Season ticket holder no more

[willy702]

Knights told me after the regular season ends I'm no longer welcome to be a season ticket member. I won't get playoff tickets this season which isn't that big a deal since they can charge whatever they want for them and it ends up being expensive and risky trying to sell the tickets. The previously friendly rep became quite terse in the end but whatever. I even have an associate who asked a quite high up person in the organization and he said the ticketing team is immune to everyone else's inputs, that Foley is going to war with those he feels aren't worthy fans. So those who have season tickets be careful with what you do. I lose out on one season of commitment after which I'm sure my prices would have doubled making them far less attractive. I tried to get more info on what are the cutoffs for others since no one I know attends every game. She gave me the spiel about a lot of factors, but she implied they want the holder personally to attend at least half the games. I tried to find out what happens when you split tickets with someone else and she wouldn't get into that, but I'm guessing they must have some limits on how many people you can directly send tickets to before getting on their radar.

In the end it looks like I'll make about $5k selling tickets over the two seasons, even considering the about 20 games I will have used personally over the two years. I can buy years of season tickets of similar quality for another team with that money. We'll see how I feel about supporting this team in the future, but their attitude towards those who got them a franchise sure did change once they got flush with demand. I would have thought someone who signed up on day one of the ticket drive would mean a little more to them, but that's Vegas for you.

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[allevat]

I don't think it's exactly surprising they yanked them when you only went to a quarter of the games and made something like 50-100 percent profit -- you effectively paid less than $0 for the tickets. If you aren't going to be there cheering the team might as well sell them to someone else who will.

 

[82Ninety42011]

I think the Knights will regret this in a few years when the novelty wears and if they can't sell it out as easily.

 

[Vegan Knight]

I think the Knights will regret this in a few years when the novelty wears and if they can't sell it out as easily.

Yeah, that would affect season ticket holders as well and it isn't a problem for them to do this to people who attend a quarter of the games and sell the rest as single game tickets as a marked up price and give those tickets to fans who want to attend most of the games.

I don't think someone who buys season tickets in order to sell most of them would stick around if those higher than value tickets aren't selling for them anymore.

 

[CBJ VGK]

As a fellow VGK STH, I really take exception with the way the organization is cracking down on people who sell their tickets. It is petty, vindictive and honestly, kinda creepy.

I've attended (or given away to friends) every single game with the exception of one, which I sold online when my wife got sick the day of the game. I don't want or need to worry about the organization looking over my shoulder or keeping track of which games I attend and which ones I don't. They are my tickets! We sit upper bowl center section (224). What if I want to upgrade to lower bowl seats for a particular game, and sell my seats to help facilitate that? Is my action of selling my seats to upgrade going to be considered a debit against my "goodwill"?

The atmosphere at T-Mobile has been fantastic night in and night out. STH's selling their seats has not been a problem. There is more than enough demand from locals to not diminish the hometown support. This isn't Arizona.

 

[IceNeophyte]

Yeah, that would affect season ticket holders as well and it isn't a problem for them to do this to people who attend a quarter of the games and sell the rest as single game tickets as a marked up price and give those tickets to fans who want to attend most of the games.

I don't think someone who buys season tickets in order to sell most of them would stick around if those higher than value tickets aren't selling for them anymore.

This isn't about brokers any longer. It's about real fans who can't afford to pay rack rate for the 20 single game tickets they'd like to attend, so they buy seasons with the intent to attend half of them and sell half of them to defray the cost.

If VGK had confidence in being able to sell those tickets at retail cost, they should have limited ST sales. As it is now, they are having their cake and eating it too, using STH as an insurance policy, then dumping them when the season has shown the demand will still be there.

When my rep Dylan was treating us like garbage during playoffs last year, I told him these chickens will come home to roost when the shine has worn off the team and they've alienated the STH that would support them through those times. I was already committed to ST at that time, but this season is it for us.

 

[Spirit of 67]

I think the Knights will regret this in a few years when the novelty wears and if they can't sell it out as easily.

Well the OP would give up the tickets at that point anyway because there's no money to be made.

 

[willy702]

I don't think it's exactly surprising they yanked them when you only went to a quarter of the games and made something like 50-100 percent profit -- you effectively paid less than $0 for the tickets. If you aren't going to be there cheering the team might as well sell them to someone else who will.

