Subban or Pacioretty?

[The Ugly Truth*]

Subban. Not even close. Go back and watch the games from last year's playoffs if you have any other questions.

Patches is producing well this year, but the regular season is pretty meaningless. He needs to show he can be clutch in the playoffs (despite playing with 1.5 linemates )

 

[mariemarie]

Subban for captain.

 

[Nicko999]

Subban. Not even close. Go back and watch the games from last year's playoffs if you have any other questions.

Patches is producing well this year, but the regular season is pretty meaningless. He needs to show he can be clutch in the playoffs (despite playing with 1.5 linemates )

We sure saw him vs the Rangers.
The amount of disrespect Patches get is ridiculous. He is the only guy on the team who has scored series clinchers.
What might have happened without Pacioretty's shot in Game 7 last season?

 

[Baruch]

We sure saw him vs the Rangers.
The amount of disrespect Patches get is ridiculous. He is the only guy on the team who has scored series clinchers.
What might have happened without Pacioretty's shot in Game 7 last season?

This is very true my friend.

However without Subban, we never sniff Game 7 itself.

The playoff series against Boston was amazing by Subban. Not only scoring game winning goals, but also stellar defensively.

None of it is a knock against Patches, and honestly, if he's 100% healthy in the playoffs, I'm sure he'll have by far his best playoffs this year.

Last year were the first real playoffs experienced by Pacioretty, and people easily forget about that. The 5 games in 2013 against Ottawa, he was playing with a separated shoulder.

PK had 14 games to gain experience in the 2010 run. 1G, 7A, 8 points. Over .5ppg.
As a rookie defenseman having previously played 2 NHL regular season games.

PK is more seasoned. And he is an absolute stud. 25 solid minutes every given night.

Hence my vote for him in this thread.

 

[Devourers]

Subban for these reasons:

1) Playoff Success
2) Playoff icetime (As a d-man, he gets more and can at times be a rock for around half the game!)
3) So far Patch has proven nothing in the post season

We sure saw him vs the Rangers.
The amount of disrespect Patches get is ridiculous. He is the only guy on the team who has scored series clinchers.
What might have happened without Pacioretty's shot in Game 7 last season?

We wouldn't even be in the playoffs without Subban the last couple years more than likely, this year a case can be made for Patch but prior to that outside of Price, Subban has been one of the main reasons we even make the playoffs.

 

[Habsrule]

Subban. The bigger question between these two is who should be the captain next year.

 

[optimus2861]

Obvious answer is the #1D. That player for his 25+ minutes a night can control the game in a way nobody else on the ice really can. Subban is exactly that for us. Losing him for any length of time would drop us to a .500 calibre team instantly.

 

[Blind Gardien]

Jinx thread?

Hopefully we don't spend too much time getting to evaluate what playing without Max will be like.

 

[shawdowmaker]

??? You need a team to win.

 

[Rapala]

Jinx thread?

Hopefully we don't spend too much time getting to evaluate what playing without Max will be like.

Not really a jinx thread...
We played a lot of playoff games last year without Max.
Granted He has been more consistent this year particularly with Plecks...
But keep in mind the animal that is the SCPO's can stifle the very best.
Just ask Sydney about his past two runs.

 

[Brainiac]

Subban. The bigger question between these two is who should be the captain next year.

So far, I'd say Patches took the lead. He really elevated his game this year. The only question is what happens in the playoffs.

Anyways, we'd be fine with any of the current As. It's about the group, not about a specific guy.

 

[TheSubbanator76]

That statement isn't accurate this year.

Last season he was purely an off-the-rush sniper.

He is SO MUCH MORE this year, he's transformed completely, and rounded out his game remarkably well.

As I said, wait for the playoffs. Im convinced he is a valuable first line player capable of 40g+ per year once we give him a real center, but I think people overrate him on these boards. He is our 4th most valuable player behind Price, Subban, Markov, and is simply fast with a good shot. If personality, demeanor, and race were not a part of it, Subban would already be captain as he should be.

 

[E82]

As I said, wait for the playoffs. Im convinced he is a valuable first line player capable of 40g+ per year once we give him a real center, but I think people overrate him on these boards. He is our 4th most valuable player behind Price, Subban, Markov, and is simply fast with a good shot. If personality, demeanor, and race were not a part of it, Subban would already be captain as he should be.

I agree. Plus Subban isn't that far off from Patches with points...AS A DMAN.

 

[Nicko999]

Subban for these reasons:

1) Playoff Success
2) Playoff icetime (As a d-man, he gets more and can at times be a rock for around half the game!)
3) So far Patch has proven nothing in the post season



We wouldn't even be in the playoffs without Subban the last couple years more than likely, this year a case can be made for Patch but prior to that outside of Price, Subban has been one of the main reasons we even make the playoffs.

