Movies: Star Wars - Episode IX: The Rise of Skywalker - II

Status
Not open for further replies.

ArGarBarGar

What do we want!? Unfair!
Sep 8, 2008
44,017
11,677
The complaint about a force ghost being able to use force powers on a living force user seems odd, considering we had Obi Wan specifically tell Luke he couldn't interfere in his fight against Vader in ESB, so clearly there is some limit to the amount that a force ghost can show themselves or interject into the world. Considering how the force is incredibly vague and open to interpretation how it works I don't see this as a problem.
 

Tawnos

A guy with a bass
Sep 10, 2004
28,815
10,380
Charlotte, NC
The complaint about a force ghost being able to use force powers on a living force user seems odd, considering we had Obi Wan specifically tell Luke he couldn't interfere in his fight against Vader in ESB, so clearly there is some limit to the amount that a force ghost can show themselves or interject into the world. Considering how the force is incredibly vague and open to interpretation how it works I don't see this as a problem.

I mean, we didn't have the ability to stop blaster bolts in mid-shot or astral projection until these movies either. Or I should say, we didn't know about those things.

Also, Yoda and the rest of the Jedi didn't know how to become Force ghosts until relatively recently in Star Wars history. It's been about 50 years since RotS. Why would it be so strange if Yoda discovered more abilities than were known before?
 

bleedblue1223

Registered User
Jan 21, 2011
51,758
14,662
No one had a problem with stopping blaster bolts mid-shot because it makes sense with how the force has been presented. Jedi and Sith can deflect blaster bolts, so it's not like they come at great speeds that they can't anticipate them, and previous force users have been able to use the force to move or stop objects or individuals.

The force projection is new, but Luke is also from what we understand to be the strongest jedi in history and we know he went on a long journey after Return of the Jedi searching for Jedi and Sith artifacts and temples. Pretty easy to get on board with Luke doing something incredible with the force.

In the Mandalorian, they "introduced" force healing, but that's more or less been canon, so no one has an issue with it.

People have an issue with Leia going Mary Poppins and Yoda's force ghost shooting lightning. We don't have to beat the dead horse on Mary Poppins anymore.

The jedi did not seek this power out, the cosmic force selected Qui-Gon, who was then instructed to teach Yoda, and Qui-Gon, then taught Obi-Wan. In canon, they told us it was just to commune to the living light-side force users. Now, even if you say force ghosts can use force powers on the living/physical world and not just commune, then there is an even bigger issue with the force lightning. Force Lightning is a dark side force power, it's not something the cosmic force would really allow for since becoming a force ghost is only for force users that believe in the light side and are selfless and peaceful.

If you really want to get on board with the cosmic force now being able to physically impact the living world, then more power to you, but like weaponizing hyperspace, it's either going to just be completely ignored moving forward or create a bunch of issues.
 
  • Like
Reactions: x Tame Impala

Tawnos

A guy with a bass
Sep 10, 2004
28,815
10,380
Charlotte, NC
You do know that it was real lightning, not Force lightning, right? Yoda activated and directed the clouds that were already there to produce a bolt where he wanted it. He didn't shoot anything.

I think it's probably not true that becoming a Force ghost is restricted to "light side" users. The aspect of the Cosmic Force that south them out might have been from the light side, but that's probably not the only aspect of it. In fact, my understanding of Force powers is that none of them are in reality light or dark, since the Force is really about balance, but rather it's what you choose to learn and what you do with Force powers that makes you light or dark. Anyone with sensitivity in the Force and with some study can use Force lightning, but Jedi only learn about it for defense (being able to absorb the energy as Yoda does in RotS).

Just because the Jedi didn't seek out the ability to become a Force ghost doesn't mean that, once they got there, they didn't try to expand their understanding of being in that state.
 

bleedblue1223

Registered User
Jan 21, 2011
51,758
14,662
True, I re-watched the scene and miss-remembered. Rest of it still applies, but I'm not going to keep beating a dead horse with either of you, a productive discussion never occurs.
 

NyQuil

Big F$&*in Q
Jan 5, 2005
95,340
59,233
Ottawa, ON
In case you haven't seen this:

JJ Abrams:

JJ Abrams said:
“It was really important that we not just redo the things you’ve seen, but add new elements—which we knew will infuriate some people and thrill others."

