GDT: Start of Vezina Bob | Jackets@Islanders | 7:00 PM 3/11/19|Fox Sport Ohio

Viqsi

"that chick from Ohio"
Oct 5, 2007
53,740
31,108
40N 83W (approx)
Okay. Slept on it. Let's go.

* * *​
Look..

I get you are Miss Positivity on the board.

It's appreciated.

But please can we not put lipstick on a pig? This team needs wins or they are going to miss the playoffs. If you want to be happy for the effort, that's your prerogative. But for the love of "sweet ****ing G-d almighty" don't tell me I should be content with how we're playing better. We have way too many useless players on this team. Enough with the bull ****. This team isn't getting it done, I'm not going to act like it's going to be all okay. If they continue down this path, we have no business in the playoffs, let alone winning the Cup. Because...ya know, that's why we went and got all those players...

FWIW: Duchene was and is our best player right now.
The Devils game was unwatchable garbage - and that was while we were winning.

This game was watchable, even if it didn't go our way.

Look for trends of play. That will tell you what to expect. We were in a very, very bad position for an extended period after the deadline. We now have two games in a row suggesting that that malaise might be behind us.

I'm not saying that it's okay to be happy with losing - when you play like that, you deserve the 2 points, damnit! But the way the team is playing suggests that in general, it may not be as much of a problem going forward. (And, for that matter, we've had several games in which we've gotten points we seriously didn't deserve, so it goes both ways.) We're on a trend back upward, whereas previously it looked like firing the coach and hoping for a Dead Cat Bounce was our only hope for success (and there's still plenty here who would fairly argue it'd be prudent regardless). I consider that a very good thing, even if we didn't come away with the two points, because it means our chances of making them up in future games look much better than they did half a week ago.

* * *​
Normally I’d agree 100%. But when every game is teatering for your playoff life, I can’t agree. This wouldn’t be a bad loss in say November, but at this time of year, in our position, it’s crippling.
I'd agree IF the team still looked atrocious. They're looking a lot better now. That two week period is, in essence, a sunk cost; we're just going to have to live with it and hope we didn't already cripple ourselves with it.

* * *​
Our identity is we're afraid to go in the hard areas to score. Sooo much time spent on the half wall!
Well, this team is used to defenses that take the bait. We started to adapt a lot better to that in the third period, though. But yeah, we spent way too much time trying to get them to flinch, and they didn't bother to do so - not until we started taking more risks in the third and getting them off their game. If we'd done that earlier, maybe we'd be talking about how the game went to OT right now. :dunno:

* * *​
Winning is all that matters. There is no playoff entry or championship metric in this league involving style points. Nobody cares how winning is accomplished. This isn’t an art contest or figure skating.

You are crowned a winner or a loser for beating your opponent, and we are not doing that. It doesn’t matter how good or bad you look doing it.
:eyeroll: It matters because it has an impact on whether or not one can realistically expect wins going forward. Nobody goes 82-0.

* * *​
Viqsi is not telling you how to feel about the loss.

People have made a lot of different statements about whether the team played the right way. You can look back in the thread and find a lot of statements similar to "you can feel a goal is coming", "they're playing too well to lose this", etc... And now that it's over we've gone back to saying they're all a bunch of useless bums like after the Devils game. Debating the nature of the game is not the same as saying you should feel good about the loss.
YES. This. Exactly this. Thank you SO MUCH. You get all the cookies.

convert


* * *​
Like her, you are making up an argument that literally nobody has made w/r/t “the Devils game.”
Folks are reacting in exactly the same way. Indistinguishably, really. That's the reason why it keeps coming up.

* * *​
1- Considering the talent level of our D, why can't we do the same thing to other teams?
We could. Have done so before. We just don't do that normally because it doesn't let us maximize the playmaking skill our blueliners have. That's a coaching philosophy thing.

That and folks here start getting on the coach for "turtling and playing defensive hockey", but grumpy fans really shouldn't be a style consideration like that... :)
 

majormajor

Registered User
Jun 23, 2018
24,507
29,185
His "I don't coach offense" is from a previous decade. The game has simply moved by him. Now good teams score with skill. Their is a strategy to their offense.

