Salary Cap: Signing Jacob Trouba

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surixon

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It could also be just as simple as his agent stated last year when he stated he felt that his client wasn't being put in a position to succeed by playing with Stuart or on his off side and as a result it was hurting his long range earning potential. Maybe he didn't sign the 6 at 5.5 million because he didn't believe it represented his true worth as a player and that he wanted the opportunity to prove he was an elite dmen and earn Doughty type money on his next season. After next season he will be in line for that type of deal imo and his bet will have paid off.
 

Weezeric

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It could also be just as simple as his agent stated last year when he stated he felt that his client wasn't being put in a position to succeed by playing with Stuart or on his off side and as a result it was hurting his long range earning potential. Maybe he didn't sign the 6 at 5.5 million because he didn't believe it represented his true worth as a player and that he wanted the opportunity to prove he was an elite dmen and earn Doughty type money on his next season. After next season he will be in line for that type of deal imo and his bet will have paid off.

Agree with this. All the comparables at that time were signing deals at 5.5-6. There was no way he was going to get 7.5-8 then. He may get that or even more next summer. Especially if he puts up 50+ points.
 

Saidin

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I do think he wants out of here, but until he's gone, I can still hope.

His numbers from what I can tell are some of the best compared to the other kids his age so yes, I want the Jets to do whatever they can to keep him. Even overpay...
 

nobody important

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I'm unclear why some people regularly feel the need to point out that Trouba acted within his rights under the CBA. This is self evident. If it wasn't, he couldn't have done what he did. If it's being used as a defense of his behaviour, sorry I will never accept that.

And can anyone name an NHL player that sat out while requesting a trade, and then went on to a long and happy career with that organization?
 

YWGinYYZ

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I'm unclear why some people regularly feel the need to point out that Trouba acted within his rights under the CBA. This is self evident. If it wasn't, he couldn't have done what he did. If it's being used as a defense of his behaviour, sorry I will never accept that.

And can anyone name an NHL player that sat out while requesting a trade, and then went on to a long and happy career with that organization?

Because even though it's a truism, it seems to have to be said? I don't fault anyone for seeking appropriate compensation for their services. I prefer those that do it in a more positive manner, but at the end of the day: it's all business. If he helps the Jets win the SC / win games, I don't give a rats you-know-what about how he negotiated on the business side of the equation of hockey.

Others obviously disagree - that's fine, and I actually understand their positions.
 

Eyeseeing

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At the end of the day I think
Trouba is getting advice that he may not be 100% in favour of .
Last year he wanted to clarify his position on the radio and his agent intervened and shut that down quickly.
I am guessing he wants to be paid well.
I am totally guessing he feels misunderstood.
It's not the first time an agent or players parents interfere in the negotiations of their kid.
We have no idea how he feels about playing here but I really believe Jacob wanted to set the record straight last year and confirm no reluctance to play here.
 

surixon

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At the end of the day I think
Trouba is getting advice that he may not be 100% in favour of .
Last year he wanted to clarify his position on the radio and his agent intervened and shut that down quickly.
I am guessing he wants to be paid well.
I am totally guessing he feels misunderstood.
It's not the first time an agent or players parents interfere in the negotiations of their kid.
We have no idea how he feels about playing here but I really believe Jacob wanted to set the record straight last year and confirm no reluctance to play here.

I agree. What we have witnessed to date is straight out of the Overherdt playbook. He is a hard negotiator who tends to go to extreme lengths to get the maximum compensation possible. What is happening now is fairly similiar to what has gone down with some of his other clients. I also don't believe Jacob is fully driving the bus here.
 

nobody important

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At the end of the day I think
Trouba is getting advice that he may not be 100% in favour of .
Last year he wanted to clarify his position on the radio and his agent intervened and shut that down quickly.
I am guessing he wants to be paid well.
I am totally guessing he feels misunderstood.
It's not the first time an agent or players parents interfere in the negotiations of their kid.
We have no idea how he feels about playing here but I really believe Jacob wanted to set the record straight last year and confirm no reluctance to play here.

