Spezza vs Weiss

[Capt Tuttle]

Spezza doesn't play with any heart. He's got 2nd line centre potensial right now but if he starts playing with more fire then and only then he will become the all-star everyone wans him to be.

I'm unresolved when it comes to Spezza but he's only 20 years old! I wish he would play with more intensity but I think his style has a lot to do with him looking more aloof than he really is. People like to point out he's no Kovalchuk. No kidding! That's why Spezza was taken 2nd. He does frustrate me at times when he hangs onto the puck but that's the type of player he is and with time, he'll know better what he can and can't do. I also believe there's a reason why Spezza was taken ahead of Weiss. I'd give Spezza an edge right now but there's so much ahead for both.

 

[Sting]

I'm unresolved when it comes to Spezza but he's only 20 years old! I wish he would play with more intensity but I think his style has a lot to do with him looking more aloof than he really is. People like to point out he's no Kovalchuk. No kidding! That's why Spezza was taken 2nd. He does frustrate me at times when he hangs onto the puck but that's the type of player he is and with time, he'll know better what he can and can't do. I also believe there's a reason why Spezza was taken ahead of Weiss. I'd give Spezza an edge right now but there's so much ahead for both.

Spezza was originally going to be taken 1st overall but Kovalchuk being the more flashy of the two was what got him number 1. So far I think Atlanta made the right choice..but this is his 3rd season..this is Spezza's real first season. Their stats are comparable, and I saw Kovalchuk in his first year...he played a lot different. Today he's much smarter, has a lot more jump in his game and you know when he's on the ice.

Spezza has shown this several times this year, but hasn't consistently been a force. That comes with NHL experience...the more games he plays the more he realizes he needs to put in the effort of say, Alfredsson. If he does that, watch out.

 

[Rattrick]

Geez, Heatley played on a crappy Atlanta team and put up impressive numbers, Rick Nash plays on a bad Columbus team and is a difference maker. Weiss has been hurt but all in all when on the ice Spezza has had a much bigger impact.
Just cause Spezza plays on a more talented team with more talented players doesn't mean crap. Put me out there with Hossa or Havlat and I wouldn't do squat. You need talent to play with talent and produce with talent.

This isn't really a good comparison because both Nash and Heatley were looked to as a primary offensive source. At best this season, Weiss was a 2nd line center playing behind Olli.

Smokey, good analysis on the ice time. However, numbers can be shifted to look a number of ways. Weiss plays a lot of time on the PK and a lot less than Spezza on the PP.

 

[CoolburnIsGone]

If you're going to use icetime to compare the 2 players, let's get an accurrate account of average icetime, please.

Weiss
Even-strength - 13.36
Powerplay - 2.22
Penalty Kill - 2.08

Spezza
Even-strength - 11.70
Powerplay - 2.92
Penalty Kill - 0.01

As you can see the difference is maybe 2 shifts/game on even strength in favor of Weiss but then 1 shift/game on powerplay in favor of Spezza. The obvious reason why Weiss has more icetime is because of him playing so much on the penalty kill. You can't use that PK icetime to look at stats because its not like a ton of players are scoring shorties. Weiss is one of the primary reasons why FL is now 2nd in PK this season (86.4%) compared to last season when FL was ranked 26th (81.5%). He also helped improve the PP from 24th (14.1%) last yr to 16th (16.6%) this yr. If you're just using stats to compare the 2, then you're missing a LOT of what is really happening. Weiss was never billed to be a scoring machine like Spezza...he was billed as a smart 2-way, playmaking franchise center. I would still prefer Weiss over Spezza because of the intangibles that Stephen brings that can't be judged on the stat sheet.

 

[HuskyFlames]

I prefer Weiss over Spezza. Spezza may have more raw talent but I see Weiss as a much better overall player. Someone Florida can look down the road to becoming an assistant or even captain. For some reason I just don't see Spezza being able to take on a leadership role.

 

[Vagrant]

All you have to do is watch these two players to figure out who is better. Forget the stats, as far as i'm concerned. Jason Spezza is far and away the better talent of the two, and that is no knock against Stephen Weiss. Spezza has fantastic hockey sense and playmaking ability that i've just not seen out of Weiss. I've seen a great deal of Weiss as well as a great deal of Spezza, and i'm simply not as concerned when the puck is on Weiss's stick. Spezza has an offensive flash to his game that could one day make him a superstar. Weiss doesn't have that ability if you ask me. There is this feeling you get in the pit of your stomach that will let you know who the dangerous players on the team are and i've just not gotten that from Weiss. Call me crazy, but thats how I tend to judge talent. If it's any consolation, Eric Staal doesn't give me that feeling yet either.


In the long run, I think Spezza will be a top line player capable of producing 80-90 points a season and Weiss will be a shifty second line player putting up about 60 points a season.

 

[Other Dave]

Weiss was never billed to be a scoring machine like Spezza...he was billed as a smart 2-way, playmaking franchise center. I would still prefer Weiss over Spezza because of the intangibles that Stephen brings that can't be judged on the stat sheet.

So you'd take, say, Mike Peca over Pavol Demitra? Bobby Holik over Robert Lang? Mike York over Pavel Datsyuk?

Other Dave

 

[Rattrick]

So you'd take, say, Mike Peca over Pavol Demitra? Bobby Holik over Robert Lang? Mike York over Pavel Datsyuk?

