Stat (or set of stats) that assesses how well a player elevates the play of those around him.

[Windy River]

I’d be interested to find a way of measuring the relative effect of a player on those they play with. Well beyond G/A/Pts or +/- of course. Perhaps even beyond line-mates.

The thread idea comes from thinking about Crosby vs McDavid.. while most people today believe that McDavid is clearly the better player, I have always believed that Crosby in his earlier career certainly had a more ‘positive’ impact on players around him that he played and practiced with - and even today I think Crosby may still hold the edge in this regard.

What I’d like to find is a relatively objective measure of this, both to see if my ‘instinct’ could be objectively argued as correct, and to look back over a broader set of players past and present to see what is there, if there are any hidden gems to uncover- perhaps even put some data behind the elusive ‘intangibles’ that apparently is so key to successful playoff runs.

I’m not sure what the ‘limits’ of analysis would be. While naturally observing direct impact on guys he’s on ice with, is there a way to look at the longer-term cumulative affect as well? Like how it elevates players on other lines, or line-mates later on when they don’t play on the same line or even team anymore? How opponents may be elevated with enough play being matched up against them??!

I ask because in my personal experience and observational experience of sports (boxing in particular interestingly enough...) I see that lesser players are often elevated simply by being in the presence of greater players. After a game/match I’ve even seen guys on the losing end look to have enhanced their skillset, or found another gear in future matches after gaining that experience.

A difficult, complex question, I know.. but one I’d hope to gain insight into

Thoughts?

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[Filthy Dangles]

It's all anecdotal but I feel like Sid wore teams down more and kept his linemates a bit more involved. When I think of Crosby at his best, I think of that owning the puck below the dots, stiff arming guys and cycling the puck with his linemates and making some crazy plays in tight spaces.

Not that McDavid can't/doesn't do that, but just not as frequently or to the extent Sid did. When I think of McDavid at his best, I think of more of a freelancer skating around a team and what not.

The possession stats certainly favor Crosby, I'm sure there are some that favor McDavid, perhaps things like how efficiently he scores at Even Strength.

Gun to my head, I'd pick Sidney Crosby in terms of higher impact but it's obviously really close.

 

[The Panther]

The two guys that would dominate this, historically (and not surprisingly), are Bobby Orr and Wayne Gretzky (c. 1980 to 1991) -- the two most individually dominant and team-elevating players of all time.

I could see the argument for Crosby here over McDavid because Crosby is less of an 'individualist' on the ice, and uses teammates more. McDavid is probably just as good (or even better) a passer as Crosby, but somehow Crosby seemed, in his prime, a bit more able to elevate the stats and play of lesser linemates more consistently (not forgetting that Pat Maroon scored 29 with McDavid).

Bit hard to judge these things, though, because you'd have to take into account team context and whatnot.