Should Ilya Kovalchuk be inducted to the HHOF?

[Nick Hansen]

We all saw him play and I think we all can agree that he was HHOF-calibre. But is his career enough? I'd like to argue it is.

Olympic Gold
Olympic MVP
Maurice Richard Trophy
WHC Gold (including GWG)
WHC MVP (the same year)
816 games and 816 pts in the NHL
Five top-10 finishes in points
Awesome career back home in the KHL with 298 games and 327 pts. Two Gagarin's and a Gagarin MVP.

Click to read more...

 

[Nick Hansen]

But let's not induct this guy. Let's induct Patrick 'Anonymous NHL player' Marleau instead.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

That -116 in his NHL career could be a drawback to the Hall.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

But let's not induct this guy. Let's induct Patrick 'Anonymous NHL player' Marleau instead.

I wouldn't induct either of them, but based on precedent, I honestly think it's harder to keep Marleau out.

For example, what's the rationale for inducting Kovalchuk but leaving out Zigmund Palffy?

 

[Nick Hansen]

I wouldn't induct either of them, but based on precedent, I honestly think it's harder to keep Marleau out.

For example, what's the rationale for inducting Kovalchuk but leaving out Zigmund Palffy?

Bigger international resume and a very good resume in the second best league in the world. Palffy had neither. An actual trophy (Richard).

 

[BenchBrawl]

I wouldn't induct either of them, but based on precedent, I honestly think it's harder to keep Marleau out.

For example, what's the rationale for inducting Kovalchuk but leaving out Zigmund Palffy?

Goalscoring, bigger reputation and star power...that's it?

 

[Nick Hansen]

That -116 in his NHL career could be a drawback to the Hall.

Weak. He played on rubbish Atlanta teams for the better part of his career. When he came to the Devils, he displayed an average all-around game, nothing great, but average. Better than Ovechkin, that's also the story on the NT.

 

[Nick Hansen]

Also eight (8) times in the top 10 goals of the season finishes.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Weak. He played on rubbish Atlanta teams for the better part of his career. When he came to the Devils, he displayed an average all-around game, nothing great, but average. Better than Ovechkin, that's also the story on the NT.

Only -32 with the Devils in 3 seasons. And -7 in 28 playoff games in Jersey.

It is a weak argument.

What's the NT?

 

[Nick Hansen]

Only -32 with the Devils in 3 seasons. And -7 in 28 playoff games in Jersey.

It is a weak argument.

What's the NT?

National team. I've seen both Ovy and Kovy on the NT a lot, there it is obvious that in an all-around sense of the game, Kovalchuk destroys Ovechkin. The latter may be more aggressive, better suited to the NHL size of the ice an so on but man... Ovy looks like a clown in the NT. He can shoot, that's it.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

National team. I've seen both Ovy and Kovy on the NT a lot, there it is obvious that in an all-around sense of the game, Kovalchuk destroys Ovechkin. The latter may be more aggressive, better suited to the NHL size of the ice an so on but man... Ovy looks like a clown in the NT. He can shoot, that's it.

Well, in the NHL he knocks a lot of guys on their butts.

That probably has more impact on HHOF voters than NT play.

 

[Nick Hansen]

It's not the NHL Hall of Fame.

I challenge anyone to give me an example of a player who was in the top ten of goal finishies EIGHT times and who went un-inducted to the HHOF.

 

[Nick Hansen]

Maybe it is an aspect not appreciated enough in North America - how horrid Ovechkin always has been for team Russia. I guess his stats aren't exactly brutal, but they're not particularly impressive either relative to the opposition and his own standing in the NHL. Very bad for the most part.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

I challenge anyone to give me an example of a player who was in the top ten of goal finishies EIGHT times and who went un-inducted to the HHOF.

Closest off the top of my head - Roy Conacher was top 10 in goals 8 times and wasn't inducted until a Veteran's Committee came along many decades after he retired. Perhaps that will be Kovalchuk's fate.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Goalscoring, bigger reputation and star power...that's it?

Goalscoring is a factor yes.

 

[Nick Hansen]

Closest off the top of my head - Roy Conacher was top 10 in goals 8 times and wasn't inducted until a Veteran's Committee came along many decades after he retired. Perhaps that will be Kovalchuk's fate.

In terms of point and goal finishes, they seem very comparable. Interesting.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

It's not the NHL Hall of Fame.

I challenge anyone to give me an example of a player who was in the top ten of goal finishies EIGHT times and who went un-inducted to the HHOF.

And I challenge you to give me an example of a player with more than -100 (plus/minus) inducted into the Hall.

Odd case, this Kovalchuk.

 

[Fantomas]

Olympic Gold
Olympic MVP
WHC Gold (including GWG)
WHC MVP (the same year)

We are talking about the NHL Hall of Fame here.

(he should be in, but he won't be - at least for a while)

 

[trentmccleary]

He played on rubbish Atlanta teams for the better part of his career.

The Devil's advocate side of the debate says that:
He was given a whopping 6 minutes of PP time per game on that rubbish team and allowed to do whatever he wanted to pad his personal stats, at the expense of team success.

 

[Nick Hansen]

And I challenge you to give me an example of a player with more than -100 (plus/minus) inducted into the Hall.

Odd case, this Kovalchuk.

He might be.

I saw Kovalchuk play ice hockey. And I know he was far superior to a lot of the clowns inducted lately. If we're to nag about his - , why is Phil 'No Defense whatsoever' Housley in there? He was a clown. And everyone knew it.

 

[Nick Hansen]

The Devil's advocate side of the debate says that:
He was given a whopping 6 minutes of PP time per game on that rubbish team and allowed to do whatever he wanted to pad his personal stats, at the expense of team success.

This is not what the HHOF inducts players on any way.

 

[MadLuke]

I challenge anyone to give me an example of a player who was in the top ten of goal finishies EIGHT times and who went un-inducted to the HHOF.

Highest I could find out of the Hall

Bondra/Heatley: 6 times
Tkachuk/Rick Martin/Corey Perry/Tim Kerr: 5 times
Hossa: 4times

Good separation

 

[MXD]

If you hate the HHOF so much, why do you want your favorite player enshrined?

 

[MadLuke]

And I challenge you to give me an example of a player with more than -100 (plus/minus) inducted into the Hall.

Odd case, this Kovalchuk.

NHL.com - Stats

Leo Boivin: -212
Howell: -152
Federko: -131
Hawerchuck: -98
Gadbsy: -62
Bathgate: -60
Housley: -53
etc....

Maybe some of those had their prime before the nhl started recording them, but there is some -100 type career in the Hall.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

He might be.

I saw Kovalchuk play ice hockey. And I know he was far superior to a lot of the clowns inducted lately. If we're to nag about his - , why is Phil 'No Defense whatsoever' Housley in there? He was a clown. And everyone knew it.

He shouldn't be.

Like Kovy.

So maybe he will get in.