Sharks are a serious cup contender with Karlsson

Chimpradamus

Registered User
Feb 16, 2006
16,634
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Yes, I know, there is still a huge thread about the neverlasting celebrations with getting Karlsson, paired with some light analysis of various things as PP constellations and whatnot. But I want to talk serious business, sounding like a 17 year old street gangster. This is not about the conversation of joy about the player. This is a conversation about why I claim what I do in the headline.

Where we start is, who is Karlsson, really? I would recommend you - if you are a diehard hockey fan or a hockey nerd, which you should be close to be if you spend time on this site - to watch this 33 minute highlight video of his 16/17 season, the year before he had serious off-season surgery, missed the entire off-season, still played for a Mr Burns/ Uncle Scrooge budget team, his child was stillborn and he became involved in legal court, because of serious family harrassment, within the team. Nice.

Yes, his last season wasn't that great. He was just another pure top 5 defenseman at the shittiest year in his entire life. As for 2012: Losing his girlfriend and getting his achilles cut off, to lose his cheat codes just won't cut it for being the worst year in your life for this guy.

Anyway, here's the video. Never mind the overly loud chorous jedi music over the voices, when Karlsson plays, you can just assume every voice in the background just raves over how dominant and great he is:

Ok. He's ridiculous. So San Jose just got Karlsson. Now what? Well, you just got the defensive version of McDavid, in his own right. "Why did we get another star defenseman?" some doubted among Sharks fans? You didn't get another world class defenseman. You got Karlsson. You didn't get a defenseman. You got a player. Arguably the player in modern hockey. Skill, speed, mobility, vision. Physical aspects come last. Remind you of someone?

He is the best defenseman on the planet if he's in shape and motivated. He is right now, on both, guaranteed. He finally plays for a competitive team with good qualities, a luxury he has only experienced playing for his national team. He doesn't have the pressure every game, he can finally share it with others, but he will still try to be the pressure and draw the attention.

Defensively: He is, without a doubt, very solid in his own end, on his own merits. He isn't big and strong, those are his flaws, but his poke check is very sneaky, he will rarely lose his position, his backchecking is bar none, he can read the play and he is top notch at shot blocking. He's also a master at gaining control of pucks he already blocked. But here's the thing: he's not playing defense to defend, anyway. He plays to dominate the opposition, period. Chances are, you're not defending when you have Karlsson on the ice.

Offensively: Best in the business, bar none. He is extremely elusive, so he is basically never hit. He weaves, finds holes and just dances around like it's a sunday morning most games. He dekes 1-3 guys and there you go, automatic scoring chance or possession. He is the best in the world, bar none at getting the team out of the zone with the puck and has been so for his entire career. He dominates transition and he's elite at controlled zone entries. His vision is world class, his passing is world class, his mobility is world class and his shot is very good.

Mentally: When a franchise player announces the details of a very painful injury in the playoffs and still dominates the ice, I don't know what to tell you. You can prepare to stop him, but you really can't. He's very humble, doesn't throw cheap shots and shows great example. He shows charisma on and off the ice, when he has the puck, the opposition focuses on him. Great news for the Sharks first line.

Special teams: He can play very effective PK:ing, but often doesn't, just because he can't play 35 minutes a game. If he could, he would. It's not because he can't and isn't great at it. On the PP? Well, he's the best QB in the business, 5v5 or on the PP.

Effect on San Jose: He has just upgraded your team to another level. Paired with Vlasic, probably encouraged to just roam and do his thing? This could get nasty. He has off nights, sure, everyone has. But consistently speaking, he's very consistent at dominating the ice, let's just put it that way. He has been the best player on the ice most nights, regardless of which teams are on the ice. Ottawa? Sweden? Karlsson. And he's just entering his prime, skill wise.

If he can carry a flawed budget team on his shoulders to a conference final, he sure as hell can help the burden to make a playoff team a true contender.
 
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DaveMatthew

Bring in Peter
Apr 13, 2005
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When healthy, Karlsson is on the level of McDavid/Crosby in terms of the impact he has on a game. He'll be on the ice for 30 minutes and the puck will be on his stick for 20 of them.
 

Barrie22

Shark fan in hiding
Aug 11, 2009
24,901
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When healthy, Karlsson is on the level of McDavid/Crosby in terms of the impact he has on a game. He'll be on the ice for 30 minutes and the puck will be on his stick for 20 of them.

If karlsson is on the ice for 30 mins we are not contenders. It means 1 or 2 of the other big 3 defensemen got hurt.
 
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DaveMatthew

Bring in Peter
Apr 13, 2005
14,507
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If karlsson is on the ice for 30 mins we are not contenders. It means 1 or 2 of the other big 3 defensemen got hurt.

Just an example. Hopefully he won't be playing that much too often in the regular season, but in those must-win playoff games? You'll want him on the ice as much as humanly possible.
 

