Should the Kraken go all in before trade deadline?
- Thread starter Dog
- Start date
Scomerica
Registered User
We kind of talked about it a little on the roster thread. Think everyone is torn on what to do with Soucy. He's a UFA at seasons end, do you trade him to get some picks and bring up a prospect or not eff with team chemistry.
I think the consensus was that if we keep this going we'll bring in a few solid depth pieces defensively but nothing crazy as Francis is usually pretty conservative and won't sacrifice the future.
I think the consensus was that if we keep this going we'll bring in a few solid depth pieces defensively but nothing crazy as Francis is usually pretty conservative and won't sacrifice the future.
Fistfullofbeer
Moderator
I think we stay pat or make a minor deal. The cost for an upgrade is going to be too high for us so it would likely be in our best interest to just stay pat at the TDL. Going all-in makes no sense in our 2nd year since unlike Vegas we are hedging our bets on how our prospects perform in the next 2-3 years.
That being said, we could use more help in the top-4D. Basically an upgrade on Oleksiak.
Dunn-Larsson has actually looked really good as a top-pairing, even against tough comp and the better teams, so no need to touch that.
Schultz-Oleksiak has not been great but I feel its mainly because of Oleksiak's defensive awareness. He gives up too much space in front of the net and at times does a terrible job clearing the zone leading to goals against and defensive turnovers. Schultz has actually been respectable in that role.
Soucy-Borgen has been really good as a 3rd pairing and really does not need an upgrade, but any upgrade in the top-4 would, on paper, not make the bottom pairing any worse.
The problem with improving that top-4 is two-fold.
a) It is likely going to cost more than what we want to pay. I doubt Francis even bothers with rentals unless they are a steal.
b) An upgrade in the top-4 D is likely going to push Oleksiak to the 3rd pairing and make him a very expensive 3rd pairing D since he is signed for another 3 seasons after this one @4.6M AAV.
Probably in our best interests to just roll with what we have and hope that Evans or Nelson can step into a top-4 role by 2024-25 or earlier.
That being said, we could use more help in the top-4D. Basically an upgrade on Oleksiak.
Dunn-Larsson has actually looked really good as a top-pairing, even against tough comp and the better teams, so no need to touch that.
Schultz-Oleksiak has not been great but I feel its mainly because of Oleksiak's defensive awareness. He gives up too much space in front of the net and at times does a terrible job clearing the zone leading to goals against and defensive turnovers. Schultz has actually been respectable in that role.
Soucy-Borgen has been really good as a 3rd pairing and really does not need an upgrade, but any upgrade in the top-4 would, on paper, not make the bottom pairing any worse.
The problem with improving that top-4 is two-fold.
a) It is likely going to cost more than what we want to pay. I doubt Francis even bothers with rentals unless they are a steal.
b) An upgrade in the top-4 D is likely going to push Oleksiak to the 3rd pairing and make him a very expensive 3rd pairing D since he is signed for another 3 seasons after this one @4.6M AAV.
Probably in our best interests to just roll with what we have and hope that Evans or Nelson can step into a top-4 role by 2024-25 or earlier.
And throwing away draft picks/prospects for mere rentals that will just end up walking is not worth it. Our GM is on the record saying he won't do that. We have a prospect pool to build and develop especially on defense.
wewantyoursoul
Registered User
We have cap flexibility. We have a developing prospect pool and a plethora (11 in 2023 and 9 in 2024...as of right now) of additional picks in the future. Let's try to build a sustainable powerhouse as opposed to hoping for a one-hit wonder this season and then have little to nothing to build on after that. I'd rather be talking about playoff positioning for the next ten years as opposed to trying to solidify our spot just for this year.
RainyCityHockey
Registered User
I think the tweet posted by @gstommylee says it all.
There's a plan and I doub it includes "going all in" in season two.
To me, if we see a trade happening it's either going to be us adding another depth defenseman and/or bottom six center who is good at faceoffs.
That would help us for the playoffs, if we make it, cause we can't really handle (longer term)inuries to our blue line with Cale Fleury and Gustav Olofsson as our main replacements.
Another thing to keep an eye on, to me, is Soucy.
Overall I doubt Francis would do something in order not to disrupt the chemnistry show so far, but if you can't agree on a new deal for him and some team offers you an interesting deal, you probably have to look at it.
Even if it might cost you a couple of wins short term.
BTW: Talking about depth defenseman.
If we do trade for one.
Would you rather like us to bring in a more physical guy or a puck mover/pp guy like Ghostisbehere?
There's a plan and I doub it includes "going all in" in season two.
To me, if we see a trade happening it's either going to be us adding another depth defenseman and/or bottom six center who is good at faceoffs.
