Shanahan trying to bypass little fella

[Cawz]

Shanahan is setting up a meeting with people close to the game to find out ways to improve the game on the ice it has nothing to do with the CBA.

Ya, I heard this too. Which would be a good thing. He wouldnt help the CBA negotiations. There are too many cooks as there is.

When hockey comes back, the problems with the game are still going to be there. The fan base isnt going to build in the non-traditional cities with the game being played as it is. Hopefully something can be done to improve the game, without simply spewing the same old rhetoric "call the game the way its supposed to".

Shanahans been around for a while, so mabye he has some ideas that may work. I'm sure he's watched the play erode over the last 17 or so seasons. As long as he doesnt try to help with the CBA. Let the idiots in charge work their magic.

 

[Bring Back Bucky]

So its demeaning for me to call Bettman the little fella but OK when you say Shanahan should be a garbageman. OK.

Looks like it bothered you here....

Anyway, I'm sorry. Brendan Shanahan is a great Canadian. As a matter of fact I think he should be prime minister. I also think we should put him in charge of the military and the chartered banks. From now on, I also don't anyone else to get any research grant money, I think Shanahan will have all dread diseases cured by Christmas..

 

[hockeytown9321]

Looks like it bothered you here....

Anyway, I'm sorry. Brendan Shanahan is a great Canadian. As a matter of fact I think he should be prime minister. I also think we should put him in charge of the military and the chartered banks. From now on, I also don't anyone else to get any research grant money, I think Shanahan will have all dread diseases cured by Christmas..

Actually Shanahan became an American. To me that proves he's at least kinda smart.

 

[Bring Back Bucky]

Actually Shanahan became an American. To me that proves he's at least kinda smart.

Suprised he didn't suit up for the mighty USA in that thehyre world cup. That would have shown how smart he is, jist like that smarte and tactful brett hull & that adorable Chris Chelios. What's Gary Bettman, from Calgary or sumthin?? We dont reed so good up hair, mebbe sum smart americkan can help me ote. Anyway, I gotta git back in my igloo...

 

[A Good Flying Bird*]

Nope, he's proposing that his side maintain their advisors, while he casts blame on Bettman. If he's such a smart guy, who can see that the help is getting in the way, why doesn't he suggest ****canning Goodenow and Co.? I'm moving over towards the players side in this lockout, but the demonization of Bettman by the players (and these postings-this little fella stuff is a step away from calling the guy a New York lawyer, we all know what it's code for) is absurd. Bettman is only able to do what the owners let him.

I'm not sure. I thought the quote I read said the PLAYERS will meet with OWNERS.

The demonization of Bettman has been around by for a long time. Chelios, in particular, has been mouting off about Bettman for a decade.
And looking at his record (stagnant revenues, poor franchises, spiralling salaries, worst entertainment value from the sport that I can ever remember), I 'm not sure why you guys disagree.
Look at the NHL's tv deals and tell me with a straight face that Bettman has done a good job promoting the sport.

 

[A Good Flying Bird*]

There are too many cooks as there is.

I disagree.
There may be lots of cooks, but their cooking only two dishes. The Bettman dish and the Goodenow dish.
I'd like to see the owners and players get more involved.

 

[Cawz]

I disagree.
There may be lots of cooks, but their cooking only two dishes. The Bettman dish and the Goodenow dish.
I'd like to see the owners and players get more involved.

I just find that streamlining things usually speed up the process. If I'm in a meeting with 4 people, things get done. When my meetings include 20 people, I basically expect to be tied up for a few hours and have nothing accomplished.

I dont think having the players and owners involved would help. Mabye a select few, but most just tow the line and chant their side's mantra. I dunno. I guess at this point, something new wouldnt hurt.

 

[hockeytown9321]

I'm not sure. I thought the quote I read said the PLAYERS will meet with OWNERS.

The demonization of Bettman has been around by for a long time. Chelios, in particular, has been mouting off about Bettman for a decade.
And looking at his record (stagnant revenues, poor franchises, spiralling salaries, worst entertainment value from the sport that I can ever remember), I 'm not sure why you guys disagree.
Look at the NHL's tv deals and tell me with a straight face that Bettman has done a good job promoting the sport.

People should take Ronald Reagan's advice and ask themselves if the NHL is better off now than it was when Bettman took over.

 

[mudcrutch79]

I'm not sure. I thought the quote I read said the PLAYERS will meet with OWNERS.

"Chelios revealed that teammate Brendan Shanahan is attempting to arrange a meeting between the union and owners or club officials, in order to bypass Bettman."

Perhaps you didn't read it very carefully?

The demonization of Bettman has been around by for a long time. Chelios, in particular, has been mouting off about Bettman for a decade.
And looking at his record (stagnant revenues, poor franchises, spiralling salaries, worst entertainment value from the sport that I can ever remember), I 'm not sure why you guys disagree.
Look at the NHL's tv deals and tell me with a straight face that Bettman has done a good job promoting the sport.