Led Zappa

Tomorrow Today
Jan 8, 2007
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Just imagine a Jumbo, Pav's, Couture, Burns, Karlsson line coming at you when the team is fighting for that tying goal in the PO's. Substitute any of the Sharks hot forwards at the time with Karlsson / Burns on the backend.

raw
 

hockeyball

Registered User
Nov 10, 2007
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Just to be clear, as a huge Brent Burns fan, and one of the guys that hoped we would, and predicted we would trade for him... and predicted he would win a Norris with us. Karlsson, if healthy, is the best defensemen to ever play for this franchise, no doubt what-so-ever. Is he healthy though? We will just have to wait and see.

I hope he's 100%, but even if he isn't, it's still a huge upgrade. We already had an excellent roster, playoffs pretty much guaranteed. I also guarantee you this is not the only addition we make this season. Given that, yah, this needs to be the year we win it all. A lot of things need to go right (health for the most part), but there is no reason this team should not be a cup favorite this year, especially given whatever further additions we make. I think Thornton is going to have a big year, maybe not numbers wise as he may wait until the latter half of the season and the playoffs to really turn it up, but this is pretty close to his last shot, he's going to empty the tank.

The one thing that kind of saddens me though is IF the Sharks do win a cup with Karlsson (this year or another year), he will go into the hall of fame with a Sharks jersey on more than likely, and that kind of sucks :\ It's like considering Marleau going in with a Leafs jersey, it's just wrong.
 
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Chimpradamus

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Feb 16, 2006
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As in terms of the other thread about the Tavares vs Karlsson discussion, in my mind it's a complete no-brainer. You don't get the top 3-5 whatever, you get the best. Tavares is a world class center, but he's not a world class player. You don't throw $10-11m at Tavares, you do it on Karlsson. It's not even close. Tavares isn't world class at a whole lot that Karlsson is and Tavares plays less. So what of the state of the offensive lines in San Jose? They will manage. The players will take care of the state of the team. Tavares can't carry a team like Karlsson can, it's as simple as that, regardless of position.

You have arguably three team anchors, which is a classic formula for great success. Karlsson, Burns and Thornton/ Vlasic/ Couture/ Pavelski etc. A bunch of experienced players that most often will contribute and will work hard to win, because they want to win. The forward 4th isn't elite, but it's... ok, fine even. It could even be bad, you would still have a good chance. Then, you have the best defensive lineup in the league IMO. That top 6 is ridiculous, especially considering the strength of the 3rd pairing as well. Very, very dominant. And if Burns can be even more selective with his ice time, if needed, and also try to maximize his strengths? He could do some real damage and elevate his game yet again. He isn't the pressure the opposition will primarily focus on anymore. As for goalies? Should be good enough.

Special teams? If San Jose doesn't own the PP this season, I will be kind of disappointed, because, come on. Also, a GREAT asset in the playoffs, since ever. Karlsson - Burns - Couture - Thornton - Pavelski. I mean...

All in all, it's a contender in itself.
 

ReginKarlssonLehner

Let's Win It All
May 3, 2010
40,764
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Just to be clear, as a huge Brent Burns fan, and one of the guys that hoped we would, and predicted we would trade for him... and predicted he would win a Norris with us. Karlsson, if healthy, is the best defensemen to ever play for this franchise, no doubt what-so-ever. Is he healthy though? We will just have to wait and see.

I hope he's 100%, but even if he isn't, it's still a huge upgrade. We already had an excellent roster, playoffs pretty much guaranteed. I also guarantee you this is not the only addition we make this season. Given that, yah, this needs to be the year we win it all. A lot of things need to go right (health for the most part), but there is no reason this team should not be a cup favorite this year, especially given whatever further additions we make. I think Thornton is going to have a big year, maybe not numbers wise as he may wait until the latter half of the season and the playoffs to really turn it up, but this is pretty close to his last shot, he's going to empty the tank.

The one thing that kind of saddens me though is IF the Sharks do win a cup with Karlsson (this year or another year), he will go into the hall of fame with a Sharks jersey on more than likely, and that kind of sucks :\ It's like considering Marleau going in with a Leafs jersey, it's just wrong.

He'll still be the best defender you've ever had even if he isn't fully healthy. A healthy Karlsson plays and produces like a top 5 D man of all-time and contributes offensively as the 2nd best offensive defender of all time (stats adjusted).

I don't think SJ still know what they really got in EK. This isn't an elite player traded to another team, this is a generational talent. It'll be similar impact to the way Thornton played for you when you first got him, once in a lifetime. Im only praying he'll come back to us if Melnyk sells.
 
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Pinkfloyd

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Oct 29, 2006
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He'll still be the best defender you've ever had even if he isn't fully healthy. A healthy Karlsson plays and produces like a top 5 D man of all-time and contributes offensively as the 2nd best offensive defender of all time (stats adjusted).

