Player Discussion Shea Weber -- Leader of the Ents Edition

[Miller Time]

Come on man! you're cherry picking an infinite number of encounters throughout time of which there are countless skirmishes that no one could possible recall all of them. Just calling it as I see it,imo

cherry picking?

i don't know what games you watch... but i see far more of Anderson's type of reaction to dangerous plays like that than I do of Weber's. If anything, i'd almost agree with you that it is often too much and unwarranted, just like all of the fighting, but that is what the NHL culture is.

 

[Miller Time]

I never though I'd find myself in total agreement with @417 <3

This team should be better than what it is with it's current personnel.

"Could"... yes.

"Should"...? aside from Weber and Price, who has really underwhelmed this year?

meanwhile, Toffoli & Petry have exceeded expectations.
Anderson, Edmundson, Allen, Perry... exceeded or at minimum met.
Gallagher matched or exceeded, while Danault (just below career ppg, Tatar (just above career ppg) at or a bit below...

Suzuki/JKO/Romanov, more or less as to be expected.

Chiarot? Byron? Armia? Drouin? are any of them really performing below realistic expectations?

what would have suggested a better outcome if, by and large, the players are individually performing within a pretty good range of expectations, with a few key guys quite ahead and a few key guys quite below (though I'd argue Weber was always going to struggle).

the hype train ramped up with each move and dollar spent last summer, but the sum of the parts always pointed to pretty much this result... struggling to make the playoffs.

 

[Andy]

"Could"... yes.

"Should"...? aside from Weber and Price, who has really underwhelmed this year?

meanwhile, Toffoli & Petry have exceeded expectations.
Anderson, Edmundson, Allen, Perry... exceeded or at minimum met.
Gallagher matched or exceeded, while Danault (just below career ppg, Tatar (just above career ppg) at or a bit below...

Suzuki/JKO/Romanov, more or less as to be expected.

Chiarot? Byron? Armia? Drouin? are any of them really performing below realistic expectations?

what would have suggested a better outcome if, by and large, the players are individually performing within a pretty good range of expectations, with a few key guys quite ahead and a few key guys quite below (though I'd argue Weber was always going to struggle).

the hype train ramped up with each move and dollar spent last summer, but the sum of the parts always pointed to pretty much this result... struggling to make the playoffs.

I think Weber, Drouin and Price aren't playing to what was expected, which has hurt.

I also think Suzuki and KK haven't taken as big a step as they should have, which is a huge deal considering they're both centres. Suzuki is putting up decent points, but on ice impact and ability to tilt a game has been marginal.

KK is getting better, but he still players like a kid.

Slightly better performances from Weber, KK, Drouin, Price, and Suzuki would have been a huge difference this year.

 

[417]

I never though I'd find myself in total agreement with @417 <3

This team should be better than what it is with it's current personnel.

Wasn't so difficult was it? Lol

 

[angusyoung]

cherry picking?

i don't know what games you watch... but i see far more of Anderson's type of reaction to dangerous plays like that than I do of Weber's. If anything, i'd almost agree with you that it is often too much and unwarranted, just like all of the fighting, but that is what the NHL culture is.

Cherry picking,selective choice of skirmishes. There are just too many incidents to explore if going down that road is all I'm saying. Weber is past his prime to be combative,hence they brought in the likes of Chiarot, Edmundson and Anderson to alleviate the burden bestowed upon Weber. The only fighting that I find acceptable is spur of the moment,none of this vendetta crap etc.

 

[Deebs]

Well, there's always another shift on the ice. I didn't watch the game, did you see him respond in any way? He was quick to call hockey a team game when asked about his individual performance so I just think that it should go both ways.

So he should work over McDavid for a nothing hit, take a penalty and let the best player in the world get more powerplay time when we're trying to win a game to secure a playoff birth. Seems like the smart thing to do.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

I've been very negative about this team and I agree that I think it really needs some subtle tweaks.

The lack of a star forward and/or D man really shows.

For instance, I think a prime Markov would easily catapult this team. It would make Petry's minutes more manageable in terms of time and match ups and Markov could carry a pairing all by himself.

We also need to remember that much of the issue is that Suzuki and KK are still young centres. Hard to really do well when your centre depth is inexperienced. It's one thing to be inexperienced but be a star like Matthews or McDavid, but Suzuki/KK level talent inexperience is going to hurt you no matter what.

Subtle tweaks? That's quite the understatement. While our forward group might need minor tweaks, which is debatable considering the lack of elite talent and getting elite forwards is not minor nor easy, but the epicenter of the Habs woes is the defense, which needs a major overhaul, compounded by nearly unmovable contracts to cornerstones that are all quickly underperforming towards their twilight. Not only is it hitched to aging anchors, its composition is missing major components that are not easy to find, whether through trade, free agency or draft.

