Proposal: STL/TOR Trade

[Stephen]

Yeah well maybee, cant say he wouldnt want to go home. But if blues are going to trade Petro then you better be prepaired to pay a kings ransom. He is tons better than mcdonaugh Top 5-10 dman in league. Your talking two first and a great prospect. Posssibly even more. Thats if blues are stupid and dont resign him

Yeah I'd expect the price to be pretty steep, but if I'm shopping for defense seriously that's what I'd look for and try to do.

And Nylander could be the basis for the return. Speed, offense, skill to augment the Blues hypothetical retool.

 

[ConnorMcMullet]

I do watch them play, Tarasenko is better and so is Nylander. Comparing their first 2 seasons just makes it more obvious who is better.

I'd take a heart-and-soul player like Schwartz over a soft player like Nylander any day.

And I'm sure most non-leafs fans would as well.

 

[Colt55]

1. Parayko has never had the deployment of a top pairing d-man.
2. How can he be a 35-40 point d-man when his career high in points is 35? Offensive RHD score more than 35 points a year.
3. great shot? Cool, doesn't mean jack **** if you can't translate it into games, he's had 4 goals and 6 goals in the last 2 years respectively. Morgan Rielly doesn't have a great shot and he's got 2 more goals than Parayko over the past 2 seasons.
4. He's a good 3d right now, until he gets the deployment for anything more than that you can't call him a top pairing d-man.

Good then its obvious he sucks isnt that good so you should have zero interest in him. FYI last two worlds he was the #1 d and was on pace for a point per game. As for offensive dmen . Name one dman that scored more points then him and actually had better defensive stats.... have fun with that one.

 

[Razz]

I dont think there is any scenario where Parayko is put on the block unless he wants out. The Blues are all out of sorts coaching wise. The forward lines are already clogged up as it is. I dont think they would be interested in adding Nylander at the price he wants.

I agree, don't see a fit. I was pointing out that the only scenario that I can foresee such a move would be a shakeup due to the team underperforming. The Leafs and Blues do have a trading history (mostly in favour of the Blues) and there's a lot of former Leafs in that lineup, so anything is possible.

In my view, the Blues are in a win-now mode and I don't believe they have the young assets to keep up with their divisional rivals long term. That means FA signings and trades, as we have seen from the Blues lately. Can they put it together? Absolutely, it's still early. I think they will.

 

[BAM]

If we are talking about right now he is absolutely better then Nylander, if you are talking about the future ... it can be debated either way and Nylander could be.

False, Nylander has put up back to back 60 point seasons to start his career. It took Schwartz 6 seasons after being drafted to put up 60 points.

Nylander has put up 8 more points over the past 2 seasons, he plays with the best teammates out of the group but Schwartz plays with Schenn and Tarasenko so it's not like he doesn't play with good talent.

 

[Aintboutdatlyfe]

Marner is not as good as Hall, and Parayko is much better than Larsson. People ONLY say Parayko is not a #1 because we have a top 10 Dman to take most of the tough duty in Petro, Every time Colt is put in those spots he handles it. Petro is clearly a top end #1 but Parayko is lower end #1 all day. The ONLY problem with his game is the fact that he is a big freaking teddy bear. If he was mean he would be an absolute force on the ice.

Marner is 21 and currently as good or better than Hall was at the time of his trade. Hall was not 21 when he was traded. It matters in trade value.


I know Parayko's game well enough to the point that I don't need you to explain anything about his game to me, I know he's talented, I know he's behind Pietrangelo, even so, Parayko is not worth Marner. Would be one of the more shambolic trades in modern Leafs history and there's been a LOT of bad trades. That's just the wrong tree to bark up. Nylander is the upper limit of Parayko's value and even that's only cause of the current contract dispute. Not trading the next Patrick Kane for a guy who, while he's probably talented enough for it and it's not his fault, hasn't proven himself as a top pairing D/1D.

Edit: I don't really get why you guys would wanna trade Parayko anyways, which I know you don't. You're D depth on that side isn't good enough to trade him for a forward right now unless one of the younger guys really breaks out.

 

[Colt55]

exodize Gardiner and Schwartz from this trade and you have an interesting framwork for a deal.

If anything you wouldn't add Gards/Schwartz but maybe Leafs D prospect for Blues F prospect added in could be interesting.

.
You fail to miss very crucial varibles to this trade. 1) Cap, blues cant afford 7-8 million. they have zero cap space left. 2) Blues do not need a forward or a center as bad as they need defense at this moment. 3) nylander does not equal paraykos value. Think more along the lines of drais. 4) Blues need thier sucky, sheltered #3-4 dman. LOL

Just stop.

