Sens from 2008-2016

[Jdes91]

Why didn't they bite the bullet and rebuild in 2008? Why did they keep alternating playoff appearances until 2017? Was Melnyk reluctant to rebuild?

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[dumbdick]

They did rebuild. It just failed.

 

[JungleBeat]

Half assed re-tool.

 

[Micklebot]

Why didn't they bite the bullet and rebuild in 2008? Why did they keep alternating playoff appearances until 2017? Was Melnyk reluctant to rebuild?

Refer to melnyks blow youself up quote. That was in jan 2009 so yeah, menyk was reluctant.

Playoff revenue was needed for the team to break even, depending on the year they'd say we needed 4 to 6 home games as i recall.

It's a tough sell to rebuild when you are a bubble team and we kept seeing promise of something good coming only for it to be pulled out from under us. Karlsson's injury after winning the Norris, Spezza's back, Alfredsson leaving.

In hindsight its easy to say we should rebuild but at the time we kept saying just add x ufa and we look pretty good, we just never added that ufa instead hoping rookies would fill the void.

Also, coaching and goaltending were truly bad.

 

[Jdes91]

Adding Kovalev was pretty questionable but it got them into the playoffs in 2010... Still 2011, 2014 and 2016 were all awful

 

[Tuna99]

Poor player development, Murray fell in love and overvalued prospects like Weircoche, Greening, Cowen, Lazar, Lehrer.

draft with 3 first round picks sunk them. Took Zibby which was a good start but Puempel and Noessen were poor picks

 

[BondraTime]

They were the worst drafting team in the league for the 3 drafts from from 2012-2014., Hogberg, Lazar and Ceci being the only NHLers taken, and only Hogberg is an asset as a backup/possible starter 8 years after being drafted.

That’s also seemingly omitted when discussing how great Dorion is at drafting, where he was in charge of all 3 drafts.

 

[Micklebot]

They were the worst drafting team in the league for the 3 drafts from from 2012-2014., Hogberg, Lazar and Ceci being the only NHLers taken, and only Hogberg is an asset as a backup/possible starter 8 years after being drafted.

That’s also seemingly omitted when discussing how great Dorion is at drafting, where he was in charge of all 3 drafts.

I'll admit to having wanted Ceci in 2012, and being happy we took a chance on Maidens. Wikstrand looked hopeful too, and while it took too long to pan out for us to benefit, Driedger looks like about as good a prospect as Hogberg right now. Funny how things can look promising early on only to turn out absolute crap.

Missing on Lazar and Ceci along with not having a 1st in 2014 (traded for Ryan) are why those years look as bad as they do. That's the risk of drafting in the second half of the 1st round.

 

[topshelf15]

They were the worst drafting team in the league for the 3 drafts from from 2012-2014., Hogberg, Lazar and Ceci being the only NHLers taken, and only Hogberg is an asset as a backup/possible starter 8 years after being drafted.

That’s also seemingly omitted when discussing how great Dorion is at drafting, where he was in charge of all 3 drafts.

I really like Mann,PD has drafted decent but has some serious flubs along the way also,Rundblad was his luckly BM bailed us out with trading him for KT

 

[Masked]

They weren't able to develop any quality blueliners other than Karlsson and he and Alfredsson were too good for the team to fall into complete cellar dweller status where they could have drafted higher.

 

[BoardsofCanada]

In 2008, we had a 90 point playmaker and two 40 goal scorers. There is no team that would start a rebuild with that firepower. They missed on a few picks but also hit on a few (Stone, Hoffman, Pageau).

They've been an up and down team through the 2010s just like 80% of other teams in the league. THey've had some good showings (2013 over the Habs, 2015 Hamburglar comeback, and 2017 Cinderella run).

 

[BondraTime]

I'll admit to having wanted Ceci in 2012, and being happy we took a chance on Maidens. Wikstrand looked hopeful too, and while it took too long to pan out for us to benefit, Driedger looks like about as good a prospect as Hogberg right now. Funny how things can look promising early on only to turn out absolute crap.

Missing on Lazar and Ceci along with not having a 1st in 2014 (traded for Ryan) are why those years look as bad as they do. That's the risk of drafting in the second half of the 1st round.

With 19 picks (7 in the first 3 rounds) you want to have better than a bottom pairing/7th D man, backup goalie, and journeyman 4th liner/AHLer 6 years after the last draft.

That was bad drafting, coupled with average pick slots, which is why it is so bad.

 

[Micklebot]

With 19 picks (7 in the first 3 rounds) you want to have better than a bottom pairing/7th D man, backup goalie, and journeyman 4th liner/AHLer 6 years after the last draft.

That was bad drafting, coupled with average pick slots, which is why it is so bad.

Sure, those years weren't the deepest either. Not saying we drafted great or anything, the end results are obviously terrible, just that without the benefit of hindsight, I actually liked some of the selections (not Lazar...) and had hope.

 

[BondraTime]

Sure, those years weren't the deepest either. Not saying we drafted great or anything, the end results are obviously terrible, just that without the benefit of hindsight, I actually liked some of the selections (not Lazar...) and had hope.

I wasn’t big on Ceci at the time, really wanted Teravinen, I think I was fine with Lazar at the time though, though I was more interested in Dano, Mantha and Burakovski.

 

[Micklebot]

I wasn’t big on Ceci at the time, really wanted Teravinen, I think I was fine with Lazar at the time though, though I was more interested in Dano, Mantha and Burakovski.