I don't think SJ still know what they really got in EK. This isn't an elite player traded to another team, this is a generational talent. It'll be similar impact to the way Thornton played for you when you first got him, once in a lifetime. Im only praying he'll come back to us if Melnyk sells.

Keep talking to us like we don't know who Karlsson is. It's really endearing.
 

Pinkfloyd

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Oct 29, 2006
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tbh i think some Sharks fan are severly underrating him. way too many people said they would prefer Tavares over EK. no harm in it though, i'm sure its gonna be a pleasant surprise for them when the season is underway

Saying they preferred Tavares over EK is not underrating EK. It's merely a value judgment based on what the team has and what the team doesn't have. We're lacking a true top center moving forward and Tavares wouldn't have required anything but cap space to acquire. That's the basis of that choice. It has nothing to do with Sharks fans' knowledge of how good Karlsson is. We know and it'd be great if people stopped coming in here telling this fan base what they know or don't know. It's annoying as all hell.
 

CrypTic

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Oct 2, 2013
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Saying they preferred Tavares over EK is not underrating EK. It's merely a value judgment based on what the team has and what the team doesn't have. We're lacking a true top center moving forward and Tavares wouldn't have required anything but cap space to acquire. That's the basis of that choice. It has nothing to do with Sharks fans' knowledge of how good Karlsson is. We know and it'd be great if people stopped coming in here telling this fan base what they know or don't know. It's annoying as all hell.

Need, assets, plus we'd have Tavares for seven years whereas we may only have Karlsson for one.
 

Agent Zub

Registered User
Jan 2, 2015
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Saying they preferred Tavares over EK is not underrating EK. It's merely a value judgment based on what the team has and what the team doesn't have. We're lacking a true top center moving forward and Tavares wouldn't have required anything but cap space to acquire. That's the basis of that choice. It has nothing to do with Sharks fans' knowledge of how good Karlsson is. We know and it'd be great if people stopped coming in here telling this fan base what they know or don't know. It's annoying as all hell.

Respectfully you don't know the magnitudes that Karlsson is better than Tavares
 

slocal

Dude...what?
May 4, 2010
16,087
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When you win something as huge as Karlsson, you gotta learn to win with class.

I'm so down with Sens fans hyping their man. Be stoked they know and love him so much to still be posting positives.

Nothing to get defensive over.
 
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The Nemesis

Semper Tyrannus
Apr 11, 2005
88,234
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Ok guys, cool it.

Sharks fans: I think most of the Sens fans mean well. Even if it comes across awkwardly, it's probably better to deal with this sort of stuff patiently and respectfully. If anything, our fanbases have already shown in the last few days that we can probably be good friends and I'd hate to sabotage that considering how rare it seems to be in the tribalist setup of internet sports discussion. If Sens fans want to hop on the SJ bandwagon while their team burns down, let them. The more the merrier.

Sens fans: You have to understand that we're the fans of a once-up-a-time expansion club from the so-called sunbelt. We're the symbol of everything that stuffy, traditionalist, old guard hockey fans think is wrong with the new, Bettman-era NHL. So after a generation of often being treated as yahoos from the sticks who wouldn't know an icing call from icing a cake, there's still a bit of touchiness when it seems like outsiders treat our fans as if they don't know what they're talking about or don't understand the finer points of something related to the game. I understand that it's likely not intended to come off that way, but it's something that's just part of the fabric of being a Sharks fan, even if we are 25+ years removed from the team's inception and there's an entire generation of fans who have grown up only knowing of the team existing and even a younger generation that's never seen recurring non-playoff years. It's great to provide info and discussion that we might not have had, but there's a fine line between providing background on a second tier prospect or a scrub role player and acting like fans here don't understand the nature of Erik Karlsson.

There's no reason we can't all get along unless we all do something to stop it.
 

Phalanx

Registered User
Apr 24, 2013
238
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Aptos, Ca
Ok guys, cool it.

Sharks fans: I think most of the Sens fans mean well. Even if it comes across awkwardly, it's probably better to deal with this sort of stuff patiently and respectfully. If anything, our fanbases have already shown in the last few days that we can probably be good friends and I'd hate to sabotage that considering how rare it seems to be in the tribalist setup of internet sports discussion. If Sens fans want to hop on the SJ bandwagon while their team burns down, let them. The more the merrier.