When I put in the deposit on day one I lived in Vegas and didn't expect to move. Things changed and I live a few states away now. Getting to a quarter of the games requires a good bit of effort, it's not like I'm a broker or a non fan. I have been going to NHL games since I was 6 and dreamed of an NHL team in Vegas since the 90s, I always thought it would be a hit. But ultimately those things don't matter, even if you are someone who helped make the team happen. Whoever buys my tickets is unlikely to be a lifelong hockey fan, will they pay an inflated price once the team isnt so good?

 

[CBJ VGK]

This whole policy of pulling people's season tickets just screams hypocrisy. And yes, it will alienate fans when things go south (and they eventually will go south one year)

The amount of money this organization made on the backs of their STHs in the playoffs was truly egregious. If you weren't one of the STHs lucky enough to get early, early, early bird playoff tickets (who also took the ridiculous "Knight's Vow"), you had to take whatever they offered just to get in the door. The only tickets available to me for Games 5 & 7 of the Cup Final were 2 rows from the glass. I ended paying $1,900 EACH for (2) tickets to those games buying DIRECTLY from the team. That's $7,600 for 2 games for those playing along at home.

When the Knights ended up going down 3-1, I opted to sell Game 5 with the hopes of still going to Game 7. Ended up being incredibly lucky just to find a Caps fan willing to pay $2,000 each. Wow....what a profit. The stress and hassle were totally not worth it. Not sure I will buy playoff tickets from them again this year. Would be better off buying piecemeal on the secondary market.

 

[Boris Zubov]

I've posted about this issue a few times previously & I'll say it again...the team is being incredibly short sighted. As well as the front office has performed with their on ice product, they've been equally bad in the way they do business with their STHs.

Foley didn't become a billionaire by playing nice & it's very clear he's unwilling to leave one dime on the table for either the primary or secondary ticket markets. I'm EXTREMELY eager to see how much my ticket prices will go up again for the 19-20 season. This year they raised me 24% plus the ridiculous $6 per game arena improvement fee on a 2 year old building. A fee that I've been told isn't going away.

 

[allevat]

Excessive ticket price increases for season ticket holders is absolutely legitimate to complain about, in terms of teams not rewarding people who signed on for season tickets before they were so unexpectedly successful. It's not a good balance of rewarding fans for loyalty and profit-taking, and genuinely may hurt the team down the line when those fans don't really feel like supporting them when they are again not successful (which will happen to every team.)

However, *not* rewarding people who attend less than a quarter of games and sell the rest for a large profit is a much more sensible and equitable choice. People who attend seldom now are unlikely attend any more frequently when the team is bad, and when their tickets are no longer so wildly profitable they will instead drop the season passes.

Especially since the team has quarter season and half season packages available for those who want to support but can't attend so frequently. I can see a potential issue if they are also punishing people who are transferring tickets at cost, i.e. people who are sharing them with their friends and family, but the OP said they got $5k profit, so I don't think that's them.

 

[CBJ VGK]

I get to a certain extent why they are doing what they are. My problem with it is the whole secrecy of it. As a season-ticket holder how am I supposed to know the barometer or measuring stick for being blacklisted by the front office?

What if I have a business trip or vacation planned and can't attend a game or find anyone to go that I know? Am I flagged if I sell my tickets online when someone like the Maple Leafs are in town, and I make double or triple what I paid? Should I be expected to sell my tickets at "cost" to a random fan online and assume it's a diehard loyal VGK fan that's going to scream their head off all night?

The whole thing is absurd. If you're going to blacklist your season ticket holders, you should at least set the ground rules for what constitutes revocation of your ticket and not make it seem arbitrary.

Also, there are no quarter-season packages anymore in Vegas, and most of the half-season holders from 2017-18 were forced to go full season or lose their privilege to purchase.

 

[IceNeophyte]

Excessive ticket price increases for season ticket holders is absolutely legitimate to complain about, in terms of teams not rewarding people who signed on for season tickets before they were so unexpectedly successful. It's not a good balance of rewarding fans for loyalty and profit-taking, and genuinely may hurt the team down the line when those fans don't really feel like supporting them when they are again not successful (which will happen to every team.)