I have a hard time blaming Bettman for tv contracts for a couple of reasons. One, this isn't a game that's well suited to television. Two, the game being in the toilet is something that's difficult for him to address-there's a GM's committee for that. If you think Bettman is there for his expertise in addressing the issues underlying the game on the ice, you're wrong. That's why there's a GM committee, in addition to a guy like Colie Campbell. Stagnant revenues? Haven't they increased like 150%? Spiralling salaries and poor franchises? He's trying to deal with that now.

 

[hockeytown9321]

"Chelios revealed that teammate Brendan Shanahan is attempting to arrange a meeting between the union and owners or club officials, in order to bypass Bettman."

Perhaps you didn't read it very carefully?



I have a hard time blaming Bettman for tv contracts for a couple of reasons. One, this isn't a game that's well suited to television. Two, the game being in the toilet is something that's difficult for him to address-there's a GM's committee for that. If you think Bettman is there for his expertise in addressing the issues underlying the game on the ice, you're wrong. That's why there's a GM committee, in addition to a guy like Colie Campbell. Stagnant revenues? Haven't they increased like 150%? Spiralling salaries and poor franchises? He's trying to deal with that now.

bettman came in as a marketing guy. He was supposed to be able to take the game to new heights. He's the one that invented the glowing puck. He;s the one who pushed for the two ref system. he's the one that expanded the league which not only diluted the league and amde the game worse, he expanded to cities that cannot support hockey.

the only reason revenue has increasedi s becuase of expansion and higher ticket prices.

 

[djhn579]

bettman came in as a marketing guy. He was supposed to be able to take the game to new heights. He's the one that invented the glowing puck. He;s the one who pushed for the two ref system. he's the one that expanded the league which not only diluted the league and amde the game worse, he expanded to cities that cannot support hockey.

the only reason revenue has increasedi s becuase of expansion and higher ticket prices.

So you blame Bettman for expansion and increased revenues?

I thought the owners were the ones that voted for expansion, and wasn't that going on before Bettman came in?

The glowing puck was an attempt to increase the number of people watching the game, which would have resulted in more revenue if it worked. It didn't work, so what. It was a brief experiment. Would you prefere that he tried nothing?

The two ref system I thought came out of the comptition comittee. I don't think it is working too well. Instead of one ref not making calls, you now have two refs making calls. I'd love to see them institute a video review system and fine players for committing penalties that were not called during the game. Would players still be clutching and grabbing if they knew the tapes would be reviewed and they would be fined each time they were caught?

It's funny how everything is Bettman's fault...

 

[Tom_Benjamin]

It's funny how everything is Bettman's fault...

I think it is funny how nothing is his fault. Not the state of the game financially, not expansion, not the TV contract, not the officiating, not the marketing, not the two labour disputes, nothing.

He gets paid several million dollars a year to present the face of the NHL to the public, to promote the game, to enforce the rules and to negotiate contracts on behalf of the league. In order to provoke this crisis he's spent the last three years demarketing the league, he's painted the players as greedy, and he's convinced them he is a worthless turd. Everything he has touched has turned to crap and none of it is his fault. Millions to screw up and it's always somebody else's fault! Compared to him, Mark Messier was a bargain in Vancouver. Gary Bettman is going to make more money from hockey than 90% of the players.

How great is that for a job? How sick is that? No hockey player is worth millions? What's Gary Bettman worth, really?

Tom

 

[PecaFan]

I think it is funny how nothing is his fault. Not the state of the game financially, not expansion, not the TV contract, not the officiating, not the marketing, not the two labour disputes, nothing.

Funny thing about that. You say "fault", others would say "credit".

"The state of the game financially" is that this league is bringing in 2+ billion dollars a year in revenue, the best ever in it's history. It's the fact that under Bettman's regime the revenues got so high, that's allowing the players to rake in over a billion dollars a year in salary.

"the current tv contract". Again, the tv contracts under Bettman have been fantastic, best in league history. The current one is not very good, but the rest have been *fantastic*. Way more money than was expected.

"expansion". Nothing wrong with expansion. Again, it brought in revenue, it's spread the game further into the US, where it's going to have to be for long term growth. The only "problem" with expansion is the so called "watering down" of the league, and I personally don't buy that for a second. There's more than enough hockey talent in the world to allow for 600 players.

"refereeing". Again, nothing wrong with the reffing. The two man system is fine, and was a clever way to get on the job training for young refs. Certainly better than the alternative of having them on ice alone. People have been *****ing about the reffing for the 50 years I've been watching hockey, that's nothing new.

"marketing". I see nothing wrong with the marketing of the game today compared to the past. It's pretty much exactly the same. Yeah, some things could be done better, but that's always been the case.

"the two labour disputes". Frankly, this is just as much due to the NHLPA. They finally grew a pair, and refused to be bent over by the owners like happened when I was young.

But yes, it would be lovely to return to the days when the players were absolutely being taken advantage of, and we had total labour peace.

 

[hockeytown9321]

So you blame Bettman for expansion and increased revenues?

I thought the owners were the ones that voted for expansion, and wasn't that going on before Bettman came in?

