Confirmed with Link: Skinner traded to Buffalo for 2nd, 3rd, 6th, and prospect

[tarheelhockey]

This is also taking Skinner for his word. With the nature of trade rumors, he has nothing to lose by denying he veto'd trades. In the case where he actually did do that, its not like anyone is going to come with receipts to prove him wrong. And he can still be truthful by saying he didn't veto anything if he just reiterated he wasn't going to waive for a trade to x, y, or z even if trades were in place. Technically, he didn't veto the trade, just didn't waive his NTC.

Waddell himself has confirmed that Skinner didn’t veto any trades.

 

[A Star is Burns]

Ryan McDonagh was not a UFA to be. He's still under his old contract for this season.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Ryan McDonagh was not a UFA to be. He's still under his old contract for this season.

Ah, you are correct. So McDonagh/JT Miller would be like us trading Faulk and Teravainen, neither who are rentals in that sense. Not at all comparable to a rental.

 

[NotOpie]

Whereas for the Canes it just underscores that they have no plans to realistically compete next year. $6 million in Cap space isn’t an opportunity, it is just money they didn’t have to pay out.

I guess I just don't see it that way. There are three distinct options left for the Canes adding impact players.

1. As teams get closer to training camp, they realize a piece or pieces are missing and they are still firmly committed to making a post-season run. Adding an RHD could be a missing piece (either Faulk or TVR).
2. Teams realistically see that they are in the midst of a rebuild/retool or on the cusp of one. They realize they have assets they can move for futures. The Hurricanes have a good bit of valuable futures that could be packaged for an impact player.
3. Training camps break, pre-season gets underway (or even early season games) and teams realize one of the two situations above exist with their squad.

In all three scenarios, the Hurricanes are positioned for potential moves that could add an impact player.

Waddell himself has confirmed that Skinner didn’t veto any trades.

As I've pointed out, there are a number of ways a player's "people" can indicated acceptance of a trade. Skinner's agent merely has to say, "my guy's not accepting a deal like that", fully knowing what Jeff's preferences are. While Jeff didn't "veto" anything, his limited list of options realistically did.

 

[tarheelhockey]

As I've pointed out, there are a number of ways a player's "people" can indicated acceptance of a trade. Skinner's agent merely has to say, "my guy's not accepting a deal like that", fully knowing what Jeff's preferences are. While Jeff didn't "veto" anything, his limited list of options realistically did.

Like I said way upthread, it’s entirely possible Cole didn’t quite understand the nuances of the situation, or that he simply mis-spoke. But he did pretty plainly state that Skinner had actively nixed trades, and went on to accuse Skinner of acting out of pride and being unwilling to help the organization. It takes some contortion to get a different message than that, because he was super direct about it.

Whatever Cole meant to say, it’s a bit crazy-pants to have a paid employee of the organization on WRAL saying that sort of thing (and vaguely citing “rumors” as if he weren’t an insider) when said thing turns out to be untrue. The best possible interpretation is recklessness in their media policy.

 

[Ole Gil]

Like I said way upthread, it’s entirely possible Cole didn’t quite understand the nuances of the situation, or that he simply mis-spoke. But he did pretty plainly state that Skinner had actively nixed trades, and went on to accuse Skinner of acting out of pride and being unwilling to help the organization. It takes some contortion to get a different message than that, because he was super direct about it.

Whatever Cole meant to say, it’s a bit crazy-pants to have a paid employee of the organization on WRAL saying that sort of thing (and vaguely citing “rumors” as if he weren’t an insider) when said thing turns out to be untrue. The best possible interpretation is recklessness in their media policy.

Somebody said something on twitter about Skinner nixing trades. Which made it's way onto some NHL talk radio shows. Could just be Cole hearing some fake news, and repeating it out of ignorance.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Somebody said something on twitter about Skinner nixing trades. Which made it's way onto some NHL talk radio shows. Could just be Cole hearing some fake news, and repeating it out of ignorance.

Cole gave the interview in an official capacity as an ambassador for the organization. If you’re right, then damn.

 

[wisssh]

Cole just wants to make Raleigh great again

Does this include getting tossed from youth games and pounding beers in RCI paring lot?

 

[NotOpie]

Whatever Cole meant to say, it’s a bit crazy-pants to have a paid employee of the organization on WRAL saying that sort of thing (and vaguely citing “rumors” as if he weren’t an insider) when said thing turns out to be untrue. The best possible interpretation is recklessness in their media policy.