Sens fans: You have to understand that we're the fans of a once-up-a-time expansion club from the so-called sunbelt. We're the symbol of everything that stuffy, traditionalist, old guard hockey fans think is wrong with the new, Bettman-era NHL. So after a generation of often being treated as yahoos from the sticks who wouldn't know an icing call from icing a cake, there's still a bit of touchiness when it seems like outsiders treat our fans as if they don't know what they're talking about or don't understand the finer points of something related to the game. I understand that it's likely not intended to come off that way, but it's something that's just part of the fabric of being a Sharks fan, even if we are 25+ years removed from the team's inception and there's an entire generation of fans who have grown up only knowing of the team existing and even a younger generation that's never seen recurring non-playoff years. It's great to provide info and discussion that we might not have had, but there's a fine line between providing background on a second tier prospect or a scrub role player and acting like fans here don't understand the nature of Erik Karlsson.

There's no reason we can't all get along unless we all do something to stop it.

I agree with every word of this. Excellent post
 
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Agent Zub

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Jan 2, 2015
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On the part of sens fans, I think the only positive most of us can gleam from this is situation is seeing Karlsson with a organization that deserves him. I truly think that the best of Karlsson is yet to come. And as disappointing it is for me that it won't come with the Sens, I am still so excited that it is going to come with the Sharks. I truly love the way you play and the players you have. Pavelski and Thornton are some of my favorite players, two amazing players who out think opposition in the most subtle ways. Even in their old age they look great and they are players who deserve to lift the Stanley Cup. + I love how much fun the players on the sharks are having and how positive the org and the ownership is. It's a shit show here and I truly think that it stifled Karlsson. So its exciting to see Karlsson get away from that. The team is gonna love Karlsson, and I think Karlsson is gonna love being a shark.

I think the Sharks are gonna repeat the story line of the Capitals this year. A bunch of wily vets who deserve and are good enough for cups finally get their due. Karlsson included.

I think we Sens and Sharks fan share a lot in common. We've both had amazing Presidents trophy teams fall short and the heartache that comes with the what ifs. You guys have been my wish to win the cup from the west for a long time. And for this hockey season the Sharks are my #1 pick for the Stanley Cup. And I don't know if you guys have problems with band wagoners because thats what i am. But honestly I am just a fan of skilled beautiful hockey, and the Sharks are gonna play exciting beautiful hockey this year.
 

tiburon12

Registered User
Jul 18, 2009
4,636
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On the part of sens fans, I think the only positive most of us can gleam from this is situation is seeing Karlsson with a organization that deserves him. I truly think that the best of Karlsson is yet to come. And as disappointing it is for me that it won't come with the Sens, I am still so excited that it is going to come with the Sharks. I truly love the way you play and the players you have. Pavelski and Thornton are some of my favorite players, two amazing players who out think opposition in the most subtle ways. Even in their old age they look great and they are players who deserve to lift the Stanley Cup. + I love how much fun the players on the sharks are having and how positive the org and the ownership is. It's a **** show here and I truly think that it stifled Karlsson. So its exciting to see Karlsson get away from that. The team is gonna love Karlsson, and I think Karlsson is gonna love being a shark.

I think the Sharks are gonna repeat the story line of the Capitals this year. A bunch of wily vets who deserve and are good enough for cups finally get their due. Karlsson included.

I think we Sens and Sharks fan share a lot in common. We've both had amazing Presidents trophy teams fall short and the heartache that comes with the what ifs. You guys have been my wish to win the cup from the west for a long time. And for this hockey season the Sharks are my #1 pick for the Stanley Cup. And I don't know if you guys have problems with band wagoners because thats what i am. But honestly I am just a fan of skilled beautiful hockey, and the Sharks are gonna play exciting beautiful hockey this year.

Well said, just make sure you can stay up and watch games that start at 10:30 EST before hoping on the wagon :laugh:
 

Agent Zub

Registered User
Jan 2, 2015
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And I know us Sens and Swedish fans have a reputation as being annoying Karlsson fans who overrate him. But I think you guys will see why he has such a following.

I have seen Hockey Hall of famers like Alfredsson, Chara, Hossa, and Stars like Yashin, Spezza, and Heatley in their primes. All of them at one time one of the best players at their positions. Karlsson blows them all out of the water. Karlsson is a better hockey player at his peak than all of them at their peak easily. No Sens fan talks of the former like they do of Karlsson simply because Karlsson is in a different tier.

Anyway I think he is poised to have an amazing season this year and I'm excited to watch it happen with you guys. Maybe you guys will see why we are so crazy about Karlsson :p. If he is healthy, I think that the Sharks have gained arguably the #1 player in the NHL.
 
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vilpertti

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Jun 18, 2002
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For me all this just sounds like "whoa dudes you'll finally see a truly good player play on your team you're blessed!"

When Sharks have had Hart trophy winners, Rocket Richard winners, Norris winners, Teemu Selänne, future Hall of Famers, Mike Ricci's hair and Tim Hunter's nose play for the team. It just sounds like, and I know it's not intentional, Ottawa fans are trying to edumacate teh soup eating noobs about this sirloin they're about to taste.
 

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