The glowing puck was an attempt to increase the number of people watching the game, which would have resulted in more revenue if it worked. It didn't work, so what. It was a brief experiment. Would you prefere that he tried nothing?

The two ref system I thought came out of the comptition comittee. I don't think it is working too well. Instead of one ref not making calls, you now have two refs making calls. I'd love to see them institute a video review system and fine players for committing penalties that were not called during the game. Would players still be clutching and grabbing if they knew the tapes would be reviewed and they would be fined each time they were caught?

It's funny how everything is Bettman's fault...

Yes, i blame Bettman for expansion and the artificial revenue increases that came along with it. You also have to keep in mind that the major reason revenue has incrased so much is becuase of ticket price increases. It doesn't take a marketing genius to do that.

Yeah the glowing puck was an experiment, but how come everyone with hlaf a brain knew it wouldn't add one new fan and at the same time piss everyone else off?

The two ref system is terrible. Offciating is inconsistent to begin with, why double it. Not to mention they get in the way alot. I've always thought they could just let one ref follow the play and let the linesmen call stuff behind the play.

 

[djhn579]

Yes, i blame Bettman for expansion and the artificial revenue increases that came along with it. You also have to keep in mind that the major reason revenue has incrased so much is becuase of ticket price increases. It doesn't take a marketing genius to do that.

Yeah the glowing puck was an experiment, but how come everyone with hlaf a brain knew it wouldn't add one new fan and at the same time piss everyone else off?

The two ref system is terrible. Offciating is inconsistent to begin with, why double it. Not to mention they get in the way alot. I've always thought they could just let one ref follow the play and let the linesmen call stuff behind the play.

Bettman became commisioner in Feb 1993

http://www.infoplease.com/ipsa/A0109007.html

Two teams were added in the 1993/1994 season. These had to be in the planning well before Bettman took office.

4 more teams were added later during Bettmans term.

http://www.rauzulusstreet.com/hockey/nhlhistory/nhlhistory.html

4 teams X 82 games X 14,000 fans per game (estimated) X average ticket price of $41.56 (2002) = ~$191M in new league revenue.

That is about equivalent to a $5 increase in the average ticket price in a 30 team league.

30 teams X 82 games X 16300 average attendance X $35 average ticket price = ~$1.403B
30 teams X 82 games X 16300 average attendance X $40 average ticket price = ~$1.603B

As far as I know, Bettman does not tell teams to raise their ticket prices, they get to do that on their own. So, yes much of the revenue increase has probably come through increased ticket prices, but there were also increases in TV contracts up until the last contract signed. Bettman has more contorl over getting TV contracts for the league than ticket prices.

Again, the glowing puck was goofy, but the biggest complaint from no hockey fans is that it's too hard to follow the puck. They tried, it failed. In the big scheme of things it doesn't matter. But if a million more people watched hockey because of the glowing puck, we would still see it today. As for upsetting hockey fans, it was only on FOX. You didn't have to watch it if you didn't want too.

The two ref system is terrible. Having the linesmen call penalties behind the play is a good idea too. But how do you get refs to call penalties when they decide they would rather just let the guys play. To me, getting rid of all the clutching and grabbing will make games much more exciting and probably result in more people watching and attending the games.

 

[hockeytown9321]

Bettman became commisioner in Feb 1993

http://www.infoplease.com/ipsa/A0109007.html

Two teams were added in the 1993/1994 season. These had to be in the planning well before Bettman took office.

4 more teams were added later during Bettmans term.

http://www.rauzulusstreet.com/hockey/nhlhistory/nhlhistory.html

4 teams X 82 games X 14,000 fans per game (estimated) X average ticket price of $41.56 (2002) = ~$191M in new league revenue.

That is about equivalent to a $5 increase in the average ticket price in a 30 team league.

30 teams X 82 games X 16300 average attendance X $35 average ticket price = ~$1.403B
30 teams X 82 games X 16300 average attendance X $40 average ticket price = ~$1.603B

As far as I know, Bettman does not tell teams to raise their ticket prices, they get to do that on their own. So, yes much of the revenue increase has probably come through increased ticket prices, but there were also increases in TV contracts up until the last contract signed. Bettman has more contorl over getting TV contracts for the league than ticket prices.

Again, the glowing puck was goofy, but the biggest complaint from no hockey fans is that it's too hard to follow the puck. They tried, it failed. In the big scheme of things it doesn't matter. But if a million more people watched hockey because of the glowing puck, we would still see it today. As for upsetting hockey fans, it was only on FOX. You didn't have to watch it if you didn't want too.

The two ref system is terrible. Having the linesmen call penalties behind the play is a good idea too. But how do you get refs to call penalties when they decide they would rather just let the guys play. To me, getting rid of all the clutching and grabbing will make games much more exciting and probably result in more people watching and attending the games.

Yeah its up to teams to ddecide what they want for tickets. My point was that alot of the revenue increases were more due to that than anything Bettman did.

On the refs, I really don't care if they call everything or call nothing. I just want them to be consistent within games and I don't think that happnes with two refs.