 

[BAM]

Good then its obvious he sucks isnt that good so you should have zero interest in him. FYI last two worlds he was the #1 d and was on pace for a point per game. As for offensive dmen . Name one dman that scored more points then him and actually had better defensive stats.... have fun with that one.

LOL you're funny, if it isn't exactly like how you see it then the world is ending.

I never said he sucks, everything I said in my post is true. Parayko is a good 3D RIGHT NOW. He's never played at the level nor deployment of a top pairing d-man.

Bringing up worlds lmao...

And sure

Jones
Provorov
Doughty
Hedman
Rielly
Werenski
Josi
Subban
Suter
Pietrangelo

I can keep going

All those guys face top notch QoC that Parayko doesn't and still perform great and put up the #'s.

 

[Colt55]

False, Nylander has put up back to back 60 point seasons to start his career. It took Schwartz 6 seasons after being drafted to put up 60 points.

Nylander has put up 8 more points over the past 2 seasons, he plays with the best teammates out of the group but Schwartz plays with Schenn and Tarasenko so it's not like he doesn't play with good talent.

Jaden had 59points in 62 games with a non #1 center (from what HF guys say here) where as nylander got 61points in 82 games. But i guess you left that out

 

[Aintboutdatlyfe]

.
You fail to miss very crucial varibles to this trade. 1) Cap, blues cant afford 7-8 million. they have zero cap space left. 2) Blues do not need a forward or a center as bad as they need defense at this moment. 3) nylander does not equal paraykos value. Think more along the lines of drais. 4) Blues need thier sucky, sheltered #3-4 dman. LOL

Just stop.

I don't need you lecturing me about the Blues, I know the team well enough to form my own opinions, I've had to watch so much of them over the last couple years for work it's not even funny.

It's fine if you can't make the trade for cap/depth reasons, that's a fair reason and I'd agree with. In a vacuum. Nylander and Parayko is a value match, though. Not to mention Nylander is younger....

And I never said Parayko is sucky, he's quite good, he's still sheltered and never had the chance to prove he's a top pairing D though, even if we think he's capable of it. That's just a fact of playing behind Pietrangelo.

 

[BAM]

I'd take a heart-and-soul player like Schwartz over a soft player like Nylander any day.

And I'm sure most non-leafs fans would as well.

Soft? lmao have you seen Draisaitl play? Unless he's riding shotgun with McDavid, he's got as much drive and energy as an old man. See, not that hard to nitpick "flaws" on other players. Kessel is soft, Kane is soft. Just because a player doesn't play a physical game doesn't mean they're no good.

Funny how you think you know Nylander's game better than someone who's watched his entire career lol. He's got heart, he's just not a guy like Hyman who's going 200% all the time.

 

[BAM]

Jaden had 59points in 62 games with a non #1 center (from what HF guys say here) where as nylander got 61points in 82 games. But i guess you left that out

you're just going to leave out playing with Tarasenko too? Schenn had 70 points last year, he's a low end 1C.

Nazem Kadri put up 44 points in 48 games once, blips happen, especially with a 26 year old that never performed close to that before last year.

Nylander put up 61 points playing on various lines and with Matthews missing 20 games due to injury. Not a valid reason.

 

[Colt55]

Why would the Blues want Gardiner on an expiring contract.

Thats the thing someone yesteray said we could resign him. He is not a dependable defense man. He is a kevin shattenkirk 2.0 and thats not what the blues need.

 

[Colt55]

you're just going to leave out playing with Tarasenko too? Schenn had 70 points last year, he's a low end 1C.

Nazem Kadri put up 44 points in 48 games once, blips happen, especially with a 26 year old that never performed close to that before last year.

Nylander put up 61 points playing on various lines and with Matthews missing 20 games due to injury. Not a valid reason.

Actually if you watched the blues play. Yeo broke them up to spread out the scoring he only played with tarasenko about 10 games. Tarasenko was with statsny most the year. Look it up

 

[Colt55]

Yeah I'd expect the price to be pretty steep, but if I'm shopping for defense seriously that's what I'd look for and try to do.

And Nylander could be the basis for the return. Speed, offense, skill to augment the Blues hypothetical retool.

we already have Kyrou, Thomas, Kostin Bokk coming. What we dont have is another parayko. Does that make sense

 

[TheBluePenguin]

My god I hate these threads, Parayko is crap and Nylander is the next Patrick Kane !!!

 

[BAM]

Actually if you watched the blues play. Yeo broke them up to spread out the scoring he only played with tarasenko about 10 games. Tarasenko was with statsny most the year. Look it up

Jaden Schwartz most common lines last year...

Schwartz-Schenn-Tarasenko = 45.6%
Schwartz-Schenn-Steen = 13.5%

He spent almost half of the season 5 on 5 with that line lmao stop lying when there's numbers to refute everything you say.