“Among those things are not just new ways of doing sort of traditional, must-have sequences, whether it’s chases or lightsaber battles, or what have you,”

“We wanted to make sure that this picture also showed aspects of the Force in ways that go beyond what you’ve seen before.”

The challenge on this film, being the end of three trilogies, was to tell a story that not only feels inevitable but also feels surprising,”

“There are some people who want to not like something—and they will, without question, find something to not like. And people who want to like it, will find the things to like. I feel like you get criticized for changing too much, you get criticized for not changing enough. And everyone’s opinion is valid.”

The Rise of Skywalker Will Introduce New Force Powers

It's smart to warn people before they go into the theater. It might change how people respond to these new force powers.
 

bleedblue1223

Registered User
Jan 21, 2011
51,758
14,662
In case you haven't seen this:

JJ Abrams:



The Rise of Skywalker Will Introduce New Force Powers

It's smart to warn people before they go into the theater. It might change how people respond to these new force powers.

JJ will have more freedom now that Rey has the jedi texts, can communicate with the force ghosts, and there being a time jump. It should be expected that Rey is stronger, more confident, and display new powers. We already see her force jump in the trailers, that's not going to cause any issues. Based on the leaks, I could potentially see an issue, but we'll see if it's true and how it's done.

JJ and Rian could've saved themselves some of those criticisms by introducing Luke in 7 in a bigger capacity, having a time jump between 7 and 8, or having 8 take longer than a few days or so.
 

bleedblue1223

Registered User
Jan 21, 2011
51,758
14,662
I guess JJ and Daisy have been talking about how Rey doesn't have to be connected to anyone to have her powers. Well duh, did they or anyone else not pay attention to the prequels. Jedi aren't supposed to have children, so the vast majority come from parents that are not force-sensitive.

Bloodline was only an explanation for why Luke was so powerful because he was the child of someone born from the force. People only speculated about Rey because JJ's mystery box with her being left on Jakku. Maybe he didn't understand how much this fandom would speculate about everything, but if he wanted her to come from nothing, he could've made it clearer in 7.
 

Shockmaster

Registered User
Sep 11, 2012
16,006
3,373
JJ will have more freedom now that Rey has the jedi texts, can communicate with the force ghosts, and there being a time jump. It should be expected that Rey is stronger, more confident, and display new powers. We already see her force jump in the trailers, that's not going to cause any issues. Based on the leaks, I could potentially see an issue, but we'll see if it's true and how it's done.

JJ and Rian could've saved themselves some of those criticisms by introducing Luke in 7 in a bigger capacity, having a time jump between 7 and 8, or having 8 take longer than a few days or so.

I don't know. I can see a certain clique of Star Wars fans being upset about that because there was a lot of force jumping in the prequels.

Honestly, its easy to see flaws in just about every Star Wars movie (save for maybe Empire Strikes Back) if you want to see them. But too often vocal fans complain about things that just aren't worth complaining about.
 
  • Like
Reactions: OhCaptainMyCaptain

bleedblue1223

Registered User
Jan 21, 2011
51,758
14,662
I don't know. I can see a certain clique of Star Wars fans being upset about that because there was a lot of force jumping in the prequels.

Honestly, its easy to see flaws in just about every Star Wars movie (save for maybe Empire Strikes Back) if you want to see them. But too often vocal fans complain about things that just aren't worth complaining about.
What clique though? People that didn't like the PT or the people that didn't like Rey using the force like she has been?

That's fair to an extent. I think a simple time jump and longer time with Luke would've prevented a lot of the Mary Sue talk.
 

bleedblue1223

Registered User
Jan 21, 2011
51,758
14,662
Bold prediction :laugh::laugh:
I guess my bold prediction is the only people that like the film are the people that just like everything Star Wars just because it's Star Wars. I think making Palpatine work is going to be a tough assignment. How do you logically explain his survival? There are ways it can be done, but I don't really trust JJ to wrap up an ending.
 

OhCaptainMyCaptain

Registered User
May 5, 2014
22,170
2,279
Earth
I guess my bold prediction is the only people that like the film are the people that just like everything Star Wars just because it's Star Wars. I think making Palpatine work is going to be a tough assignment. How do you logically explain his survival? There are ways it can be done, but I don't really trust JJ to wrap up an ending.

Or people just like the movie.

My point was that this movie was going to be divisive, regardless of what story they went with to end it.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->