....and I think you may have intimated this earlier as well....it could have been a poor attempt at trying to guilt Skinner into being more lenient with the options. I could easily see the organization getting frustrated with the situation. Do not take this as support one way or the other....Skinner had his NMC and had every right to use it. A misguided or ham-handed attempt to use the local media to "influence" things, might have been a poor option, but who knows what was going on behind the scenes at that point.

As I said, I'm not defending the actions, but I can also understand the sentiment around what the good old boys network of players (Cole and Brindy, for example) might have thought/hoped Jeff would have done.

In the end, I think that was a misplayed card from a deck that was already stacked against the organization.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

NHL GMs are not generous in giving up 1st round picks for impending UFAs. The past 10 deadlines highlight that:

Year	Total	Guaranteed	Conditional	Players Dealt
2009	1	1	0	Comrie (Traded With RFA Campoli, Though)
2010	1	1	0	Kovalchuk
2011	1	1	0	Kaberle
2012	1	1	0	Gaustad
2013	4	2	2	Iginla, Miller (Condition On Other Pick Not Met), Jagr
2014	0	0	0
2015	3	3	0	Sekera, Vermette, Franson
2016	2	1	1	Ladd, Russell (Condition Not Met)
2017	3	2	1	Hanzal, Shattenkirk, Eaves
2018	3	2	1	Kane, Nash, Stastny
Average	1.9	1.4	0.5

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Broaden the horizon out to a year instead of ~20 games + playoffs and you only add Burns, Vanek and Lucic to that mix. It’s really the wingers with the intangibles that NHL GMs love that have been getting those picks that aren’t dependent on playoff performance or a contract extension. Skinner isn’t that type of player.

There’s some good and bad there:

+ He has the ability to be 35+ goal caliber as the primary option on his line and elevate lesser talented players
+ He’ll be a relatively young UFA at 27; there are some prime years left if a team re-signs him
+ He knows he has to be around the net to score goals
- Kane set the market; a team will have to give him at least $7 mil x 7 or see walk if he bounces back
- He’s coming off of a down season in which he scored just 24 goals
- He does shy away from contact on the forecheck and is not a physical player
- His playmaking ability is underwhelming
- He’s frustratingly inconsistent on the defensive side of the puck
- He doesn't have the reputation as a leader or winner

Add in the litany of other 2019 UFA wings that teams may become available (Pacioretty, Panarin, Stone, Simmonds, Eberle, etc.) increasing the supply in the market and it’s not impossible that his NMC played a negligible role here. We could have been overestimating his trade value.

 

[Navin R Slavin]

Waddell himself has confirmed that Skinner didn’t veto any trades.

Sematics. If his agent told the club 'he'll only accept trades to these two teams" then he doesn't have to veto trades.

 

[Svechhammer]

Like I said way upthread, it’s entirely possible Cole didn’t quite understand the nuances of the situation, or that he simply mis-spoke. But he did pretty plainly state that Skinner had actively nixed trades, and went on to accuse Skinner of acting out of pride and being unwilling to help the organization. It takes some contortion to get a different message than that, because he was super direct about it.

Whatever Cole meant to say, it’s a bit crazy-pants to have a paid employee of the organization on WRAL saying that sort of thing (and vaguely citing “rumors” as if he weren’t an insider) when said thing turns out to be untrue. The best possible interpretation is recklessness in their media policy.

Probably a little bit of this, little bit of that, with a whole lot of 'Cole lacks PR tact' thrown in. Jeff probably never technically veto'd anything, but either himself, or through his agent or handlers also made it very clear there were some deals not worth exploring. And along comes Cole and treats the situation with the delicacy of cleaning fancy china dishes with a sledgehammer.

Does this include getting tossed from youth games and pounding beers in RCI paring lot?

I heard he bragged about grabbin players by the breezers back during the 2002 run

 

[DaveG]

Sematics. If his agent told the club 'he'll only accept trades to these two teams" then he doesn't have to veto trades.

And that's his right when he has an NMC (damn you Rutherford) excluding all but 5 teams. My guess is that list probably looked something like Buffalo, Toronto, Ottawa (3 teams closest to home), Pittsburgh (awww hell naw) and who the hell knows on #5... probably Detroit or Washington (similarly hell naw on the Caps).

 

[tarheelhockey]

Sematics. If his agent told the club 'he'll only accept trades to these two teams" then he doesn't have to veto trades.