I'm not sure about this. Torts has run out of rope, or should have by now, but I don't know about the accuracy of this critique. It's a juicy phrase but do we know if there is a big difference between Torts and other coaches on offensive strategy? Aside from "go to the net" I don't hear much from coaches on this. Yes, you score with skill, that doesn't mean that your skill players benefit from being controlled by the coach. I think it's a matter of occasional adjustments, which Torts also does - note the patience on shots in the Pittsburgh game, that was a coaching adjustment.
 

GoJackets1

Someday.
Aug 21, 2008
6,788
3,306
Montana
Okay. Slept on it. Let's go.

* * *​

The Devils game was unwatchable garbage - and that was while we were winning.

This game was watchable, even if it didn't go our way.

Look for trends of play. That will tell you what to expect. We were in a very, very bad position for an extended period after the deadline. We now have two games in a row suggesting that that malaise might be behind us.

I'm not saying that it's okay to be happy with losing - when you play like that, you deserve the 2 points, damnit! But the way the team is playing suggests that in general, it may not be as much of a problem going forward. (And, for that matter, we've had several games in which we've gotten points we seriously didn't deserve, so it goes both ways.) We're on a trend back upward, whereas previously it looked like firing the coach and hoping for a Dead Cat Bounce was our only hope for success (and there's still plenty here who would fairly argue it'd be prudent regardless). I consider that a very good thing, even if we didn't come away with the two points, because it means our chances of making them up in future games look much better than they did half a week ago.

* * *​

I'd agree IF the team still looked atrocious. They're looking a lot better now. That two week period is, in essence, a sunk cost; we're just going to have to live with it and hope we didn't already cripple ourselves with it.

* * *​

Well, this team is used to defenses that take the bait. We started to adapt a lot better to that in the third period, though. But yeah, we spent way too much time trying to get them to flinch, and they didn't bother to do so - not until we started taking more risks in the third and getting them off their game. If we'd done that earlier, maybe we'd be talking about how the game went to OT right now. :dunno:

* * *​

:eyeroll: It matters because it has an impact on whether or not one can realistically expect wins going forward. Nobody goes 82-0.

* * *​

YES. This. Exactly this. Thank you SO MUCH. You get all the cookies.

convert


* * *​

Folks are reacting in exactly the same way. Indistinguishably, really. That's the reason why it keeps coming up.

* * *​

We could. Have done so before. We just don't do that normally because it doesn't let us maximize the playmaking skill our blueliners have. That's a coaching philosophy thing.

That and folks here start getting on the coach for "turtling and playing defensive hockey", but grumpy fans really shouldn't be a style consideration like that... :)
I agree with the bolded. This was head and shoulders above the Devils game, and we do appear to be on an upward trend. That being said, I am still, justifiably so, incredibly worried about the offense and chemistry issues. Which are definitely exacerbated by the line shuffling. Hopefully Boone is back tonight and we can run the lines we should be running.
 

Viqsi

"that chick from Ohio"
Oct 5, 2007
53,740
31,108
40N 83W (approx)
I agree with the bolded. This was head and shoulders above the Devils game, and we do appear to be on an upward trend. That being said, I am still, justifiably so, incredibly worried about the offense and chemistry issues. Which are definitely exacerbated by the line shuffling. Hopefully Boone is back tonight and we can run the lines we should be running.
Oh, it's definitely an area of concern. However, if the rest of the team is playing reasonably well (which they've started doing), that's the sort of thing that can be worked out.
 
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GoJackets1

Someday.
Aug 21, 2008
6,788
3,306
Montana
Oh, it's definitely an area of concern. However, if the rest of the team is playing reasonably well (which they've started doing), that's the sort of thing that can be worked out.
I sure hope you're right.

Trust me, I don't like being one of the more pessimistic ones on the board. I'm usually not. :)
 

Double-Shift Lasse

Just post better
Dec 22, 2004
33,434
14,158
Exurban Cbus

Here's what sucks about this. The team has played more bad hockey than good since the trade deadline, when an infusion of talent was added to the roster. It wasn't supposed to go that way.

There are a hundred ideas/theories/explanations/excuses running around here (and in my head). But I don't know that any of them adequately explains what's happening.

That only adds to the frustration of the results and the struggles and the uncertainty regarding qualifying for the playoffs.

