So...is Mikko Koivu considered a bust yet?

Discussion in 'NHL Draft - Prospects' started by Reilly311, Aug 1, 2004.

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  1. Reilly311

    Reilly311 Guest

    I know he hasen't played in the NHL yet, but it seems to me no one is really talking about this kid. What type of player do you think he'll be? Anyone? I know there are people from Finland who post here so perhaps they could give some insight.
     
  2. db23

    db23 Guest

    Well he certainly doesn't look like he will be as good as Tuomo Ruutu. But then the big knock on Ruutu was his durability so you never know.
     
  3. tom_servo

    tom_servo Registered User

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    This has nothing to do with Koivu's status, but I contend that people should not be afraid to predict busts no matter how young a player is. If you think Koivu is or will be a bust, then dammit, you say so.

    Carry on.
     
  4. Dude, no one talks about the Wild prospects...so he doesn't get much press. I'm wary now that I've heard rumors coming out of the camps about him...
     
  5. Mizral

    Mizral Registered User

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    What is he, 21? A bust? Ask again in 3 or 4 years.

    He might make the NHL, he might not. We'll see.
     
  6. Phillip The Third

    Phillip The Third ... line center ?

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    What rumors ?
     
  7. Inside sources, some inbedded reporter :D
     
  8. ZombieMatt

    ZombieMatt Registered User

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    At this point I certainly wouldn't consider Mikko Koivu a bust. In my opinion, people are far, far too liberal with the term bust, often using it to describe players who didn't reach their maximum, usually over-hyped potential. To me a bust is a player who completely flops, either never makes the NHL or only has a handful of games.

    It drives me nuts when people call players like the Sedins busts. In that case, they are a pair of players who put up very respectable second line point production last year while playing 12-14 minutes a game only and often playing without a competant winger on their side.

    So, is Mikko Koivu going to be a bust? I highly doubt it. He probably is going to be the #1 centre that many heralded him as being either. He probably will never put up 75 or 80 points, but I definitely think he could be a very good second line centre at this point. If I were to guess which way he'd go I'd still lean favourably towards the likelihood of him reaching his potential compared to his 'bust' likelihood.
     
  9. JeSuisReine

    JeSuisReine Registered User

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    I think its hard to say that Koivu is a bust, when he for the first time has reported to a Wild camp. How is he different than a NCAA player who spends all 4 years in school....are they all busts?

    We'll see how Koivu does this season, since he finally is coming over, and its pretty likely that he will be on the roster.

    And TSK....I think you are way over playing the rumors you have heard out of camp. Koivu may have some knocks, but I don't believe they are bad as you have come to believe.
     
  10. I'm just kind of wary with him being over here and he still has the knocks against him skating as an issue...

    Do I think he'll make it? Hell yeah but...he'll be a...well he'll suffer from younger brother syndrome.
     
  11. Pekka Lampinen

    Pekka Lampinen Registered User

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    When Koivu was drafted, those who knew his situation and talent well predicted that it would take three years for him to arrive. No one protested back then, but impatience always proves stronger than memory over time.

    It is sensible to claim that Koivu hasn't developed expectedly over the years, but no one ever appeals to those details in these discussions.
     
  12. Vlad The Impaler

    Vlad The Impaler Registered User

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    Skating is very important but if a player has a couple of other assets, he can certainly make it, even if it looks like speed is becoming more important in the NHL right now.

    He's big, has great hockey sense, is gritty and if he's got half the character of his brother he will never stop working and provide some leadership.

    I think he'll be a very good player and an important piece of the puzzle in Minny eventually.
     
  13. f1nn

    f1nn Registered User

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    Mikko Koivu has been one of my favorite SM-liiga players for a while now and watching him in the playoffs you could really tell he has improved over the season, to me calling him a bust is absurd, maybe partly because I am a TPS homer but he has the skills to make it in the NHL and I can't think of a reason that he would not. He may not be the best skater but in my opinion skating is not as important in the NA style of play as in Europe so it might help him coming to North America.
     
