summer trades and signings chat

Henkka

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Holland seems to be doing in Edmonton what he did in Detroit when he had little space to work with at the introduction of the cap. Filling holes and depth with cheap low risk reclamation projects to see what clicks before he gets some cap space in the next couple seasons to get pieces that are actually needed.

There's also the rumour getting Marleau.
 

Ghost of Ethan Hunt

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zadina plus what to aquire marner ? would zadina + athanasou be close ?
Probably not, Leafs would want a kings ransom, so add another 1st Rd. Pick. Marner is awesome & fun to watch, but on DET he's closer to a ~60-65pt player....unless he replaces Bert on L1, which I'd assume he would, then probably a 70+pt player. We just don't have the PMD's & finishers throughout the lineup. That'd be an awfully tempting trade & I'd be inclined to pull that trigger, if it were the right time in the rebuild. Then again, anytime you can a acquire a young superstar is never really a bad idea.
 

Gniwder

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Probably not, Leafs would want a kings ransom, so add another 1st Rd. Pick. Marner is awesome & fun to watch, but on DET he's closer to a ~60-65pt player....unless he replaces Bert on L1, which I'd assume he would, then probably a 70+pt player. We just don't have the PMD's & finishers throughout the lineup. That'd be an awfully tempting trade & I'd be inclined to pull that trigger, if it were the right time in the rebuild. Then again, anytime you can a acquire a young superstar is never really a bad idea.
I'd rather have the team tank one more year and then pull of a trade like that next offseason (not necessarily for Marner).

Like you said, the defense sucks. That needs to get fixed before buying high end wingers.
 

deca guard

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Probably not, Leafs would want a kings ransom, so add another 1st Rd. Pick. Marner is awesome & fun to watch, but on DET he's closer to a ~60-65pt player....unless he replaces Bert on L1, which I'd assume he would, then probably a 70+pt player. We just don't have the PMD's & finishers throughout the lineup. That'd be an awfully tempting trade & I'd be inclined to pull that trigger, if it were the right time in the rebuild. Then again, anytime you can a acquire a young superstar is never really a bad idea.
in retrospect i agree that my trade proposal should have been for a d , or c . but way it happened is i was thinking about my opinion that zadina's soft and not going to be a star . then i saw a marner headline and it got me thinking that maybe we could steal a known allstar in marner on zadinas potential
 

Ghost of Ethan Hunt

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in retrospect i agree that my trade proposal should have been for a d , or c . but way it happened is i was thinking about my opinion that zadina's soft and not going to be a star . then i saw a marner headline and it got me thinking that maybe we could steal a known allstar in marner on zadinas potential
In retrospect I'd be hesitant to pay a W more than Larkin, if Marner were a 1C or a similar caliber 1D, then sure, pay him, but $12-13M, ouch.
 

deca guard

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That's a given, but I can't imagine that'd sit well with Larkin & a few others on the team, nor should it.
your wrong if you think larks should have any complaints . larks wanted long term security so took a lesser contract as opposed to gambling he'd break out and be worth much more . he negotiated with redwings and could have took fewer years then look to cash in down the road but didnt .
 

Hen Kolland

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Feb 22, 2018
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Probably not, Leafs would want a kings ransom, so add another 1st Rd. Pick. Marner is awesome & fun to watch, but on DET he's closer to a ~60-65pt player....unless he replaces Bert on L1, which I'd assume he would, then probably a 70+pt player. We just don't have the PMD's & finishers throughout the lineup. That'd be an awfully tempting trade & I'd be inclined to pull that trigger, if it were the right time in the rebuild. Then again, anytime you can a acquire a young superstar is never really a bad idea.

Marner with Larkin and Mantha on a line would be one of the more enjoyable lines in all of hockey to watch. The speed, skill, and style would be incredible. Marner with the right line mates is going to flirt with a point per game level regardless of the team. If Larkin can drag the team while flirting with it, Marner could definitely do it.
 

Winger98

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your wrong if you think larks should have any complaints . larks wanted long term security so took a lesser contract as opposed to gambling he'd break out and be worth much more . he negotiated with redwings and could have took fewer years then look to cash in down the road but didnt .

His contract takes him to UFA at 26 yrs of age. He keeps playing the way he played last year and he's going to cash in huge with his next deal.
 

saska sault

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Marner with Larkin would be a sight to see... I'd Trade Zadina and any roster player now named Larkin. Zadina and one of Bert, Mantha or AA. It would never happen but Marner is a game changer, and his style of play will allow him to be effective well into his 30s.

Toronto would likely want our 1st, plus Zadina, one of those 3 mentioned.. Maybe even 2, and that's to start the conversation likely.
 