But that’s not what Cole said. He very said in plain language he understood that Skinner “nixed” trades that were on the table. If he had the facts wrong, that’s because he was trusting Twitter rather than simply getting basic facts from his own employer in order to do his actual job, let alone talk to his close friend Rod who was apparently driving the whole thing.

Waddell went on to say that no offer was ever brought to Skinner OR Meehan other than the Buffalo offer. So it isn’t a technical issue of which person was doing the actual talking. Incidentally, Waddell also said he spoke to every team in the league about Skinner, which makes little sense if the NTC list only had a couple of teams on it.

IMO there’s something just kind of weird about how the narrative on this situation morphed over time, and how the facts stated by different Canes staff don’t line up. It’s probably no big deal, but reminds me a bit of the GM and HC searches where we got weirdly contradictory information from one end of the process to the other.

 

[Svechhammer]

But that’s not what Cole said. He very said in plain language he understood that Skinner “nixed” trades that were on the table. If he had the facts wrong, that’s because he was trusting Twitter rather than simply getting basic facts from his own employer in order to do his actual job, let alone talk to his close friend Rod who was apparently driving the whole thing.

Waddell went on to say that no offer was ever brought to Skinner OR Meehan other than the Buffalo offer. So it isn’t a technical issue of which person was doing the actual talking. Incidentally, Waddell also said he spoke to every team in the league about Skinner, which makes little sense if the NTC list only had a couple of teams on it.

IMO there’s something just kind of weird about how the narrative on this situation morphed over time, and how the facts stated by different Canes staff don’t line up. It’s probably no big deal, but reminds me a bit of the GM and HC searches where we got weirdly contradictory information from one end of the process to the other.

If you're going to assume nobody lied, and Cole was working on internal knowledge, and not internet hearsay (please be the case), I wouldn't put it past the Canes getting offers from teams on the NTC list they wish they could have made, but couldn't because they had it made very clear that he wasn't waiving. Cole catches wind, misunderstands the situation, and mouths off, overstating the situation as Skinner vetoing trades when Waddell knew it wasn't even worth bringing them to his attention.

 

[tarheelhockey]

If you're going to assume nobody lied, and Cole was working on internal knowledge, and not internet hearsay (please be the case), I wouldn't put it past the Canes getting offers from teams on the NTC list they wish they could have made, but couldn't because they had it made very clear that he wasn't waiving. Cole catches wind, misunderstands the situation, and mouths off, overstating the situation as Skinner vetoing trades when Waddell knew it wasn't even worth bringing them to his attention.

Entirely possible. It just goes back to Cole facepalmishly running his mouth in the media about something that really shouldn’t have been broached publicly on half-baked info.

 

[Navin R Slavin]

I mean, the gist is essentially the same: Skinner limited the team's options. That's undeniable, and 100% his right.

No big surprise that Cole didn't articulate the nuances of the situation, and maybe he should have kept his mouth shut, but in the end I don't think it made any difference one way or another. It's not like other GMs didn't know the deal.

 

[bleedgreen]

I'm not convinced about Waddell enough to take anything he says at face value. I'm not saying he's full of crap on this issue, I just think it's possible there was more action than we know about with Skinner.

 

[sheriff bart]

I think Cole was the second shooter on the grassy knoll

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Waddell went on to say that no offer was ever brought to Skinner OR Meehan other than the Buffalo offer. So it isn’t a technical issue of which person was doing the actual talking. Incidentally, Waddell also said he spoke to every team in the league about Skinner, which makes little sense if the NTC list only had a couple of teams on it.

3 way deal. skinner to buff/leafs, we flip the assets for a roster player.

 

[tarheelhockey]

I think Cole was the second shooter on the grassy knoll

Not accurate enough to be that guy.

 

[Lempo]

Not accurate enough to be that guy.

Counterpoint: if I had done a high-profile assassination, I too would do everything to let on afterwards that I wouldn't hit a barn even if I shot from inside of it.

I btw would like to mention that I was the second crappiest shot in my battalion in a shooting test during my conscription. Only one other guy in my platoon was worse.

 

[AD Skinner]

Cole's magic bullet swerved out wide, dropped the shoulder and cut in at the last second

 

[Wolfpuck]

Cole was born 15 years after JFK's assassination.

The perfect alibi.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Counterpoint: if I had done a high-profile assassination, I too would do everything to let on afterwards that I wouldn't hit a barn even if I shot from inside of it.

*glances suspiciously at Elias Lindholm*