However, *not* rewarding people who attend less than a quarter of games and sell the rest for a large profit is a much more sensible and equitable choice. People who attend seldom now are unlikely attend any more frequently when the team is bad, and when their tickets are no longer so wildly profitable they will instead drop the season passes.

Especially since the team has quarter season and half season packages available for those who want to support but can't attend so frequently. I can see a potential issue if they are also punishing people who are transferring tickets at cost, i.e. people who are sharing them with their friends and family, but the OP said they got $5k profit, so I don't think that's them.

Partial seasons are treated entirely differently. For example, in post season, they release x number of tickets for partials to fight over once the STH have picked through them. As mentioned above, many loyal partials were left on the outside looking in for last year's finals. The team felt they could get more selling them retail, so they just made a few super expensive seats like glass and club available and let the many partial ticket holders vie for them.

Partials are not a solution.

 

[82Ninety42011]

Yeah, that would affect season ticket holders as well and it isn't a problem for them to do this to people who attend a quarter of the games and sell the rest as single game tickets as a marked up price and give those tickets to fans who want to attend most of the games.

I don't think someone who buys season tickets in order to sell most of them would stick around if those higher than value tickets aren't selling for them anymore.

Well the OP would give up the tickets at that point anyway because there's no money to be made.

Though I agree with both these statements the OP did say he was attending some. Doing this will definitely turn him/her off future games regardless if he /she was a season ticket holder or not. Knights probably just cost themselves a fan.

 

[allevat]

Though I agree with both these statements the OP did say he was attending some. Doing this will definitely turn him/her off future games regardless if he /she was a season ticket holder or not. Knights probably just cost themselves a fan.

Possibly, but they also opened up seats for locals who *do* want to go to games, which could create new fans. I don't disagree that they should provide more transparency on what they expect from seatholders, but in both this case and the Calgary family, the ticket-holders were going to only around 10 games a year and selling the rest. So yanking the tickets makes sense from both an audience-building view and from the point of view of recapturing that profit. I'm not a big fan of extracting the maximum in ticket prices without any consideration for fan loyalty but "local ticket holder who goes to most of the games" vs "visitor who scalps the majority their tickets" is an easy choice for a business when they have a waiting list.

 

[theslatcher]

I get to a certain extent why they are doing what they are. My problem with it is the whole secrecy of it. As a season-ticket holder how am I supposed to know the barometer or measuring stick for being blacklisted by the front office?

What if I have a business trip or vacation planned and can't attend a game or find anyone to go that I know? Am I flagged if I sell my tickets online when someone like the Maple Leafs are in town, and I make double or triple what I paid? Should I be expected to sell my tickets at "cost" to a random fan online and assume it's a diehard loyal VGK fan that's going to scream their head off all night?

The whole thing is absurd. If you're going to blacklist your season ticket holders, you should at least set the ground rules for what constitutes revocation of your ticket and not make it seem arbitrary.

Also, there are no quarter-season packages anymore in Vegas, and most of the half-season holders from 2017-18 were forced to go full season or lose their privilege to purchase.

Yeah, instead of having it be a secret, put it up front that you have to attend 50% of all games if you have a season-ticket.

 

[Vegas Mac]

I'm all for them having policies that deter fans from selling tickets. And if as a result of that enough season packages don't sell, they'll break them up into smaller groups normal folks can afford. In the end more local fans attending is always a good thing. It's a business, and ensuring the home games are as good as possible is something our owner cares about.

 

[Vegan Knight]

This isn't about brokers any longer. It's about real fans who can't afford to pay rack rate for the 20 single game tickets they'd like to attend, so they buy seasons with the intent to attend half of them and sell half of them to defray the cost.

If VGK had confidence in being able to sell those tickets at retail cost, they should have limited ST sales. As it is now, they are having their cake and eating it too, using STH as an insurance policy, then dumping them when the season has shown the demand will still be there.

When my rep Dylan was treating us like garbage during playoffs last year, I told him these chickens will come home to roost when the shine has worn off the team and they've alienated the STH that would support them through those times. I was already committed to ST at that time, but this season is it for us.

Essentially, how is the OP or any other person doing this that much different from a broker? A fan who makes a profit off the team without actually working for the team. So a broker isn't a fan and sells 10 extra tickets?

