can't remember last time I saw a kid in a Newcastle shirt. Leeds and Villa are 10 years away unless some random rich guy buys them. And air went out of the Everton balloon rather quickly as well.

 

[Stray Wasp]

I'm struck by the parallels between where the league is now and the period 2003-2005, when everyone was digesting the shock of Abramovitch appearing at Chelsea and showing a willlingness to spend £100 in a summer. Back then many of what might be called the 'bubble' clubs- those in the second and third strata, too good to fear relegation, too timid to conceive they could overcome Chelsea's wealth- psychologically threw in the towel, and retreated into safety-first football. The result was that in 2004 Liverpool needed a mere 60 points to finish fourth. The next year, Everton finished fourth with 61.

Funnily enough, it's almost as if the recent catalyst for mediocrity has been Leicester's title win. One might almost think that all the mid-table managers were so appalled by seeing the 'impossible' happen that they decided they needed to provide 'proof' it was a one-off. Rather in the way a con-artist in danger of being exposed as a fraud might throw themselves into their charade with even deeper conviction.

In fairness, the league's structure makes it pretty inevitable that the 'bubble' clubs will be dysfunctional. The aim, surely, has to be consistently to pose a plausible threat to the top six or so in the league, put together a good cup run most, if not every season, and build a squad strong enough to cope with the Europatoto. Meanwhile, you need to be able to stave off bids from Champions League clubs- who may decide to pursue one of your players as much to weaken your team as to benefit themselves. And while this is going on, you need to keep the fans patient. Not simply in terms of achieving results, but also making enough gestures that signal 'ambition' to the fanbase's more superficial element- the sort who'll automatically assume a cheap signing is bad, and get really excited if you pay £25 million for a player they've never seen, just because the club they support spending that much money makes them feel important by proxy.

Some juggling act, that. Particularly when you're up against teams who barely notice pissing £30 million + transfer fees down the drain, and effectively shovelling £4 million pa + salaries into furnaces.

Not the least problem is that most businessmen lack stamina. They are by nature opportunists seeking a gap in the market that they can either exploit to the hilt until the gap closes or sit back and milk the initial idea 'til kingdom come. Then there's the ego issue of entering a discipline they know nothing about and not taking the trouble to learn the fundamentals.

 

[Deficient Mode]

I'm struck by the parallels between where the league is now and the period 2003-2005, when everyone was digesting the shock of Abramovitch appearing at Chelsea and showing a willlingness to spend £100 in a summer. Back then many of what might be called the 'bubble' clubs- those in the second and third strata, too good to fear relegation, too timid to conceive they could overcome Chelsea's wealth- psychologically threw in the towel, and retreated into safety-first football. The result was that in 2004 Liverpool needed a mere 60 points to finish fourth. The next year, Everton finished fourth with 61.

I don't quite agree. While it's true that 7-20 are really poor and the gap between them and 1-6 is widening, I think safety-first football is driven by the incredible economic incentive of staying in the EPL. Mediocre teams in all leagues often do that when they're afraid of relegation, even though it's far better to win and lose half your games than to draw them all. I mean, most of the average or bad teams in England spend 70-80% of their revenue on wages, while the top 6 are more around 50%. It's not that they're exactly being timid about trying to keep up with the wealth of big clubs by spending a higher percentage of their own money. They just only care about being mediocre because the money they get from just staying put is so much greater than the glory they can imagine getting by winning games.

 

[Chimaera]

There's one specific reason I post this here. Tottenham will also get a figure around this much money even if they don't advance tomorrow, I believe. The table is also looking very favorable for them to be back there again. That money is also going straight into the transfer market and both teams will probably spend a ton next season, which will have a big trickle down effect. Also explains why those English teams are so desperate to be there.

This reason is also why Arsenal is going to struggle.

They don't have the money to plow 150 million in transfers to improve their side. If the Aubameyang deal isn't a hit, that's more money that's gone. It's early, but they can't afford to retool everything.

 

[phisherman]

This reason is also why Arsenal is going to struggle.