He would only have been preaching to the choir. Anything I've heard from him since has been pretty unconvincing. Maybe he's just a lousy speaker, but I'm not buying what he's selling. If that's the case, he should probably take some lessons. "Promoting his brand" would come easier with some eloquence and at least the ability to fake sincerity. He could do worse than modelling himself after Eddie O. Hell, I'm as cynical as they come, and even I bought into his IT'S COMING BACK TO WINNIPEG!!! rallying cry. William Wallace got nothin' on that dude. :laugh:
 

nobody important

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I agree. What we have witnessed to date is straight out of the Overherdt playbook. He is a hard negotiator who tends to go to extreme lengths to get the maximum compensation possible. What is happening now is fairly similiar to what has gone down with some of his other clients. I also don't believe Jacob is fully driving the bus here.

Is that a euphemism, like Jacob is one goal short of a hat trick? :D
 

scelaton

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Unsure how you can declare Trouba a 'loser' since his gamble has not yet been completed. If he has another monster season, he sure looks he will be paid handsomely. Could be a winner after all?
I did not declare Trouba a loser; I said his side lost a gamble, which is far different in connotation.
His side engaged in job action a a time when he had virtually no leverage, hoping that would facilitate...I frankly don't know what. That was dumb AFAIK, because he could have easily signed a bridge without damaging the relationship. It is never, ever smart to gratuitously irritate the other party when they hold the power. Gamble lost.

A further gamble is the one he is taking by risking guaranteed lifetime economic luxury (LT contract now) for the possibility of more money, if he stays healthy and plays well. He will never need or notice that extra $10M ($60M in a year vs $50M now) if he 'wins', but he will sure notice the consequences if he blows his knee or crashes into the boards head first...again. No,he has not lost that gamble yet, but why would any young man in his right mind take it? Either he is recklessly confident, or getting bad advice.
 

SLAYER

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I did not declare Trouba a loser; I said his side lost a gamble, which is far different in connotation.
His side engaged in job action a a time when he had virtually no leverage, hoping that would facilitate...I frankly don't know what. That was dumb AFAIK, because he could have easily signed a bridge without damaging the relationship. It is never, ever smart to gratuitously irritate the other party when they hold the power. Gamble lost.

A further gamble is the one he is taking by risking guaranteed lifetime economic luxury (LT contract now) for the possibility of more money, if he stays healthy and plays well. He will never need or notice that extra $10M if he 'wins', but he will sure notice the consequences if he blows his knee or crashes into the boards head first...again. No,he has not lost that gamble yet, but why would any young man in his right mind take it? Either he is recklessly confident, or getting bad advice.

Eh, I don't see them as separate, it's all part of the same plan. Either way, if he gets his payday, all of this will have paid off for him in the end. Honestly don't see him 'losing a gamble' yet. Depending how this all turns out, he could absolutely end up 'losing'... or he could end up with a very large contract. A little early to judge at the moment.

And you can split hairs concerning my wording about being a 'loser' and 'losing a gamble' all you want, but since we were both talking about the same thing, one should assume that the 'loser' phrasing I chose to use was referring to your post I had previously quoted.
 

puck stoppa

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He would only have been preaching to the choir. Anything I've heard from him since has been pretty unconvincing. Maybe he's just a lousy speaker, but I'm not buying what he's selling. If that's the case, he should probably take some lessons. "Promoting his brand" would come easier with some eloquence and at least the ability to fake sincerity. He could do worse than modelling himself after Eddie O. Hell, I'm as cynical as they come, and even I bought into his IT'S COMING BACK TO WINNIPEG!!! rallying cry. William Wallace got nothin' on that dude. :laugh:

He does seem to have a personality of a chair. He is not a great public speaker no doubt.
 