Ghost of Ethan Hunt

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Marner with Larkin would be a sight to see... I'd Trade Zadina and any roster player now named Larkin. Zadina and one of Bert, Mantha or AA. It would never happen but Marner is a game changer, and his style of play will allow him to be effective well into his 30s.

Toronto would likely want our 1st, plus Zadina, one of those 3 mentioned.. Maybe even 2, and that's to start the conversation likely.
So hypothetically (2) lottery/top 5ish picks + AA + Zadina...+ pay him $12-13M...Pass.
 

deca guard

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athanasou and zadina for a young dman that'll develop with hronek-choski-seider-antimist making our d ready 2021/22 . then 7/1/21 sign a proven ufa winger thatll fit right in
 

The Zetterberg Era

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His contract takes him to UFA at 26 yrs of age. He keeps playing the way he played last year and he's going to cash in huge with his next deal.

Funny how everyone pointed out Larkin got straight to UFA and now every RFA is trying the same thing only they got or are about to get paid stupid money to do it. Thinking back on the general board Larkin page it is hilarious now.
 
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The Zetterberg Era

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Do you think that'll be a primary catalyst to a CBA impasse/lockout?

I am somewhat encouraged we should get labor peace actually.

I should have phrased that different as that has been the general discussion among fans. Most high profile RFAs have always got these. Kane, Toews, Crosby, Malkin and several others. Also their cap hits were actually higher percentage than what is currently being requested. That is really the biggest problem when people talk about this, half this board still thinks we are on a 39 million dollar cap I guess...

I just think we locked Larkin in on a really good one. Mantha's and Athanasiou's camp are likely to ask for more than him with UFA years involved and I know this board is going to go nuts. It is just these negotiations are different. Obviously the big mistake in Toronto was paying Tavares that but I don't expect many to see that point at least not now. But if they cannot get near a finals and as currently constructed I don't see how they are going to, they will have serious buyers remorse on that soon in my opinion. For me it wasn't paying Matthews and Marner that is the problem and I understand after Lou withheld his bonuses why Marner is not budging. Still these guys can put their teams in tough spots and they are. The Owners want to extend though, if we have a work stoppage, it isn't them this time not even close for me...
 
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Winger98

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Funny how everyone pointed out Larkin got straight to UFA and now every RFA is trying the same thing only they got or are about to get paid stupid money to do it. Thinking back on the general board Larkin page it is hilarious now.

Honestly, I think people still like to rip on Detroit because it's Detroit, even though they're a basement dweller right now. 25 years of kicking in their teeth has bred some ill will among fans across the league.

I am somewhat encouraged we should get labor peace actually.

I should have phrased that different as that has been the general discussion among fans. Most high profile RFAs have always got these. Kane, Toews, Crosby, Malkin and several others. Also their cap hits were actually higher percentage than what is currently being requested. That is really the biggest problem when people talk about this, half this board still thinks we are on a 39 million dollar cap I guess...

I just think we locked Larkin in on a really good one. Mantha's and Athanasiou's camp are likely to ask for more than him with UFA years involved and I know this board is going to go nuts. It is just these negotiations are different. Obviously the big mistake in Toronto was paying Tavares that but I don't expect many to see that point at least not now. But if they cannot get near a finals and as currently constructed I don't see how they are going to, they will have serious buyers remorse on that soon in my opinion. For me it wasn't paying Matthews and Marner that is the problem and I understand after Lou withheld his bonuses why Marner is not budging. Still these guys can put their teams in tough spots and they are. The Owners want to extend though, if we have a work stoppage, it isn't them this time not even close for me...

I think Toronto signing Tavares should be a fine move. What they need to do is pare back a forward or two in an effort to make cap room to build that blueline. Take Tavares off that team and who is the second center? Kadri has shown to be a guy a team can't depend on, and Nylander is better on the wing (but so was Flip, so maybe). With Tavares and Matthews up the middle, they should be able to spend less on the wings because those two will carry whoever is with them.

It's really something I think the wings need to pay attention to because, as you mention, AA and Mantha will be looking for pay days. Do we really want to lock in on big money wings for 5+ years? Or do we want to move at least one of them to keep some cap space to play with and try to pull in some better assets to build around Larkin, Zadina, Seider, etc.? Maybe the Wings sign both and look to move one later when there's more of a pressing need to make a move.
 

The Zetterberg Era

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Honestly, I think people still like to rip on Detroit because it's Detroit, even though they're a basement dweller right now. 25 years of kicking in their teeth has bred some ill will among fans across the league.



I think Toronto signing Tavares should be a fine move. What they need to do is pare back a forward or two in an effort to make cap room to build that blueline. Take Tavares off that team and who is the second center? Kadri has shown to be a guy a team can't depend on, and Nylander is better on the wing (but so was Flip, so maybe). With Tavares and Matthews up the middle, they should be able to spend less on the wings because those two will carry whoever is with them.