Our defense is a massive clusterphoque and it's gonna take way more than subtle tweaks.

 

[Andy]

Subtle tweaks? That's quite the understatement. While our forward group might need minor tweaks, which is debatable considering the lack of elite talent and getting elite forwards is not minor nor easy, but the epicenter of the Habs woes is the defense, which needs a major overhaul, compounded by nearly unmovable contracts to cornerstones that are all quickly underperforming towards their twilight. Not only is it hitched to aging anchors, its composition is missing major components that are not easy to find, whether through trade, free agency or draft.

Our defense is a massive clusterphoque and it's gonna take way more than subtle tweaks.

Subtle tweaks in terms of making this team a PO club. It's not far off.

The D isn't great in terms of puck movement and transition. I agree.

 

[OldCraig71]

So he should work over McDavid for a nothing hit, take a penalty and let the best player in the world get more powerplay time when we're trying to win a game to secure a playoff birth. Seems like the smart thing to do.

Based on the final score, being passive didn't work out that well either did it?

 

[Miller Time]

I think Weber, Drouin and Price aren't playing to what was expected, which has hurt.

I also think Suzuki and KK haven't taken as big a step as they should have, which is a huge deal considering they're both centres. Suzuki is putting up decent points, but on ice impact and ability to tilt a game has been marginal.

KK is getting better, but he still players like a kid.

Slightly better performances from Weber, KK, Drouin, Price, and Suzuki would have been a huge difference this year.

Yup... If everyone met/exceeded expectations, we'd be better than this.

I guess that my point though, it's all but impossible for any team to expect all players to meet/exceed expectations in a given year, not too mention stay healthy.

I don't agree about Drouin at all, but regardless, we have a few key guys below the bar and a few above, that's what I expected and why a borderline playoff team was the most likely result this year.

Hot start, where just about everything went well buffered by the uneven middle & inevitable injury (Gally/Chia/price) /fatigue (Weber/Petry/Edmundson) & youth inconsistencies (JKO/Suzuki) bad spells.

Not surprising, imo. Could be better, could be worse, mostly regressed to the mean.

Hype train MB tried to sell likely inflated all of our expectations. Heck, who could resist the allure of that hot start to believe that was the true reflection of the roster, we are, after all, fans who all badly want the same thing lol

 

[Miller Time]

So he should work over McDavid for a nothing hit, take a penalty and let the best player in the world get more powerplay time when we're trying to win a game to secure a playoff birth. Seems like the smart thing to do.

He should work over mcD any chance he gets... Prime Weber did that consistently, hence why guys like Toews & Zetterberg hated playing against him.

We still play him, pay him & (in some spaces) revere him like that player... & His recent comments suggests he thinks of himself as still having that impact ability ("I want more minutes, not load management")...
Reality is he should be getting far fewer minutes and taking every opportunity to still physically grind on opposing stars...

Pronger, Blake, Chara... All these guys were still nasty sobs through their mid 30's, and they were less reliant on that aspect of their games in their prime.

 

[V13]

I don't think it's a lack of effort , work ethic or leadership. The guy is just too slow to be a top pairing D these days. Nothing more nothing less. And that was 100% to be expected on projections of his 35+ years old contributions

 

[Deebs]

Based on the final score, being passive didn't work out that well either did it?

And that's all on Shea, huh

For a guy that didn't even watch the game you sure have a lot to say about specific situations.

 

[OldCraig71]

And that's all on Shea, huh

For a guy that didn't even watch the game you sure have a lot to say about specific situations.

As if I am the only one that has commented on Shea Weber in the last few days lol. He has gotten off very lightly if you look at the scrutiny that Price, Pacioretty and Subban we’re constantly under. Are you 15 years old?

 

[Ezpz]

Turning from Weber into Butter I guess. At least his skin will age well.

 

[c3z4r]

Stone cold gaze, stoic demeanor and terrifying size. Leadership preserver, no-excuses preventer and destroyer of locker room cancers,. He is Man-Mountain, leader of Ents and first of his name; SHEA WEBER!




Seriously though, I think we should start resting him on back-to-backs or at least actively manage his TOI. I'd rather we barely hobble into the playoffs with a fresh Weber, than have a repeat of his last game in Nashville.

 

[sandviper]

I'd rather we barely hobble into the playoffs with a fresh Weber, than have a repeat of his last game in Nashville.

I think we are well past that.