I thought Ceci was going to be a sure fire top 4... I guess technically, he was that for us, but in the worst possible way.
In 2013 I really wanted Morrisey, but he was gone by our pick, after that it was Mantha if I recall. Also wanted Horvat, or Monahan but they were way out of our range thanks to our miracle playoff run.

 

[Tuna99]

I thought Ceci was going to be a sure fire top 4... I guess technically, he was that for us, but in the worst possible way.
In 2013 I really wanted Morrisey, but he was gone by our pick, after that it was Mantha if I recall. Also wanted Horvat, or Monahan but they were way out of our range thanks to our miracle playoff run.

ceci was an interesting pick because he was a faller, and Sens always seemed to draft risers (EK, Zibby, Noessen.

ceci is an NHL dman and Dorian used that asset for a huge return, good pick and good management of Ceci by Ottawa

 

[Satoru Gojo]

I think the rebuild started in early 2011 but after the team over achieved in 2011-2012 the kinda just dropped the whole rebuilding thing and overestimated the roster. Add on some pretty poor coaching by all 5 guys (Hartsburg, Clouston, Maclean, Cameron, Boucher) and the team aside from a couple of years tangled with mediocrity

 

[Sensinitis]

They were the worst drafting team in the league for the 3 drafts from from 2012-2014., Hogberg, Lazar and Ceci being the only NHLers taken, and only Hogberg is an asset as a backup/possible starter 8 years after being drafted.

That’s also seemingly omitted when discussing how great Dorion is at drafting, where he was in charge of all 3 drafts.

I agree with you that those drafts were terrible, but Dorion was only assistant GM during all those years except 2014, no?

I think that means that he was just chief amateur scout during the 2012 and 2013 drafts, and assistant GM for the 2014 draft. Englund/Lazar/Ceci (the 3 highest picks of each year) all seem like Bryan and Tim Murray kinds of picks.

 

[BondraTime]

I agree with you that those drafts were terrible, but Dorion was only assistant GM during all those years except 2014, no?

I think that means that he was just chief amateur scout during the 2012 and 2013 drafts, and assistant GM for the 2014 draft. Englund/Lazar/Ceci (the 3 highest picks of each year) all seem like Bryan and Tim Murray kinds of picks.

Dorion was Director of Player Personnel, he was our chief of amateur scouting in charge of the entire draft for all those drafts. He took on he role of co-asst GM with Randy Lee in 2014

 

[trentmccleary]

Why didn't they bite the bullet and rebuild in 2008? Why did they keep alternating playoff appearances until 2017? Was Melnyk reluctant to rebuild?

Because nobody is looking at the team that made the Stanley Cup Finals at these ages and thought rebuild. Only Alfredsson, the 4th line center and the back up goalie were over the age of 30.

26 Heatley – 23 Spezza – 34 Alfredsson
29 Schaefer – 26 Fisher – 26 Comrie
24 Vermette – 26 Kelly – 27 Neil
25 Saprykin – 33 McAmmond – 22 Eaves

29 Redden – 21 Meszaros
28 Phillips – 24 Volchenkov
29 Corvo – 28 Preissing
24 Schubert

24 Emery

 

[Adele Dazeem]

I was rewatching the highlights from the Playoffs the year we pushed to the ECF's and man it brought back some great memories.

That team was just too special and it was full of underrated talent.

 

[Adele Dazeem]

Because nobody is looking at the team that made the Stanley Cup Finals at these ages and thought rebuild. Only Alfredsson, the 4th line center and the back up goalie were over the age of 30.

26 Heatley – 23 Spezza – 34 Alfredsson
29 Schaefer – 26 Fisher – 26 Comrie
24 Vermette – 26 Kelly – 27 Neil
25 Saprykin – 33 McAmmond – 22 Eaves

29 Redden – 21 Meszaros
28 Phillips – 24 Volchenkov
29 Corvo – 28 Preissing
24 Schubert

24 Emery

This just goes to show you that you can do all sorts of analytics, become a bottom-dweller and draft top-ranked prospects, or sign high end free agents and still fail to do anything in the Playoffs. All it takes is some team chemistry and a whole lot of luck to win the Cup.

 

[Agent Zub]

I thought Ceci was going to be a sure fire top 4... I guess technically, he was that for us, but in the worst possible way.
In 2013 I really wanted Morrisey, but he was gone by our pick, after that it was Mantha if I recall. Also wanted Horvat, or Monahan but they were way out of our range thanks to our miracle playoff run.

I really believe Ceci is a clear example of a players development being ruined. He had a pretty promising start to his NHL career., jumping up, making plays, skating with the puck, scoring goals.

but after that its like he lost all poise that he showed up to that point. couldn't make the simplest without making it look difficult.

 

[Sensinitis]

I really believe Ceci is a clear example of a players development being ruined. He had a pretty promising start to his NHL career., jumping up, making plays, skating with the puck, scoring goals.

but after that its like he lost all poise that he showed up to that point. couldn't make the simplest without making it look difficult.

You could have developed Ceci all you want, his hockey IQ would have still been lower than a tadpole’s.

 

[Agent Zub]

You could have developed Ceci all you want, his hockey IQ would have still been lower than a tadpole’s.

thats the thing, while his iq was never incredible, it still quite clearly regressed.

like his brain was stressed to make any decision on the ice. He was a much more confident and effective player early in his career.