I guess, just find their build deeply flawed.

Muzzin is their only above average D-man defensively and he even suffers the occasional brutal night. Rielly is average to below average in his own zone and the rest of them flat out stink. That is going to be important. Maybe Matthews stays healthy and drags them there, I do think he is pretty special, but he would be doing that regardless of Tavares for me. Given the division and I understand why they did it but they are tied now. They have to move Nylander at this point, we will see what the return is, but if you were going to go for it, they also should have not done that kind of holdout and really went all in last year. Instead they have spread it over two before everyone starts making stupid money and they still look like the 3rd best team in their division. Just seemed ill-timed to me, but I guess we will find out.
 

Ghost of Ethan Hunt

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Honestly, I think people still like to rip on Detroit because it's Detroit, even though they're a basement dweller right now. 25 years of kicking in their teeth has bred some ill will among fans across the league.



I think Toronto signing Tavares should be a fine move. What they need to do is pare back a forward or two in an effort to make cap room to build that blueline. Take Tavares off that team and who is the second center? Kadri has shown to be a guy a team can't depend on, and Nylander is better on the wing (but so was Flip, so maybe). With Tavares and Matthews up the middle, they should be able to spend less on the wings because those two will carry whoever is with them.

It's really something I think the wings need to pay attention to because, as you mention, AA and Mantha will be looking for pay days. Do we really want to lock in on big money wings for 5+ years? Or do we want to move at least one of them to keep some cap space to play with and try to pull in some better assets to build around Larkin, Zadina, Seider, etc.? Maybe the Wings sign both and look to move one later when there's more of a pressing need to make a move.
We'll have plenty of cap even if they get $6M+ each, add Bert & that's still $18ish. And yes, lock 'em all up & look to trade 1 to package for a #1D if needed.
 

Winger98

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I guess, just find their build deeply flawed.

Muzzin is their only above average D-man defensively and he even suffers the occasional brutal night. Rielly is average to below average in his own zone and the rest of them flat out stink. That is going to be important. Maybe Matthews stays healthy and drags them there, I do think he is pretty special, but he would be doing that regardless of Tavares for me. Given the division and I understand why they did it but they are tied now. They have to move Nylander at this point, we will see what the return is, but if you were going to go for it, they also should have not done that kind of holdout and really went all in last year. Instead they have spread it over two before everyone starts making stupid money and they still look like the 3rd best team in their division. Just seemed ill-timed to me, but I guess we will find out.

I'd consider moving Marner depending on the packages being offered for both of them. Regardless, I don't think they have to move anyone serious this season to get cap compliant. Playing with capfriendly and I can get them $90K under the cap by putting Clarkson and Horton on LTIR and then just paring the lineup down to 13F/7D. I didn't pay much attention to waiver eligibility, granted. But if Toronto starts flashing a signed Marner or Nylander around, I think they should be able to get a pretty good haul from someone. Even if they have to take futures in one trade to get something to turn around and flip to a third team to get what they want, I see some good potential for movement there.

I think Toronto is gambling that they can push the play hard enough to not be exposed so much in their own end. And when they do get exposed, that their goalie can bail them out. When you can't get an elite D to anchor your blueline, I think this is sort of what you have to do and just make the best with what you got.
 

Ghost of Ethan Hunt

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I'd consider moving Marner depending on ................

I think Toronto is gambling that they can push the play hard enough to not be exposed so much in their own end. And when they do get exposed, that their goalie can bail them out. When you can't get an elite D to anchor your blueline, I think this is sort of what you have to do and just make the best with what you got.
I feel like that's what we'll end up doing, but without the high octane offense. Still hoping for 1-2 of: (Josi, Pietrangelo, Slavin, Pesce) if none of those are an option then maybe 1 of: (Krug/Barrie/Brodie)
 

Winger98

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I feel like that's what we'll end up doing, but without the high octane offense. Still hoping for 1-2 of: (Josi, Pietrangelo, Slavin, Pesce) if none of those are an option then maybe 1 of: (Krug/Barrie/Brodie)

It's what I'm expecting, too. We have some decent looking kids for the blueline, but elite cornerstone sort of guy? Be nice, but I doubt it. It's part of why I question if it's better to lock in both Mantha/AA now or move them. When will they have more value? How much are the Wings looking to spend/build through free agency? If Yzerman looks at this team and doesn't think it's contending for the playoffs for 5+ years, hanging onto those guys who are 24/25 right now gets harder to justify. especially if we'd rather have some more high picks to build around a slightly younger group.
 
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