Blue Jays Discussion: So long Pillar, and thanks for all the catches

Status
Not open for further replies.

Longshot

Registered User
Jul 2, 2008
11,161
312
Ontario, Canada
....How is it not important? Why would u not want the guys we acquired for Pilar to be good? Am I crazy here or something?

You didn't say that initially.

You said you want them to "be close to making the club.

I hope every guy they got in the Pillar trade is an all star. But I could care less if they become all stars immediately or in three years.

The key to this trade is freeing up time for Alford to play and finding out what kind of major league player he can be.
 

Canada4Gold

Registered User
Dec 22, 2010
42,969
9,179
I'm pretty happy with that Grichuk contract. We're not flush with outfielders coming through the system. We've got the handful of guys breaking through now but there'll likely always be a spot for him through those 5 years. Lock him up through his prime years, he'll be 32 when it's over and that's a fine time to cut bait then. Plus I like the breakdown if what Buck said on the broadcast was accurate. It's more upfront and less later on, though not significant(AAV is 10.4, years 3-5 Buck said was in the 9's), every little bit helps when we'll spend more money.
 

Cloned

Begging for Bega
Aug 25, 2003
78,863
63,976
I wouldn't be surprised to see a Stroman trade soon given how well he's started the season.
 

Lightsol

Registered User
Aug 2, 2005
4,815
2,679
My wife just text me saying she's not going to another game and not watching the Jays for a long time.

But then again, my wife doesn't understand sports logic and the need for these types of trades. Yes there will be a lot of fans feeling this way. But everyone needs to understand that these moves are being made with an eye to 2021. Not this year.
My father just said they "made themselves worse by trading their BEST player away".
 

Deebo

Registered User
Jan 28, 2005
8,326
1,817
Toronto
The past three years Grichuk has played between 122 and 132 games (and he had some injuries). On what planet does that make him a "4th OF"?

He is a solid major league player. A 162 game average of 28 homeruns and a .788 OPS.

If you think I'm lying, go look at his stats:

Randal Grichuk Stats | Baseball-Reference.com

I was referring to something that was in the conversation that Woodman posted earlier.

I don't think he is a 4th OF. I'm quite happy with the signing.
 

Arthur Morgan

Registered User
Jul 6, 2016
7,729
5,095
Toronto
www.youtube.com
You didn't say that initially.

You said you want them to "be close to making the club.

I hope every guy they got in the Pillar trade is an all star. But I could care less if they become all stars immediately or in three years.

The key to this trade is freeing up time for Alford to play and finding out what kind of major league player he can be.
I dont know much about prospects, my baseball knowledge is about as deep as a fantasy league with 18 teams will allow me to be lol. hope Alford is awesome
 

Cloned

Begging for Bega
Aug 25, 2003
78,863
63,976
I would be tempted to get him an extension or at least try to.

Yeah, it's an interesting situation.

If Stroman goes something like 2.00 ERA over his first 5 starts, I think management won't want to risk NOT maximizing his trade value by waiting.
 

Deebo

Registered User
Jan 28, 2005
8,326
1,817
Toronto
1) I didn't know the contract value when we were speculating about re-signing him. I was thinking more abstractly away from value/salary

2) I said "4th OF on a very good team." as a worst case scenario (ie he regresses a little bit or continues to get hurt on a regular basis. He's absolutely a starting-caliber OF on most teams in the league the way things are now. I probably could've been more precise in my language, but I didn't want to write a whole additional paragraph quantifying the reasoning for my word choice. My posts/comments are long enough already.

3) I don't have super super up-to-date #s, but the generally expected/accepted $/fWAR going rate in free agency is at least $10.5m per win as of 2017. So $10.4m for a 2-3 fWAR guy with whole-OF flexibility over his 27 to 32/33 age seasons is a totally reasonable price.

Yes, I agree, he's an everyday player.

It was just a comment in general that you would want more than a 4th OF

Out of curiousity, what would be a typical fWAR number for a 4th OF on a top team be?
 

Longshot

Registered User
Jul 2, 2008
11,161
312
Ontario, Canada
Or you can not be a smart ass and just answer my question?

Do you understand the concept of rebuilding?

They didn't make the Pillar trade to get better. They made it to acquire some assets and open up playing time for a Triple A OFer.

Do you understand that?

Just like when the Leafs traded Kessel for a first round pick and Kapenen. Neither of those assets made the Leafs better right away, but they were stockpiled for future years.

Are we getting it now? A rebuilding team doesn't make moves/trades to get better today. They make moves with the future in mind.

Is that clear? Or am I still being a smart ass?
 

Deebo

Registered User
Jan 28, 2005
8,326
1,817
Toronto
I would be tempted to get him an extension or at least try to.

Same here, I think the line-up isn't too far from being pretty good.

If they traded Stroman for futures, then I think they'd be looking for a Stroman as soon as next season.
 

Longshot

Registered User
Jul 2, 2008
11,161
312
Ontario, Canada
Yes, that is what I said. It doesn't say I think he is a 4th OF.

Did you read the screen shots of the conversation that Woodman posted?

I need some clarification.

When you say this: "You would hope for more than a 4th OF for 10M+ per season."

How does that mean you are not saying you think he's a 4th OF?
 

Longshot

Registered User
Jul 2, 2008
11,161
312
Ontario, Canada
Same here, I think the line-up isn't too far from being pretty good.

If they traded Stroman for futures, then I think they'd be looking for a Stroman as soon as next season.

I 100% agree. If they trade Sanchez and Stroman, they will then be trying to find a Sanchez and Stroman. If they pitch well this year they should try and sign them to extensions. It's easier said than done, but it's not impossible. I think they have plenty of time with both. They have all of this year and half of next year if they don't sign. There is no need to rush into a trade. (Unless a team blows them away with an offer)
 

Deebo

Registered User
Jan 28, 2005
8,326
1,817
Toronto
I need some clarification.

When you say this: "You would hope for more than a 4th OF for 10M+ per season."

How does that mean you are not saying you think he's a 4th OF?

Again. have you read the screenshots of the conversation that Woodman posted?

That should clarify it for you, if not, I'll be happy to explain.

I can assure you though, I don't think of Grichuk as a 4th OF.
 

zeke

The Dube Abides
Mar 14, 2005
66,937
36,957
love finding 2war players like Grichuk for peanuts, don't love paying market value for 2war players so much.
 

Fonzieleaf

Registered User
Jul 8, 2013
1,879
1,432
Collingwood, Ontario
Do you understand the concept of rebuilding?

They didn't make the Pillar trade to get better. They made it to acquire some assets and open up playing time for a Triple A OFer.

Do you understand that?

Just like when the Leafs traded Kessel for a first round pick and Kapenen. Neither of those assets made the Leafs better right away, but they were stockpiled for future years.

Are we getting it now? A rebuilding team doesn't make moves/trades to get better today. They make moves with the future in mind.

Is that clear? Or am I still being a smart ass?
Hey man, it was just a harmless question. I don’t know what your problem is but don’t talk to me like I’m stupid. You may or may not be a smart ass but you definitely sound like an ass right now.
 

Longshot

Registered User
Jul 2, 2008
11,161
312
Ontario, Canada
Hey man, it was just a harmless question. I don’t know what your problem is but don’t talk to me like I’m stupid. You may or may not be a smart ass but you definitely sound like an ass right now.

Do you understand yet?

They didn't trade Pillar to get better right now. They traded him to open a roster spot for Alford and to get an asset for their inventory?

Sounds like I have answered your "harmless question."
 
  • Like
Reactions: stopclickbait
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->