Discussion in 'Polls - (hockey-related only)' started by LordNeverLose, Feb 27, 2018.
Patrick Laine, he is that good at scoring he deserves the selke.
You have to remember the Flyers had just played high scoring road game that went to a shootout in Tampa the day before in which Couts played 28 minutes and Giroux played 26 minutes. The entire Flyers team looked gassed yesterday and for good reason.
Also, I know Couts has solid linemates in Giroux and Konecny but it's not like Barkov is playing with scrubs.
I absolutely love Barkov's game and I won't be mad if he finishes above Couts because i think there are arguments for both guys. It's a 4 horse race this year when you add Kopitar to the mix. I just hope Couts is a finalist to be honest.
Again...1 game in which a rested Florida team played a Flyers team that had played against Tampa the day before and into OT and a shootout and then had to travel after the game. Not far of course, but it matters. And Couts played 28 minutes.
Looking at 1 game, small sample size. And as you said, the stats show Couts was better than Barkov. But again, 1 game.
It would be nice if a TRULY non biased person presented the stats for the whole season. They are all producing offensively enough to be in the running for best defensive forward...snicker.
Dadonov is good player, maybe comparable to Konecny, but Bjugstad isn't that far from scrub. Barely third liner. He has looked little better last 20 games, but that's with Barkov. Even Jagr looked like 1st liner there.
I wouldn't call a guy who scored at a 40-50 point pace every year from age 21-25 except last season "barely a 3rd liner". He may not be a legit 1st liner but he produces at a low end 2nd line pace while only playing 15 minutes a game and not much on the PP. He's not Giroux or Konecny but he's not Jamie McGinn either.
When i played hockey it was easier to play back to back because i had it going from the start. It’s not easy to play competitively after a rest. Overall i think it has it’s + and - when playing back to back. Panthers were better team at the beginning after that flyers took control. They competed hard. There was no signs of being tired. I don’t think back to back games affected too much. But we never know. It’s only speculation because we don’t know how players feel. I can only talk about my own experience. It’s totally different in NHL though. Not comparing but trying to say there is some kind of advantage too to play back to back.
Again Couts had better ”stats” but Barkov outplayed him from start to finish in all 3 zones? All i trying to say that it is flawed to only watch these ”stats” when linemates have big impact on it. I think we have to take induvidual stats into account too Barkov has 50 blocked shots and 64 takeaways for the season. Couts has 32 blocks shots and 39 takeaways. Barkov has by far most stickchecks in NHL from all fowards. One of the better faceoff guys at defensive zone.
All i’m trying to say that we should watch the games and not stare induvidual or team stats only. While i agree them having impact but don’t tell whole picture. This is close and exciting selke race.
Yeah, except last season and this season, unless he has played with Barkov. His game wasn't better even with Trocheck (tho, it seems to be hard for many). There would be probably some players even in Panthers, that make better in that line. Reason for Bjugstad playing there have to be A) rising his value B) trying to find the game, he played 2-3 years ago.
Barkov owned the game last night, but like it has been said it was 1 game.
For the poll why I would like Barkov to win over Couturier. I don't see Couts as the engine of his team like Barkov is for Florida. He is the engine that drives that team and has proven to put up #1C numbers with or without garbage on his line. All of the offensive skills are about elite with him, his shot isn't but even that's good, his hands are something else.
Barks has become an elite faceoff guy and has 5 shorthanded goals this season, I've seen a tweet earlier say he's the best stickchecking forward in todays NHL. He doesn't either get sheltered and has brutal D-zone starts.
He leads the league in icetime per game for F's, I'm having trouble making a case for more than 2-3 guys meaning more ot their team than him.
He has the worst linemates out of Barkov/Bergeron/Couts, and it all starts from defense with him.
I mean, I respect your opinion but this isn't club hockey as a teenager, this is the absolute highest level of professional hockey in the world. You're literally the only person I've ever heard that has tried to make it seem like there's no disadvantage when playing the 2nd half of a road back to back especially when that game went to a shootout and the player in question played 28 minutes. And to say we don't know the affect is not true. Coaches and players talk about the difficulty of playing back to backs all the time, it's no secret. Even HFBoards doesn't debate it and HFBoards debates everything!
The problem with simply saying Barkov outplayed him in all 3 zones from start to finish is that it's literally your opinion based on nothing. I could easily say the same thing which is why people tend to back up their opinion with facts and stats. I don't really get why you're saying that using stats in favor of Couturier is misleading and then you bring up stats in favor of Barkov as if they have more validity.
Also, I'm just interested, where do you get stats on stick checks? I didn't even know that was a thing.
I don't know how long he's been playing with Barkov this season so I can't really say much but Bjugstad's numbers have been fairly consistent (although very average) throughout the season. Again, I'm not saying he's a great player but he's not a borderline 4th liner in any way.
I'm sticking with Couturier for now, but if Barkov can manage to propel the Panthers into the playoffs, that will be huge for him. It's such a close call between all four of these guys, honestly.
In the recent years he's looked like a cap dump plenty of times. Injuries/inconsistencies playing part.
this site makes me dislike Barkov. He's the new OEL
Except that he's tangibly a great player. It's not just people saying "you don't watch him he's good"
Except he's one of the best defensive F's in the game?
Or are we supposed to ignore everything and go with what you think?
he has Nylander as his profile pic
I'd be okay with Barkov winning.
He doesnt deserve to win but Mark Stone is plus 11 on a team with a minus 50 goal differential while leading the league in takeaways over the last 4 seasons. He is pking much more this year too. He should start getting some recognition. This is a team that Karlsson is minus 30 on and Duchene/Hoffman are hovering around minus 20. The only player with a positive plus is Borkwiecki.
Kopitar is actually the only player that has the stats to back up pushing Bergeron. The advanced stats show his team has he puck all the time when he is on the ice. Statistically he is the best 200 foot player in the league.
Yep. Barkov is like Pavel Datsyuk but add a bit more height and mass. Both are magicians and enjoyable to follow.
Any of those 4 and it's ok. Everyone of those have case over any other. I wouldn't know, how to vote. Luckily, I'm not voting. Hardest thing is to read threads like this.
That is the same question that could be asked of Barkov for the selke... all we hear about him are his points, maybe carrying them into the playoffs and gifs of fancy shootout moves.
I see these guys plenty and I know what they are good at but for the sake of preaching someone’s defensive abilities, some visuals helps a lot, at least if one is trying to make a case for anyone over Bergeron, particularly when it comes in forms of such videos like the ”Bergeron under the radar plays”-video.
That's not true, and his offense starts from his defensive work and never cheating on play.
How many more games does Bergeron have to miss before people realize he's out of the conversation?
Barkov brings unique two-way game to Panthers, game film shows
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