Results = frustrating
uncertain reasons for said = frustrating
that it all places the team in an uncertain place wrt playoff qualification = frustrating

All of that would be enough. Then add the franchise's (still brief in the grand scheme of things but still) history, and it's enough to drive a fan crazy, if not full on negative.

I could probably have written the above better with an edit or two, instead of stream of consciousness. Suffice to say...

DAMMIT!
 
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Viqsi

"that chick from Ohio"
Oct 5, 2007
53,740
31,108
40N 83W (approx)
Here's what sucks about this. The team has played more bad hockey than good since the trade deadline, when an infusion of talent was added to the roster. It wasn't supposed to go that way.

There are a hundred ideas/theories/explanations/excuses running around here (and in my head). But I don't know that any of them adequately explains what's happening.

That only adds to the frustration of the results and the struggles and the uncertainty regarding qualifying for the playoffs.

Results = frustrating
uncertain reasons for said = frustrating
that it all places the team in an uncertain place wrt playoff qualification = frustrating

All of that would be enough. Then add the franchise's (still brief in the grand scheme of things but still) history, and it's enough to drive a fan crazy, if not full on negative.

I could probably have written the above better with an edit or two, instead of stream of consciousness. Suffice to say...

DAMMIT!
Yeah, but I would throw in:
indications that results are getting better = encouraging

And I prefer to focus on the encouraging bit, because at least it's a challenge; dwelling on the frustrating stuff is too easy. :)
 

majormajor

Registered User
Jun 23, 2018
24,507
29,185
Yeah, but I would throw in:
indications that results are getting better = encouraging

And I prefer to focus on the encouraging bit, because at least it's a challenge; dwelling on the frustrating stuff is too easy. :)

I don't feel terribly encouraged, but I'll try.

When the Isles play that way, even the Lightning can't score. They have one goal total in their last two games against the Islanders.
 
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Double-Shift Lasse

Just post better
Dec 22, 2004
33,434
14,158
Exurban Cbus
Yeah, but I would throw in:
indications that results are getting better = encouraging

Perhaps play is getting better. Results are still mixed at best, and there's a game tonight so we'll see.

The point is that the play and results are not necessarily congruous, and there isn't always an explanation for said. We definitely hate that sometimes there's just no explanation for said.
 

Doug19

Registered User
Oct 14, 2008
6,542
222
Columbus, OH
They've been bad, now they look good but aren't scoring. The best news out of all this? We're in a playoff spot right now. The team doesn't have the talent to miss the playoffs. It would take a collapse of epic proportions for this team to miss the playoffs. In my opinion given the teams that are fighting for 8th place, I believe 14 points in 13 games gets us in. All opinion of course.
 

majormajor

Registered User
Jun 23, 2018
24,507
29,185
They've been bad, now they look good but aren't scoring. The best news out of all this? We're in a playoff spot right now. The team doesn't have the talent to miss the playoffs. It would take a collapse of epic proportions for this team to miss the playoffs. In my opinion given the teams that are fighting for 8th place, I believe 14 points in 13 games gets us in. All opinion of course.

The Flyers are 12-4-2 since Feb. 1st, and they're 3 points behind the Jackets. I think we need a lot more than 14 points.
 
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GoJackets1

Someday.
Aug 21, 2008
6,788
3,306
Montana
I don't feel terribly encouraged, but I'll try.

When the Isles play that way, even the Lightning can't score. They have one goal total in their last two games against the Islanders.
I mean, that does make me feel a little better. Lol

Getting shutout by the Oilers at home though, wowza.
 

Doug19

Registered User
Oct 14, 2008
6,542
222
Columbus, OH
The Flyers are 12-4-2 since Feb. 1st, and they're 3 points behind the Jackets. I think we need a lot more than 14 points.

I don't think the Flyers are going to win more than 8 of their remaining 13 games. With that said, if we win tonight, and Philly loses against Washington, I'm comfortable saying that teams 10-16 in the East are all but officially eliminated.
 

Sparksrus3

NYI - THE TEAM WITH NO ❤️
Jun 2, 2012
10,026
4,908
The Flyers are 12-4-2 since Feb. 1st, and they're 3 points behind the Jackets. I think we need a lot more than 14 points.

18-4-2 since January 14th. Isles got smoked by the Flyers twice last week . As Charles Barkley would say " just tirrible"
 

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