Actually last year Pacioretty led the team with 39 goals while second was Plekanec at 20. People tend to forget but the offense was even worse last season.

We would still make the playoffs without Subban because we have Markov. If you take Patches out from last year's team though, our offense would look similar to the Buffalo Sabres one.

It's better this year with Plekanec and Gallagher at 24 and Galchenyuk at 20 goals.

 

[CanadianLover]

As I said, wait for the playoffs. Im convinced he is a valuable first line player capable of 40g+ per year once we give him a real center, but I think people overrate him on these boards. He is our 4th most valuable player behind Price, Subban, Markov, and is simply fast with a good shot. If personality, demeanor, and race were not a part of it, Subban would already be captain as he should be.

I was listening to the radio today and Yvon Pedneault was saying how come we don't have any news on the best player of the team? And the other guy responded : I know he is the captain of the team, yada yada yada. The bias of french medias against Subban makes me sick. They overlook his billion qualities and put the focus on what's negative. Price had proven nothing and they were already chanting he is the best goalie in the world. Pacioretty has never proven anything in the playoffs but they already award him the captaincy and are stating we can't win without him. No promotion was made for Subban by french medias in the Norris Trophy conversation. He is the only one who has proven himself year after year since he came in the league, but still no credit. He had a wonderful season and broke all his previous stats but they choose to ignore it. He's been captain or assistant captain of all of his teams since a kid but they are trying to sell us the American guy. Don't get me wrong I love Patches, but skills wise he cannot be compared to PK. The white privilege he is getting annoys me.

 

[ottawa]

Subban is worth more to the habs, not close. I do however think Patches should get the C if he has a good P

 

[c3z4r]

I was listening to the radio today and Yvon Pedneault was saying how come we don't have any news on the best player of the team? And the other guy responded : I know he is the captain of the team, yada yada yada. The bias of french medias against Subban makes me sick. They overlook his billion qualities and put the focus on what's negative. Price had proven nothing and they were already chanting he is the best goalie in the world. Pacioretty has never proven anything in the playoffs but they already award him the captaincy and are stating we can't win without him. No promotion was made for Subban by french medias in the Norris Trophy conversation. He is the only one who has proven himself year after year since he came in the league, but still no credit. He had a wonderful season and broke all his previous stats but they choose to ignore it. He's been captain or assistant captain of all of his teams since a kid but they are trying to sell us the American guy. Don't get me wrong I love Patches, but skills wise he cannot be compared to PK. The white privilege he is getting annoys me.

Cause he's young and he's black and his hat's real low. Seriously though, I don't want to speculate too much on this conspiracy, but I would bet money that many of the dinosaurs in francophone hockey media are very bigoted.

Subban and Ovi shakehead) are my favorite players in hockey and I've learned a long time ago to let go of the unwarranted criticism they tend to attract from various hockey people. There's really no point in arguing against the criticism because people's perceptions of them will never completely change.

 

[CHarlie]

Not even close PK Subban for the win!!!!!!!!!!

If there is even one person that doesn't know this by now they don't know hockey and they don't know the Montreal Canadiens.

 

[Nynja*]

Theyre both very important. Theres not one habs fan out there that wasnt ******** their pants when they heard Patch got hurt.

 

[TheSubbanator76]

Cause he's young and he's black and his hat's real low. Seriously though, I don't want to speculate too much on this conspiracy, but I would bet money that many of the dinosaurs in francophone hockey media are very bigoted.

Subban and Ovi shakehead) are my favorite players in hockey and I've learned a long time ago to let go of the unwarranted criticism they tend to attract from various hockey people. There's really no point in arguing against the criticism because people's perceptions of them will never completely change.

There is no conspiracy about it, the NHL and hockey in general have a large faction of fringe, racist minded people that support it. Used to watch games at the Saddledome back in university and the abuse that Iginla got was disgusting. Look at what happened in Boston with all the PK/Joel Ward tweets. And we cant forget the throwing of a banana at Kevin weeks right here in MTL. Last beacon of white, dominant athletes for these Pejorative Slurs to blindly cheer for.

 

[Baruch]

There is no conspiracy about it, the NHL and hockey in general have a large faction of fringe, racist minded people that support it. Used to watch games at the Saddledome back in university and the abuse that Iginla got was disgusting. Look at what happened in Boston with all the PK/Joel Ward tweets. And we cant forget the throwing of a banana at Kevin weeks right here in MTL. Last beacon of white, dominant athletes for these Pejorative Slurs to blindly cheer for.

