thinkwild said:
Im just a fan like you trying to make sense of it, and i have read quite a few articles on it over the years. I can provide a link for this one which I recently remember.
AndrewsStarsPage
That's an awesome website...
You got that malice was intended, or that there was incompetence from
this page??
What I got out of it is that it is a complex equation to determine hockey-related revenue... That it can be confusing and open to interpretation... not as 'black and white' as us fans would like it to be... as such, it is
best to use the advice and techniques of experts...
Who does the NHLPA use as their financial expert - to determine what is appropriate to consider when calculating hockey-related revenue, Trevor Linden? Where does the NHLPA get their financial advice from?
IMO, it is not out of the ordinary for the NHL to have two sets of reports (when the NHL and the NHLPA are trying to negotiate and come up with an agreement - IMO, it makes sense for them to look at things 'from both sides')... One that analyzes things based on the NHLPA definition... and one that analyzes things from the independent auditor's definition... Perhaps there's even another set of books that analyzes things from an internal NHL definition - but perhaps this report isn't public because the NHL accountants numbers didn't turn out as favourably from an owner's perspective than the independent auditor's report did - I don't think that the owner's are angels and the NHLPA are devils... I see both sides as simply trying to get as much as they can... Accounting is not 'black and white' - and when decisions (and agreements between two very different parties) have to be made based on as accurate numbers as possible, IMO, it's
best to use the outside, unbiased experts to determine the calculations...
There seems to be good 'expert' reasons that explain why the Levitt report defined NHL revenue as they did. 'Expert' reasons that hockey players, and hockey fans like us, just don't immediately understand and consider... As I've read here several times by NHLPA supporters, hockey players aren't businessmen... and even seasoned businessmen hire experts to do complicated accounting...
Me personally, just like I wouldn't be inclined to tell a surgeon how to best perform an operation on me... I wouldn't be inclined to tell a financial expert how to best define and determine revenue... I put faith in their years of training and experience to make the
best decisions they can - under the constraint of being human... If I have questions, I'd expect them to answer them... But I wouldn't be so arrogant to say that the experts were wrong when I'm not an expert in the subject myself! Perhaps I'd get a second or third opinion if I didn't like what I was hearing or seeing...
I hope the NHLPA does as well... get a second or third opinion with
independent auditors...
As an outsider with
far from expert knowledge in accounting, as well as
no exposure in day-to-day NHL operations - I have yet to see anything 'concrete' (the page you linked to included) that gives
reasonable evidence that the Levitt report is flawed... IMO, the concern you raised (different books) has been answered satisfactory in the
same article!
But maybe that's what I want to see (because I'm looking for the report to be credible)... Just like you want to see flaws in the report so that you can discredit it... Perhaps although we are looking at the same blue chair - what I consider to be the colour blue is what you consider to be the colour green...
I'm not arrogant enough to say that you are absolutely wrong, and that I am absolutely right... I am not an expert in accounting nor 'the business of hockey'... And even if I was, we are still entitled to our different points of view...
Us NHL supporters, and you NHLPA supporters are both ignorant to what is going on... or as Russian fan says 'innocent'... To quote Our Lady Peace, 'We are all innocent'
I am trying to look at this with an open mind (trying to look at the chessboard from an overhead perspective) - but I keep levitating towards the owners...
thinkwild said:
Or as Bob Goodenow said:
InsideHockey
Bob Goodenow clearly sees things from a strict NHLPA point-of-view... I don't take anything quoted by him (with those wonderfully scripted adjectives) as an independent, unbiased source... Nor do I with Bettman... I take both what what they say and consider with a 'grain of salt'...
The only thing I consider (as a fan trying to understand the problem) as
'somewhat credible without being a totally biased opinion' is the independent report... It was bound to support either the owners or the players...
It just so happened to support the owner's...
Perhaps have two more independent audits done (one paid for by the NHLPA - with the NHLPA deciding who will do the report)... and one paid for by both - with both the NHL and the NHLPA agreeing to and deciding who will do the report... It would probably take at least a year to do the reports, but IMO, chances are good that there will be no hockey this year or the next at any rate...
Have 'three reports'... I say take the average of all three independent reports, and agree that the averages are the numbers that will be used...
Yes, I live in a simple world