 

[JetsHomer]

So Blues downgrade at 2 positions, just to help Toronto with their problem child RFA? Hahahah

 

[BAM]

My god I hate these threads, Parayko is crap and Nylander is the next Patrick Kane !!!

More like Parayko is a top pairing d-man although he isn't and yet we get told how Nylander is just a 60 point winger. You blues fans love to project what Parayko could be but won't do the same with a guy who's 3 years younger.

 

[Frelimo]

YES PLEASE!

 

[Ziggdiezan]

Thats the thing someone yesteray said we could resign him. He is not a dependable defense man. He is a kevin shattenkirk 2.0 and thats not what the blues need.

Gardiner is leading the league in 5 on 5 ice time this year and was in the top 5 last year as well. I wouldn't say he isnt dependable lol....

 

[BleedBlue14]

Schwartz is in no way better than Nylander lmfao

Jaden Schwartz most common lines last year...

Schwartz-Schenn-Tarasenko = 45.6%
Schwartz-Schenn-Steen = 13.5%

He spent almost half of the season 5 on 5 with that line lmao stop lying when there's numbers to refute everything you say.

Jaden Schwartz missed about 6 weeks last year. He played 62 games which is about 3/4th of the season. Of that 3/4th of the season 45% was with Tarasenko. I'm not exactly sure what you are missing here but this is not half of the season. Regardless, Tarasenko had the worst season of his career last year which you would barely be able to measure if you looked at stats outside of shots that missed the net. Jaden Schwartz is an absolute line driver. There are very few players in the NHL I'd rather have on the team than Jaden Schwartz, and Vladimir Tarasenko nor William Nylander are in that list. The only thing that makes it relatively close is the fact that Schwartz being the gritty player that he is seems to get hit in the foot with rocket or crash into the net and break his ankle/foot making him miss time.


As for the OP absolutely not. We need a better defensive system, not a massive downgrade on defense both at forward and defense in order to add maybe 5 points between the two players. If you are wanting to make a trade with STL after this offseason it comes in the form of a goalie (which seems to be unlikely) or a left handed defenseman with how poor the left side of our defense outside of Joel Edmundson has looked. I'm not going to completely rule out the guys that we have currently as bad defensemen as our defensive system under Yeo has been an absolute mess. Jake Allen has not been fantastic but he hasn't been as bad as the stats are showing either. Pietrangelo has not played like Pietrangelo the first 5 games of the year and Vince Dunn seems to be undergoing a sophomore slump. Jay Bouwmeester looks like he is either extremely rusty (which is understandable) or he needs to be played in a very very sheltered role as his breakout passes have been terrible this year. His defense is still ok, not great anymore but still very serviceable for the 3rd pairing. His puck moving these first 5 games has been at under an AHL level in my opinion.

 

[Colt55]

Jaden Schwartz most common lines last year...

Schwartz-Schenn-Tarasenko = 45.6%
Schwartz-Schenn-Steen = 13.5%

He spent almost half of the season 5 on 5 with that line lmao stop lying when there's numbers to refute everything you say.

stop lying so he played less than 28 games with tarasenko. I so i am off by 18 games. You said he played the entire season with tarasenko. That is also a lie. So stop lying to prove your point. See what i did there. How often did nylander play center. But he is a center right. You guys can warp any argument you want to your adavantage.

Just give it up. We are not trading Jaden or Parayko. We dont need Nylander and dont want Gardnier.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

Actually if you watched the blues play. Yeo broke them up to spread out the scoring he only played with tarasenko about 10 games. Tarasenko was with statsny most the year. Look it up

From what I can see Schwartz played with Schenn and Tarasenko for around 45% of his total ES shifts.

Schenn played around 34% of his shifts with Shwartz and Tarasenko. Certainly more than 10 games. More like 27-28 games together.

I'm guessing the lines may have also been changed when Schwartz got injuried too.

 

[Bye Felicia]

Schwartz is a more complete player than Nylander.

WAR/82 for the last two seasons: Schwartz 2.15, Nylander 1.34.
GAR/82: Schwartz 15.444, Nylander 12.541
Game Score: Schwartz 2.8, Nylander 2.5

The fact that Schwartz took more seasons to get to this point has no bearing on how good they are right now. In fact, Nylander happens to be providing 0 value right now as he skates around in Sweden. There's no way the Blues would give him $8.5M, and if he could be signed for $6.75/year like the OP proposed, he'd be playing in Toronto right now.

Schwartz played <50% of the time with Tarasenko last year. Nylander played 88% of the time with Matthews.

Furthermore, if the Blues trade Parayko, their second paring RHD is Robert Bortuzzo. I don't think I need to provide further information to elucidate how bad that would be.