What can we expect when Don Cherry is celebrated for his racist rants on national TV...

If I was the one making the decision, PK would already be captain (since the start of the season).

There is obviously a biais against him from uneducated media (ala Mario Tremblay... Dinosaurs).

There are 2-3 problems it creates:
1- Dumb Habs fan hear it and swallow it without questioning because they're talking on an eye-to-eye level with Tremblay.
2- Gives a negative value on PK league-wise...
3- PK's gotta hear it, sometimes in interviews etc. I mean the guy is a class act, but he knows it's gonna follow him his entire career (life) because he chose Hockey over Basketball...

I'm really saddened by the situation honestly... so I'll stop talkin about it and I'm gonna get a beer Cheers to anyone reading that in legit drinking time ^^

 

[Kriss E]

Actually last year Pacioretty led the team with 39 goals while second was Plekanec at 20. People tend to forget but the offense was even worse last season.

We would still make the playoffs without Subban because we have Markov. If you take Patches out from last year's team though, our offense would look similar to the Buffalo Sabres one.

It's better this year with Plekanec and Gallagher at 24 and Galchenyuk at 20 goals.

You realize Subban is not only great in his zone, but he also had just 7pts less than Pacioretty last year.
Subban is a player that drives the play towards the opposing zone a lot. He also plays more than Patches, and there's only 6 Dmen on a line up (7 at times) that would need to compensate for the loss of Subban vs 12 Forwards. So it's more about who you have that can take over either guy. Markov could not take on anymore responsibilities and playing with PK makes him way more effective.
Last year, Gallagher playing with Patches turned him into a skilled grinder. He gets more scoring opportunities not playing on that line because all Patches does is shoot and DD always looks for Patches, so Gallagher doesn't get the most chances to put it in. Before he moved to the DD-Patches line, he was on a 30g pace with Eller-Galch.
Not saying he would have put up 30 goals, but just that without Patches, we would have to reassign the top 6, and that could have still worked.
Losing PK though, I just don't see how it could work. We had Markov (would also be less effective), Diaz (half season), Emelin, Murray, Bouillon, Weaver, Gorges. There's no way they could handle for the loss of Subban.

Our offensive isn't that different from last year btw, we're on pace to finish with 6 more goals.

Saying Subban is more important is not a knock on Patches whatsoever however. Just like saying Price is more important than either of those guys. All three of them are extremely key to us.

 

[Nicko999]

You realize Subban is not only great in his zone, but he also had just 7pts less than Pacioretty last year.
Subban is a player that drives the play towards the opposing zone a lot. He also plays more than Patches, and there's only 6 Dmen on a line up (7 at times) that would need to compensate for the loss of Subban vs 12 Forwards. So it's more about who you have that can take over either guy. Markov could not take on anymore responsibilities and playing with PK makes him way more effective.
Last year, Gallagher playing with Patches turned him into a skilled grinder. He gets more scoring opportunities not playing on that line because all Patches does is shoot and DD always looks for Patches, so Gallagher doesn't get the most chances to put it in. Before he moved to the DD-Patches line, he was on a 30g pace with Eller-Galch.
Not saying he would have put up 30 goals, but just that without Patches, we would have to reassign the top 6, and that could have still worked.
Losing PK though, I just don't see how it could work. We had Markov (would also be less effective), Diaz (half season), Emelin, Murray, Bouillon, Weaver, Gorges. There's no way they could handle for the loss of Subban.

Our offensive isn't that different from last year btw, we're on pace to finish with 6 more goals.

Saying Subban is more important is not a knock on Patches whatsoever however. Just like saying Price is more important than either of those guys. All three of them are extremely key to us.

And that's without Vanek skewing the goals for last year. Our offense IS better.

And I don't think that is fair to Markov, the General can absolutely replace Subban on a short/medium term. It was short sample but we saw what happened when Subban was in a contract dispute 2 years ago... Markov was killing it. Some geniouses even wanted to trade Subban if you remember.

 

[Deluded Puck]

Yeah and it's a short sample but we saw what can happen without Pacioretty, we scored 4 goals!

Subban and AINEC.

Markov is still very good but Subban makes him look a lot better than he was performing this time last year when partnered with Emelin.

 

[Baruch]

And that's without Vanek skewing the goals for last year. Our offense IS better.

And I don't think that is fair to Markov, the General can absolutely replace Subban on a short/medium term. It was short sample but we saw what happened when Subban was in a contract dispute 2 years ago... Markov was killing it. Some geniouses even wanted to trade Subban if you remember.

What I remember was the Diaz-Markov pairing on the PP

Some were wondering if Diaz just had settled himself in a permanent top 4 position... Me included