Season Officially Suspended -- COVID-19/Coronavirus Talk

[Mike Liut]

Let’s not have the police for one month and see what happens. This anti police non sense are liberal morons who can’t think for themselves. Have they really thought this through? Defund the police? Really?

 

[TheBluePenguin]

Let’s not have the police for one month and see what happens. This anti police non sense are liberal morons who can’t think for themselves. Have they really thought this through? Defund the police? Really?

So you are saying the police have not done anything to earn some of this blame they are receiving? My father was a cop but they have done some really crappy things the last few weeks...... I do not think most people want no cops, maybe better ones and de-militarized ones...

 

[Mike Liut]

So you are saying the police have not done anything to earn some of this blame they are receiving? My father was a cop but they have done some really crappy things the last few weeks...... I do not think most people want no cops, maybe better ones and de-militarized ones...

I have some advise..... quit breaking the law and you won’t have to worry.

 

[brokeu91]

I have some advise..... quit breaking the law and you won’t have to worry.

Minnesota Black Man Killed By Police Was Smart, Cautious Gun Owner

 

[Mike Liut]

Blacks make up 13% of the population and commit over 50% of the crimes. Until this changes, they are going to be targeted more.

 

[Robb_K]

I have some advise..... quit breaking the law and you won’t have to worry.

Did you not read my post above? I didn't break any law and was pulled over for no reason, and had a gun pulled on me for no reason, and could have easily been killed for no reason. And I'd bet all I have that if I had been an African-American, I WOULD have been shot, and possibly killed.

 

[Mike Liut]

I’m sure if people had to do a mandatory 6 months police duty, they’d realize what police have to deal with on a daily basis trying to protect US citizens.

like I said, let’s try being without the police for 30 days and see what happens.

 

[Robb_K]

I’m sure if people had to do a mandatory 6 months police duty, they’d realize what police have to deal with on a daily basis trying to protect US citizens.

like I said, let’s try being without the police for 30 days and see what happens.

Nobody here is trying to say the police should never use force. No one wants a situation in which future officers can't be recruited because they would be sitting ducks for being easily killed by lawbreakers. I just think that using George Floyd's unnecessary death as a catalyst to get outside agencies to have overview powers to keep watch on police departments, and public boards to have similar positions related to ALL public service positions, rather than having them only reviewed from within, there will be a lot more accountability and responsibility taken by people holding those positions.

All those people work for the general public's citizens. Currently, the average citizen has no say in how such people are disciplined or not, related to their actions. All they can do is vote for legislative representatives and some judges, and some officials, and hope they work towards following their constituencies' will (which it seems they have not been doing very well during the past 40 years or so). Laws need to be in place listing what actions can't be taken by officials, and what procedures should be in place to review them, and who does the reviewing. Then the officials will think twice about crossing the line, going beyond their allowed actions, and knowing that their own departments will no longer be able to cover up for them.

If the reform movement in getting officials to take less personal liberties at the expense of acting properly in the public interest, maybe that could lead to improvements across the board in areas like provision of health care, healthiness of the food supply, public education, reduction of pollution, building and repairing of proper physical infrastructure, working towards a more equitable distribution of wealth, and so on, so that the lives of every citizen and resident are improved, instead of moving towards further and further degradation towards 3rd Worldishness.

Police officers and other public officials who want to cross the line of what is necessary shouldn't be able to feel that they can do whatever they want and suffer no consequences, because their department will sweep it under the rug and there will be no consequences.

 

[brokeu91]

Nobody here is trying to say the police should never use force. No one wants a situation in which future officers can't be recruited because they would be sitting ducks for being easily killed by lawbreakers. I just think that using George Floyd's unnecessary death as a catalyst to get outside agencies to have overview powers to keep watch on police departments, and public boards to have similar positions related to ALL public service positions, rather than having them only reviewed from within, there will be a lot more accountability and responsibility taken by people holding those positions.

All those people work for the general public's citizens. Currently, the average city has no say in how such people are disciplined or not, related to their actions. All they can do is vote for legislative representatives and some judges, and some officials, and hope they towards following their constituencies will (which it seems they have not been doing very well during the past 40 years or so). Laws need to be in place listing what actions can't be taken by officials, and what procedures should be in place to review them, and who does the reviewing. Then the officials will think twice about crossing the line, going beyond their allowed actions, and knowing that their own departments will no longer be able to cover up for them.

If the reform movement in getting officials to take less personal liberties at the expense of acting properly in the public interest, maybe that could lead to improvements across the board in areas like provision of health care, healthiness of the food supply, public education, reduction of pollution, building and repairing of proper physical infrastructure, working towards a more equitable distribution of wealth, and so on, so that the lives of every citizen and resident are improved, instead of moving towards further and further degradation towards 3rd Worldishness.

Police officers and other public officials who want to cross the line of what is necessary shouldn't be able to feel that they can do whatever they want and suffer no consequences, because their department will sweep it under the rug and there will be no consequences.