That would help us for the playoffs, if we make it, cause we can't really handle (longer term)inuries to our blue line with Cale Fleury and Gustav Olofsson as our main replacements.
Another thing to keep an eye on, to me, is Soucy.
Overall I doubt Francis would do something in order not to disrupt the chemnistry show so far, but if you can't agree on a new deal for him and some team offers you an interesting deal, you probably have to look at it.
Even if it might cost you a couple of wins short term.
BTW: Talking about depth defenseman.
If we do trade for one.
Would you rather like us to bring in a more physical guy or a puck mover/pp guy like Ghostisbehere?
Fistfullofbeer
Moderator
You go with a stay-at-home physical D-man, if we're looking for depth D. Both Soucy and Borgen are good enough at moving the puck for a 3rd pairing. Whoever is that depth D-man just needs to stay home and clear the crease.
UseYourHedman
Hold my beer for a sec
RainyCityHockey
Registered User
Fistfullofbeer
Moderator
Those two could work. Edmundson is another one I have thought about since he adds more than just physicality, but he has a higher AAV and likely a higher cost. However, he is signed for another year and could be a Soucy replacement for next season at just a slightly higher AAV.
NiagaraKraken
Registered User
I’m good with whatever they decide to do. Tolvanen could technically be the Kraken deadline acquisition if he keeps up his play.
Most of the time it doesn't unless said player re-signs with the team. Look at florida they had 2 rentals walk that ended up costing them first round picks. One first was an unprotected first for 2023 NHL entry draft one that could lead montreal to getting bedard in the lottery.
No, not really. The Tolvanen story has been great so far, don't get me wrong. But this was more of Ronnie having impeccable timing and taking advantage of a situation to our advantage (much like the way we hope the Bjorkstrand deal to work out), but to be technical, I believe a deadline acquisition entails an actual risk/return analysis that didn't factor into the nearly risk-less claim of Tolvanen off waivers.
Deadline deals, with respect to the rental market, involve skin in the game with a risk of looking bad or even incompetent if the immediate gamble doesn't pay off or a presumed re-sign doesn't happen as planned. The GM better be 100% certain the HC craves the player in question. And that player needs the maturity to handle the extra pressure incumbent in the role. Not only are you playing as possibly "the missing piece", you are also showcasing for your next contract in a totally new venue with unfamiliar teammates, one of whom's job you likely took.
I doubt the Kraken will make a big splash this year as a buyer, but it is damn nice not worrying what parts we're going to sell. Soucy has his warts and some momentary lapses of judgment, but he's a young, competent big body with upside, and D players with his potential don't grow on trees.
Kat Predator
Registered User
- Nov 28, 2019
- 3,860
- 3,863
What's "all in"? Trading 3 1st round picks and several players for someone like Erik Karlsson?
Why would Francis want to make rando changes to the current chemistry of this team? To create a "buzz" for attention? It would be out of character with what he's stated is the plan, slowly building a sustainable, successful franchise through the draft.
Why would Francis want to make rando changes to the current chemistry of this team? To create a "buzz" for attention? It would be out of character with what he's stated is the plan, slowly building a sustainable, successful franchise through the draft.
The Marquis
Moderator
A goalie? Just saying. I think Jones has earned it, though.
I look but stay the course. This team is winning on chemistry.
I look but stay the course. This team is winning on chemistry.
RainyCityHockey
Registered User
There's none available that would make sense to us.
I think we're more likely to trade one, if anything at all.
Did someone actually want us to go all-in? To me that refers to loading up on rentals, which I think is bad generally and not even necessary for Seattle. Adding a long term piece like Chychrun is totally different in my book.
Can Borgen play more minutes? I haven't been able to watch as intently lately but he looked like he was ready for more last I checked. I'd rather do that than acquire another defensive RD.
Can Borgen play more minutes? I haven't been able to watch as intently lately but he looked like he was ready for more last I checked. I'd rather do that than acquire another defensive RD.
I so can't wait for Chychrun to be delivered to his next team, just to end the speculation and put the 'Yotes out of their misery. Half the team fanbases in the league seem set on getting him. Even teams set at LD. It would suck to be an Arizona fan, with that team and that scumbag owner.
Kevinsane
Kraken up.
I would lean toward minor moves. Let’s see what this roster can do.
Upgrading the D with someone like Luke Schenn would be nice, but not at an overpayment, which is what the Canucks would demand at the trade deadline.
I agree that we’re more likely to see a goalie moved than a goalie acquired. If Driedger can come back and be solid, that’s essentially a free asset.
Upgrading the D with someone like Luke Schenn would be nice, but not at an overpayment, which is what the Canucks would demand at the trade deadline.
I agree that we’re more likely to see a goalie moved than a goalie acquired. If Driedger can come back and be solid, that’s essentially a free asset.