Peggy

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Once again, this has nothing to do with my original post. Once again, everything Trouba has done is completely within his rights as an NHLPA member. You never answered my earlier question: do you feel the same way about PK? Has PK's cap hit hurt the Preds?

Trouba has presumably worked his entire life for this opportunity, and he will make the most of it the way he sees fit. It's sweet to think you would take a different route, but you can't ever know that for certain because you will never be presented with the same opportunity.

Like I mentioned before, I'm not a fan of the way Trouba has handled this, but he is perfectly within his rights. If he wants to gamble with his future and have it pay off, great for him. Takes a lot of confidence to pass over guaranteed money and bet that you will be able to make even more based on your performance.

I did answer it

I believe in considering the teams best interests and your own

Trouba is only thinking of his own and not the team

Meaning the same goes he pk
Even tho he was/is one o the best defense he got max pay for his talent which took a dent to Montreal
Prices contract is can worst
 
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scelaton

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Eh, I don't see them as separate, it's all part of the same plan. Either way, if he gets his payday, all of this will have paid off for him in the end. Honestly don't see him 'losing a gamble' yet. Depending how this all turns out, he could absolutely end up 'losing'... or he could end up with a very large contract. A little early to judge at the moment.

And you can split hairs concerning my wording about being a 'loser' and 'losing a gamble' all you want, but since we were both talking about the same thing, one should assume that the 'loser' phrasing I chose to use was referring to your post I had previously quoted.
Don't mean to split hairs or be argumentative at all, so apologies for any offense taken.
The reason I made the distinction is because I don't want to convey the impression that I think Trouba is a bad person, a "loser", or persona non grata in Winnipeg. He seems like a good enough kid, well-liked by team mates and I would like nothing more than to have him happily ensconced here. I just fundamentally disagree with the tack he has taken in negotiations. It reminds me a bit of how Byfuglien plays hockey on his bad days :laugh:
 

lanky

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It is never, ever smart to gratuitously irritate the other party when they hold the power. Gamble lost.

I agree, sitting out was a gamble lost. However Overhardt used that exact same trick with Turris and it worked like a charm. Softer gm's might have caved.
 

Peggy

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Agree with this. All the comparables at that time were signing deals at 5.5-6. There was no way he was going to get 7.5-8 then. He may get that or even more next summer. Especially if he puts up 50+ points.

More? I'm starting to think he's being over rated
 

Gurilla

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I think Trouba will sign but after this season. He was clearly pressured by his agent and rightfully so to play higher in the lineup to live up to his potential and get the money he deserves. He had the #1 spot this season but only due to a Myers injury. Play him at #1 this season from the get go and let him flourish. Pay him accordingly.
 

Jet

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Trouba is not staying. Mark my words. He is a young AMERICAN defenseman, who has already demonstrated he does not want to play in small market Canada through the weak excuses he had for holding out.

The next negotiation will say a lot (since he was utilized just as he wanted to be last year)

He will go to NY or Miami, or Chicago or LA and will be tickled pink. Time to start working on a deal where we can get something back that might replace him. It will most likely have to be a 3 way where we trade him for a young star forward, and then parlay our premium youth up front to get a mid 20's stud for our top 4 on the left side.
 

nobody important

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Trouba is not staying. Mark my words. He is a young AMERICAN defenseman, who has already demonstrated he does not want to play in small market Canada through the weak excuses he had for holding out.

The next negotiation will say a lot (since he was utilized just as he wanted to be last year)

He will go to NY or Miami, or Chicago or LA and will be tickled pink. Time to start working on a deal where we can get something back that might replace him. It will most likely have to be a 3 way where we trade him for a young star forward, and then parlay our premium youth up front to get a mid 20's stud for our top 4 on the left side.

None of this crow eating talk for you, eh? ;)
 

Jet

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None of this crow eating talk for you, eh? ;)

:laugh::laugh:

I don't mind being wrong, we all are from time to time!