  14. A bigger but slower Wes Walz is what I have him pegged as :D...and maybe a few more assists than goals...
     
  15. Form and Substance

    Form and Substance Registered User

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    According to thestonedkoala, it's a Mikko Koivu!
     
  16. King'sPawn

    King'sPawn Enjoy the chaos

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    "I shall call him... Mini-Mi...kko!"
     
  17. Psycho Papa Joe

    Psycho Papa Joe Porkchop Hoser

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    I see his upside as a 2nd line playmaking center or a 3rd line checking center. I think he'll be a player, but not a star. Think a grittier Joe Juneau, outside of Juneau's rookie year which was an aberation.

    What about a Marcel Hossa to Ottawa, Antoine Vermette to Minny, and Koivu to the Habs three way trade ;)
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2004
  18. MS

    MS 1%er

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    I'll wait until he plays some games in NA before throwing the 'bust' label around, but his progress is certainly disappointing to this point. Looking at the 10 or 15 players taken immediately after him, I think it's fair to say most have passed him in development. 6 goals in ~50 games in an AHL-calibre league is an especially eyebrow-raising stat, and when you couple that with the skating concerns you really have to wonder about his upside. A year from now we should have a pretty good idea which way he'll go, but right now I'd say the odds are better that he'll flop than succeed. Needs to dominate next year in the AHL if he wants to maintain his status as a core part of Minnesota's future.
     
  19. ceber

    ceber Registered User

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    Can anyone who's watched him play comment on his skating? Has it gotten worse in the past three years?
     
  20. Traitor8

    Traitor8 Registered User

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    He's nowhere close to Saku's talent but he is bigger and stronger, i think he is something like 6'3 . He is strong along the boards and I heard he has a nice shot , he also has good defensive awarness. I see a potentiel Holik in him ...3rd line C...top is 2nd line C..
     
  21. MePutPuckInNet

    MePutPuckInNet Registered User

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    AHL? I don't think that's where he'll be. I can't possibly imagine the Wild wouldn't have him in the big club ASAP. As for calling him a "bust", I can't see how he could possibly be considered a bust, most people [in North America] haven't even seen the guy play. He's also had a lot of injuries that have probably held off his progress.

    I've heard a lot of things from players at the prospects camp. He's not quite what anyone has expected, but I don't think anyone has considered him a "bust" yet.
     
  22. f1nn

    f1nn Registered User

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    From that statement I gather that you have not watched the SM-Liiga too much, the AHL is way lower caliber of play than SM-Liiga and the reason he only put up mediocre numbers is partly because his dad had him playing most of the season on the checking line. I do admit his development could be better but he is far from a bust.
     
  23. db23

    db23 Guest

    Why does everyone need to categorize each prospect as a "bust" or a "steal"? There are very few players that fit neatly into either category, especially the latter. Mikko was the 6th overall pick in a fairly deep draft, so the expectations are higher for him, but I think the Wild had a good idea that they were getting a big two way centreman with character and not a scoring star. That is what he has developed inot in Finland. No one expected him to put up numbers like his brother or Teemu Selanne in the SM Liiga.
     
  24. ZombieMatt

    ZombieMatt Registered User

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    I'm on the same side as you in terms of whether not not Koivu is a bust, but just a note regards to the league. I'm not saying I agree with you that the "AHL is way lower caliber of play than SM-Liiga", but even assuming that is the case, I believe success in the AHL is usually a better indication of NHL success than the Finnish league, or any other league, simply because the AHL is the same ice size and the style of play is more comparative to the NHL game.
     
  25. db23

    db23 Guest

    Lots of pros go back and forth between the AHL and tyhe SM Liiga. Without judging the "quality" of the play, you can say that the points a player puts up are worth about the same in each league. In other words, a point a game player in the AHL going to Finland would probably be close to a point a game player there, and vica versa. Mikko Koivu averaged about .65 PPG in Finland a year ago which is the about the same rate as Svitov, Chistov, Sjostrom, and a few others from the 2001 draft averaged in the AHL last season. Better than players like Marcel Goc, Colby Armstrong, Jiri Novotny, etc. Don't be too quick to say that others have passed him in development.
     
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