Success rate of pulling the goalie

SilverSeven

Registered User
Apr 16, 2007
21,503
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Ottawa, Ontario
Its useless without looking at situations where they DONT pull the goalie.

How often with a 1 goal lead where they dont pull the goalie are they succesful? Probably less often.
 

Danko

You have no marbles
Jul 28, 2004
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10,813
Sorry to bump an old thread however someone asked me this question and i didn't know the answer.

Is there an actual percentage based statistic on conversion of pulling the goalie near the end of the game?
 

Oxidized Guacamole

Registered User
Feb 25, 2013
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There was a Pens game way back when Jagr still played for them when they were down by TWO goals, pulled the goalie and tied it up before winning in OT.
 

PsYcNeT

The No-Fun Zone
Jan 24, 2007
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Calgary has scored at least 4 (maybe 5) times this season with the goalie pulled, including the above scenario.
 

Snakepit

Registered User
Nov 19, 2013
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Calgary has scored at least 4 (maybe 5) times this season with the goalie pulled, including the above scenario.

There was two Flames games this season where they scored two goals with the net empty to come back. Pretty fun to watch
 

Braunbaer

Registered User
May 21, 2012
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In 2013 the Bruins were down by 2 in game 7 of the first round against the Leafs and tied the game scoring 2 goals with the goalie pulled.
Well, you know the story: Bruins lost game 6 of the Finals in regulation after Chicago tied it up with the goalie pulled.

Don't know the actual numbers (they'd interest me as well), but you cannot lose more than the game you actually already lost. So why not give it a try?
 

sharski

Registered User
Jun 4, 2012
5,585
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if teams started pulling the goalie earlier based on the studies and start succeeding, then all coaches would also soon start practicing defending 6-on-5, defenses would get better at it and scoring would go back down to what it is today… just my guess
 

Anglesmith

Setting up the play?
Sep 17, 2012
46,442
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Victoria
It's easier to score an empty net goal than it is to score on a 6 on 5 advantage. You can shoot a weak floater from centre ice, and with no goalie to stop it, it just has to be on the mark. Good luck scoring with a weak floater from centre ice with a goalie in the net.

Thing is, you're making a flawed comparison. Instead of comparing 'scoring the tying goal vs. having an empty net goal scored on you', you should be comparing 'probability of tying the game with the goalie pulled (factoring in your defense's ability to protect the empty net) vs. probability of tying the game while playing at even strength with the goalie in'.

I came here to say the same thing. Pulling your goalie drastically increases the odds of a goal being scored by either team. Even if it's an 80:20 ratio of EN goals to tying goals, you take that as long as the odds of tying the game increase with respect to doing so 5-on-5.

Anyway, Calgary's record this season is pretty great. By my count, we've scored 6 times with the goalie pulled while only allowing 5 goals into the empty net in the final minute. You can make up the difference, however, if you factor in the one goal the Flames scored on their own empty net on a delayed penalty. :sarcasm:
 

Tomas W

Registered User
Oct 23, 2007
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Sweden
To pull the goalie early is only a good idea up you're down with two goals, otherwise wait until 1-1,5 last minute.
 

hris

ChristianFuchsApolog
Jun 8, 2014
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0
Does anyone have any stats on how successful teams are when they pull the goalie in the last minute or two of a game when they are trying to tie it up?

I wanted to how often the team with the pulled goalie scores compared to getting an empty net goal scored on them.

I think I have seen the leading team get the empty net goal more often than the trailing team scoring. If this is the case, then is it really a good idea to pull the goalie at the end of the game?
I think I have seen the leading team get the empty net goal more often than the trailing team scoring. If this is the case, then is it really a good idea to pull the goalie at the end of the game?
Of course not.


(Imagine the success of losing e.g. only by 1 opposite to losing by 2 :amazed: )
 

MarkGio

Registered User
Nov 6, 2010
12,533
11
Its useless without looking at situations where they DONT pull the goalie.

How often with a 1 goal lead where they dont pull the goalie are they succesful? Probably less often.

Teams don't pull the goalie unless they have possession in the offensive zone. Teams who don't pull the goalie are on their heels.
 

HighNote

Just one more Cup
Jul 1, 2014
3,311
4,100
St. Louis
PERFECT example

"Crosby, misses wide. 15 seconds to go , naslund...zherdev...to the net redden.......SCORE! Zherdev ties it with 8.1 to go!" Just listen to it with your sound up.The crowd literally goes NUTS when zherdev scores.The rangers also ended up winning in dramatic fashion.


I could probably resite that sentence in my sleep :laugh:



Fixed for yah
 

bhawks1399*

Guest
The blackhawks got one once last season against Montreal, that's the last time I remember it worked, of course other than tying the game against Boston in game 6
 

BM67

Registered User
Mar 5, 2002
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In "The System"
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Some stats from the 1988-89 season.

---

During the 1988-89 season, coaches pulled their goalies 362 times according to statistics compiled by Inside Hockey. On only 29 occasions did the strategy result in a goal. That's just 8 percent of the time.

(Seven of those goals were scored with the added benefit of a power play, thus creating a two-man advantage.)

Meanwhile, 132 empty-net goals were scored. That's 36.5 percent of the time.

Only 13 times out of 362 tries - 3.59 percent - did the tactic lead to a tie game in regulation time. (Sixteen of the goals were scored when a team was down at least two goals.) In two of those 13 games, the tying team went on to lose in overtime.

Finally, get this. Just once, a microscopic .28 percent of 362 occasions, did a team win a game after its goalie was pulled.

(A second win was recorded May 19 during the Stanley Cup finals when Montreal's Mats Naslund scored with Patrick Roy out of the net. Ryan Walter went on to score in double overtime to give the Canadiens a 4-3 victory and 2-1 lead in the showdown.)

Not once this past season did the Vancouver Canucks earn as much as a point from pulling their goalie... and coach Bob McCammon lifted his goalie 24 times. The Canucks allowed a league high 12 empty-net goals, while scoring just once with their goalie removed - a power-play marker in a 7-6 loss to Page's North Stars on Nov. 17.
 

Ryker

Registered User
Oct 3, 2008
4,981
2
Triangle, NC, USA
The effectiveness of pulling the goalie

Has anyone looked into how effective pulling the goalie to catch up is? I haven't been able to find anything good online, other than qualitative arguments, of course. There's also no readily available data on teams scoring goals this way, so I made a histogram for the 2014/15 NHL season posted below. Note that this only includes goals where the goalie was pulled to make up for being behind and does not include delayed penalty situations.



Anyway, the argument for pulling a goalie is that you're already behind, so why not. You either lose, or you maybe make up for it and push it to overtime. However, I don't see this as a no potential loss scenario. Namely, sure, you could score a goal with the goalie pulled, but you could also score a goal with the goalie not pulled. So if you're being too aggressive, you might just get into a bunch of empty net goals that seal your loss instead of scoring regularly by only being more aggressive in terms of how you play with the goalie left in the net. I see arguments for both sides, but I don't see one argument in and of itself being "obviously" better.

Oh, by the way, does anyone have any data on how aggressive coaches were with this tactic? I don't have the time to look at every game sheet now and manually record that. From observation alone, I know Roy was quick to pull the goalie trigger, and if I remember correctly, Dallas was quite aggressive, as well. I can't really say anything about other teams.

Cheers to a good discussion.
 

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