I base my opinions on the facts I know, and none of us usually know everything. I feel as long as you take the time to form a well thought out opinion I respect that opinion, even if I think it's wrong. Wish other people did that more :D
 

ps241

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Trouba is not staying. Mark my words. He is a young AMERICAN defenseman, who has already demonstrated he does not want to play in small market Canada through the weak excuses he had for holding out.

The next negotiation will say a lot (since he was utilized just as he wanted to be last year)

He will go to NY or Miami, or Chicago or LA and will be tickled pink. Time to start working on a deal where we can get something back that might replace him. It will most likely have to be a 3 way where we trade him for a young star forward, and then parlay our premium youth up front to get a mid 20's stud for our top 4 on the left side.

If you are right and this is a foregone conclusion then it will be interesting to see how Chevy plays it. I don't think we NEED to panic since he is our property for three more seasons. How does one maximize JT's value then becomes a question but it has to be weighted against what value he brings over those three seasons? None of us know the offers Chevy has been receiving nor do Chevy or any of us know if they will get better or worse as time goes on and more importantly how much they change?

To put it in perspective Matt Duchene has 66% of Trouba's time left under Colorado's control before he is free to walk as a UFA yet nobody chats much about the time frame? Does anyone here that is sane think Matt is sticking around? Three seasons is a lifetime in the NHL and I doubt Chevy "Frolik's" this one up. I am looking forward to watching how this season unfolds with the Jets and how all the D prospects progress.
 

Jet

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If you are right and this is a foregone conclusion then it will be interesting to see how Chevy plays it. I don't think we NEED to panic since he is our property for three more seasons. How does one maximize JT's value then becomes a question but it has to be weighted against what value he brings over those three seasons? None of us know the offers Chevy has been receiving nor do Chevy or any of us know if they will get better or worse as time goes on and more importantly how much they change?

To put it in perspective Matt Duchene has 66% of Trouba's time left under Colorado's control before he is free to walk as a UFA yet nobody chats much about the time frame? Does anyone here that is sane think Matt is sticking around? Three seasons is a lifetime in the NHL and I doubt Chevy "Frolik's" this one up. I am looking forward to watching how this season unfolds with the Jets and how all the D prospects progress.

Well I think you see Colorado has obviously started a serious effort to trade Duchene, and have given themselves time to get the right deal. I sure hope that Chevy can see the writing on the wall and is skillful enough to create a bidding war so there isn't a panic move at the 11th hour.

I didn't think Chevy had it in him to do what he did this offseason so he's bought a little bit of good faith from me.
 

SLAYER

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I did answer it

I believe in considering the teams best interests and your own

Trouba is only thinking of his own and not the team

Meaning the same goes he pk
Even tho he was/is one o the best defense he got max pay for his talent which took a dent to Montreal
Prices contract is can worst

It's always nice when players take a perceived 'discount' that may or may not help the team's cap structure, but it's far from the norm. Why should a player take less money than they feel they are worth? If Trouba goes out this season and earns his payday, then good for him! He will certainly be helping the team in a large way with his on-ice performance if this is the case.

PK's contract didn't seem to hurt the Preds too much this past season, considering they made it to the SCF... He's worth the money.

Every team has to manage their cap, and it's not a players job to take less money just to help out their GM. I'm unsure why you expect this



Don't mean to split hairs or be argumentative at all, so apologies for any offense taken.
The reason I made the distinction is because I don't want to convey the impression that I think Trouba is a bad person, a "loser", or persona non grata in Winnipeg. He seems like a good enough kid, well-liked by team mates and I would like nothing more than to have him happily ensconced here. I just fundamentally disagree with the tack he has taken in negotiations. It reminds me a bit of how Byfuglien plays hockey on his bad days :laugh:

:laugh: No offense taken at all. Sometimes text does not translate well, and I'm certainly not a writer. I'm not a fan of Trouba's negotiation strategy either, but it is what it is. Can only hope he will earn his payday and re-sign long term with the club.
 
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