Get 10 free games, makes huge profit.

Whether you're a fan or not during the process funneling those tickets to locals who will actually go to the games is more likely to benefit Vegas with a fan who will spend more on the team.

I don't see how this hurts the team short or long term. OP wouldn't keep getting season tickets unless they would work for them. They and all the fans who get tickets pulled like this would be gone much quicker a local fan who would actually go to the games.

 

[GKG18]

If I were a STH and the people next to me were different every game, including fans of opposing teams, I would be pissed. It's like living in a house you own and having renters living next door who revolve every year. First world problems, I know, but those things aren't cheap.

 

[BattleBorn]

If I were a STH and the people next to me were different every game, including fans of opposing teams, I would be pissed. It's like living in a house you own and having renters living next door who revolve every year. First world problems, I know, but those things aren't cheap.

I had the exact same situation last season. Now that I've had to sell a few games this season, I've noticed that every time I list my tickets or change the price on VGK Ticket Exchange, they undercut me almost immediately.

So I get two randoms next to me each game (which isn't as awful as it seems) AND they battled me for the two games I've had to list to sell.

 

[IceNeophyte]

I had the exact same situation last season. Now that I've had to sell a few games this season, I've noticed that every time I list my tickets or change the price on VGK Ticket Exchange, they undercut me almost immediately.

So I get two randoms next to me each game (which isn't as awful as it seems) AND they battled me for the two games I've had to list to sell.

We just make sure we're lowest price in the lower bowl. We rarely have to change the price from there, we always sell fairly promptly, and we haven't lost money on our seat/game cost.

We have revolving tix next to us. We had to get security to remove a couple bonehead drunk VGK fan guys, but other than that, it's been good. Our interactions with the vast majority of opposing fans have been great. I like having opposing fans at the games.

 

[LadyStanley]

If I were a STH and the people next to me were different every game, including fans of opposing teams, I would be pissed. It's like living in a house you own and having renters living next door who revolve every year. First world problems, I know, but those things aren't cheap.

And if it's an AirBnB house, those folks can change weekly.

This year, I was able to get in on a VGK presale to buy three games of tickets (directly from team). Pricing varied greatly depending on day of the week and opponent.

 

[Boris Zubov]

We have revolving tix next to us. We had to get security to remove a couple bonehead drunk VGK fan guys, but other than that, it's been good. Our interactions with the vast majority of opposing fans have been great. I like having opposing fans at the games.

Yep, I prefer the out of town fans to be honest. For the most part, the issues I've had at the arena have involved local VGK "fans" who didn't care about the game nearly as much as they did getting completely shitfaced. I've noticed since the playoffs it's been more & more obnoxious, especially on the weekends. At least the tourists are into the game & understand what's happening on the ice.

 

[Boris Zubov]

I'm all for them having policies that deter fans from selling tickets. And if as a result of that enough season packages don't sell, they'll break them up into smaller groups normal folks can afford. In the end more local fans attending is always a good thing. It's a business, and ensuring the home games are as good as possible is something our owner cares about.

This sounds like a good idea in theory, but when the Knights do yank full seasons from fans, they aren't returning them to the market to other fans as full seasons. Nor do they care about making them affordable to other "real fans" (whatever you think that means). The difference between per game cost for the season over individual games is astronomical. The team is marking them up 200-300%.

As I stated earlier, Foley doesn't care who sits in the seats, he just wants to maximize profit on those seats. Then he wants to make a 25-35% profit on the resale of those seats in the secondary market. So anyone who thinks the team pulling seats from STHs is good for the rest of the fanbase, you may want to do a little more research.

 

[mundyc3]

Yep, I prefer the out of town fans to be honest. For the most part, the issues I've had at the arena have involved local VGK "fans" who didn't care about the game nearly as much as they did getting completely ****faced. I've noticed since the playoffs it's been more & more obnoxious, especially on the weekends. At least the tourists are into the game & understand what's happening on the ice.

I have had the opposite experience. I have had crazy, aggressively drunk opposing fans in my section that have tried hard to ruin everyone's time. Blackhawks, Sharks, Flyers, Capitals, and Kings fans have been the worst. Only problem I have with Knights fans is they don't have hockey etiquette. Always getting up during play with no regard for their fellow fans.