Other Dave

No, but as I said before, I would take Sakic over Hejduk. I doubt the scoring difference will be that drastic. Spezza will put up more points, none of us are denying that, but Weiss brings a far more complete game to the table. If the Nedorost-Weiss-Horton line can play like they did before the injuries, don't be shocked if Weiss puts up 60 points next year. Granted, I don't think that will happen, but I definately do think it could.

 

[Sting]

No, but as I said before, I would take Sakic over Hejduk. I doubt the scoring difference will be that drastic. Spezza will put up more points, none of us are denying that, but Weiss brings a far more complete game to the table. If the Nedorost-Weiss-Horton line can play like they did before the injuries, don't be shocked if Weiss puts up 60 points next year. Granted, I don't think that will happen, but I definately do think it could.

There's no way you can compare Weiss to Sakic. Sakic at Weiss' age was tearing it up and you could tell what kind of player he was going to be. Weiss hasn't exactly lived up to what people thought he'd be. Spezza has done very well for himself imo, and his defensive play is only getting better. I'd rather have a guy who can score goals and is average at defense than someone is average at scoring and above average at defensive play. You can find many players today who devote themselves to being a defensive forward.

 

[Sammy*]

When all is lost, its kinda humurous to see the "he brings intangibles" or "he is a very good defensive player" card played.

 

[Doomsday Device]

Oh, I definately did not forget. Here are my thoughts: Spezza outscores Weiss, which I expect will happen a lot over their careers. As PB said, Weiss wasn't able to play with the quality that is on the Sens. His +/- would be great on a team that wasn't so poor defensively. Weiss plays a great all around game and what impresses me most is how he blocks shots so often.

The Nedorost-Weiss-Horton line really started to dominate for a while there. Down goes Horton and shortly after, Weiss breaks his leg. I think Weiss can put up 50-60 points next year and I think Spezza can do that plus.

As I stated a long time ago, I think Spezza will put up more points and Weiss will bring the intangibles to the game. Not to compare anyone, but you can relate it to Hejduk/Sakic. Hejduk usually outscores Sakic, but Sakic is just so important to the Avs.

The problem with your comparison is that Sakic is a better offensive and defensive player than Hejduk.

 

[Capt Tuttle]

The problem with your comparison is that Sakic is a better offensive and defensive player than Hejduk.

 

[Egil]

The other problem is that Sakic (like Yzerman, and like many others) were one way offensive stars at a young age. To put it bluntly, players of that talent level do not need to play defense in juniors, as they are good enough to complete control the play most of the time.

Defense can be tought, offensive skill can't, and it is why I laugh every time someone mentions that a prospect has "a good defensive game" or some similar statement. Kovolchuk's D is slowly but surely coming around. Or Hossa, a guy who actually FELL in the draft because of his poor defensive play, who is now an excelent defensive forward (along with the top notch offense).

Spezza's D has improved by leaps and bounds, give it a bit more time, and it will be as good as Wiess....

 

[Rattrick]

There's no way you can compare Weiss to Sakic. Sakic at Weiss' age was tearing it up and you could tell what kind of player he was going to be. Weiss hasn't exactly lived up to what people thought he'd be. Spezza has done very well for himself imo, and his defensive play is only getting better. I'd rather have a guy who can score goals and is average at defense than someone is average at scoring and above average at defensive play. You can find many players today who devote themselves to being a defensive forward.

And where did I compare Weiss to Sakic?? If you read back a little while I said that player who play both sides of the puck are much more important than 1 dimension players. Sakic is out scoring Hejduk this year, so it may not have been the best comparison.

 

[Vlad The Impaler]

The other problem is that Sakic (like Yzerman, and like many others) were one way offensive stars at a young age. To put it bluntly, players of that talent level do not need to play defense in juniors, as they are good enough to complete control the play most of the time.

Defense can be tought, offensive skill can't, and it is why I laugh every time someone mentions that a prospect has "a good defensive game" or some similar statement. Kovolchuk's D is slowly but surely coming around. Or Hossa, a guy who actually FELL in the draft because of his poor defensive play, who is now an excelent defensive forward (along with the top notch offense).

Spezza's D has improved by leaps and bounds, give it a bit more time, and it will be as good as Wiess....

Egil says it like it is.

Most of the analysis regarding Sakic on this website make me chuckle because it so apparent people have no idea what they are talking about and what kind of player Sakic was at a young age.

A case can be made that Spezza is the one of the two who is more of a young Joe Sakic. An enormous talent but still very raw.

 

[blackhawk down]

I realize that most people, including myself, are going to think that Spezza is going to be a point-per-game mega-star in the near future. However, so far this season, he has 12 points in 20 games.

Weiss has 6 points in his last 3 games, 10 in 10 this year.

What are the chances that Weiss ends up turning out to be the better player?

Ha ha... this is funny. I've been away for a while, serving in Iraq. I remember logging onto this board before, abotu 1.5 years ago, and finding comparisons of various players against Kovalchuk... and consistently all of these comparisons ultimately would find him to be the inferior player (for example, Gaborik >> Kovalchuk, Komisarek >> Kovalchuk, and Spezza >> Kovalchuk)... now we have Spezza being compared to... Steven Weiss...? My how the mightiest of prospects have fallen...

 

[#2]

Spezza by a fair margin