They don't have the money to plow 150 million in transfers to improve their side. If the Aubameyang deal isn't a hit, that's more money that's gone. It's early, but they can't afford to retool everything.

They have a cash reserve they can dip in. Plus I bet they will sell some players.

 

[Deficient Mode]

This reason is also why Arsenal is going to struggle.

They don't have the money to plow 150 million in transfers to improve their side. If the Aubameyang deal isn't a hit, that's more money that's gone. It's early, but they can't afford to retool everything.

Arsenal have the third highest revenue in the EPL according to Deloitte - ahead of Chelsea and Liverpool. Question isn't if they have the money, question is if they want to spend it.

 

[Live in the Now]

Arsenal have the third highest revenue in the EPL according to Deloitte - ahead of Chelsea and Liverpool. Question isn't if they have the money, question is if they want to spend it.

That was prior to the CL revenue changes. It is about equal now, at least in terms of Arsenal v. Liverpool.

Of course they do have money, but firstly they have a shitty owner, and secondly there are restrictions that a shitty owner would love to hide behind.

 

[cgf]

That was prior to the CL revenue changes. It is about equal now, at least in terms of Arsenal v. Liverpool.

Of course they do have money, but firstly they have a ****ty owner, and secondly there are restrictions that a ****ty owner would love to hide behind.

*shrug* he's a pretty great owner in colorado. Has no problem paying up and is completely hands off; letting the sports people make the sports decisions.

That's why I've long suspected that Arsenal is cheap just because Arsene is cheap and likes the reputation that he used to have; Kroenke just made a convenient scapegoat for Arsenal fans who weren't ready to turn on Wenger.

 

[Gecklund]

It’s crazy to me that there aren’t more clubs like Monaco and Southampton. Where they spend most of their money in scouting, get top young talent and just keep selling them. Obviously you have to keep some to keep your club good but get someone like Mbappe or Bale and then sell them for 100M or whatever.

 

[Deficient Mode]

It’s crazy to me that there aren’t more clubs like Monaco and Southampton. Where they spend most of their money in scouting, get top young talent and just keep selling them. Obviously you have to keep some to keep your club good but get someone like Mbappe or Bale and then sell them for 100M or whatever.

Southampton are quite close to the relegation zone. I can see why more English teams don't follow that model. They want security and older, proven players. There's a greater financial incentive to just stay safely in the league than to risk having your entire team leave to bigger clubs after one good year so you can make some money on sales.

 

[Gecklund]

Southampton are quite close to the relegation zone. I can see why more English teams don't follow that model. They want security and older, proven players. There's a greater financial incentive to just stay safely in the league than to risk having your entire team leave to bigger clubs after one good year so you can make some money on sales.

Well the main club that fit my idea was Monaco. Southampton was just kind of an after thought. I truly believe that teams should invest A LOT into their scouting.

 

[Deficient Mode]

Well the main club that fit my idea was Monaco. Southampton was just kind of an after thought. I truly believe that teams should invest A LOT into their scouting.

I think a lot of continental teams are trying. But even then, it can be tricky for smaller clubs to compete with richer clubs like Monaco or Leipzig that are scouting harder and more widely, and have more appeal.

 

[Live in the Now]

Monaco once got relegated trying to do that. It is definitely not a fool-proof system. The intrinsic issue of being a Southampton is that every signing you make is a big gamble. Leicester is trying to do it and has spent a ton of money on busts. Benalouane, Mendy, Musa, and Slimani are good examples. They signed the right players a handful of times, but truthfully, they're straight back in the yo-yo zone where they were before. So they went straight back to signing 28 and 30 year olds after spending all that money on busts.

 

[cgf]

Well the main club that fit my idea was Monaco. Southampton was just kind of an after thought. I truly believe that teams should invest A LOT into their scouting.

A lot of german teams follow that model

 

[Evilo]

It’s crazy to me that there aren’t more clubs like Monaco and Southampton. Where they spend most of their money in scouting, get top young talent and just keep selling them. Obviously you have to keep some to keep your club good but get someone like Mbappe or Bale and then sell them for 100M or whatever.

Porto, Lille.