I really wish I could like this post more than once

 

[TheBluePenguin]

I have some advise..... quit breaking the law and you won’t have to worry.

Clearly you have not been paying attention, some of these people have not been breaking the law. One lady was sleeping when plain clothes officers noknock raided her home and shot her to death.... They were looking for someone already in custody...

Expecting better from the police should be something everyone wants.

 

[Mike Liut]

Clearly you have not been paying attention, some of these people have not been breaking the law. One lady was sleeping when plain clothes officers noknock raided her home and shot her to death.... They were looking for someone already in custody...

Expecting better from the police should be something everyone wants.

I don’t disagree, but when you are dealing with humans, shit just happens. Is it right? Of course not. Will things ever change? Probably not. Don’t put yourself in dangerous situations, and 99.9% of the time you will be fine. I think In life you bring most things upon yourself.

 

[Mike Liut]

Clearly you have not been paying attention, some of these people have not been breaking the law. One lady was sleeping when plain clothes officers noknock raided her home and shot her to death.... They were looking for someone already in custody...

Expecting better from the police should be something everyone wants.

highly educated doctors have cut the wrong leg off patients. Shit just happens. Humans are humans and f*** up from time to time.

 

[Brockon]

Did you not read my post above? I didn't break any law and was pulled over for no reason, and had a gun pulled on me for no reason, and could have easily been killed for no reason. And I'd bet all I have that if I had been an African-American, I WOULD have been shot, and possibly killed.

I've had a similar instance in a town of 75,000 in Central BC. I thought it was pretty draconian in process given it was 2012...

I'd driven up to visit friends from down south, where I was living at the time (town of 12,000 about an hour away). Pulled over by an unmarked SUV on one of the main boulevards.

Having dealt with being pulled over before, I did the usual. Stopped, rolled down my driver and passenger window (it was summer, I wanted the cross breeze if it was more than a warning), pulled the keys out of the ignition and placed them on dash in plain sight, grabbed my license and had it ready on the dash for the approaching officer. He was quick, I hadn't had a chance to pull out my insurance papers, which I usually get ready too. So I had my hands on the steering wheel, in plain sight.

I was greeted with hostility - which, given the cooperative process I'd started caught me off guard. I was grilled about who I was, why I was driving in this section of town and where I was going. I've never been treated with hostility by police, even when I'd been stopped for committing traffic offences.

Being a 22 year old white male at the time, I tend to be treated with some degree of annoyance when stopped for traffic violations. But I hadn't been speeding or breaking any laws. I continue to get grilled, by this cop in plain clothes.

Eventually, he loosens up, believing my answers. He then asks for my insurance papers (5 mins after the encounter began). As I turn away from him to get them out of my glove box, I notice his partner - gun drawn, aimed at me with the pistol inside the cabin of my car. So I immediately slow down my movements, retrieve the papers and hand them to the first officer.

His partner stays with me, gun aimed on me while he returns to the unmarked SUV behind me and runs my papers. Usual traffic stop, this is under a 5 minute process. I waited for 12 minutes while this guy did his thing... Upon his return, he gives me my papers and tells me to go home and get out of this town. His partner finally holsters his weapon.

Naturally I was shocked - this is Canada, a free country - this treatment is not the standard procedure, and being told what to do by a member of the police force? I asked, clearly this wasn't a traffic stop - can you explain why I was treated like this? The answer I got is "You looked like someone I know who doesn't have a license. Get home kid." as I described this encounter to a friend later, I find out this isn't abnormal for an encounter with the drug enforcement task force - There's probably a warrant out for a guy that looks something like you.

We don't have near the same degree of violence here, and in my time in the region (27/30 years of my life) I've never seen an officer respond to a call or traffic stop with a drawn weapon. I've never had 2 officers approach me at a traffic stop that wasn't a sobriety check road block.

If in peaceful times, these measures are infrequently applied in Canada, I would expect that in tumultuous times in the states (a much more violent country, in terms of crimes committed etc) those responses, justified or not are going to be much more quickly escalated because of the frayed nerves and very hostile attitudes encountered in any situations dealing with the riots.

I won't justify or support anything that has happened. The conduct of some officers has been deplorable - but the conduct of "peaceful protestors" or those infiltrating these crowds and acting out from them is also disgusting. I don't know how you move forward from this because nobody trusts anyone to do anything remotely approaching the right thing.

 

[Celtic Note]

Blacks make up 13% of the population and commit over 50% of the crimes. Until this changes, they are going to be targeted more.

Or, if we look at the actual truth, people of color are targeted more and therefore the numbers are higher. The war on drugs has disproportionately targeted people of color at an astronomical rate. The favoritism towards letting white people go on possession charges versus arresting and charging people of color is ardent hypocrisy at best.

 

[Celtic Note]

I don’t disagree, but when you are dealing with humans, shit just happens. Is it right? Of course not. Will things ever change? Probably not. Don’t put yourself in dangerous situations, and 99.9% of the time you will be fine. I think In life you bring most things upon yourself.

If you are white you will likely be safe at that rate. If your black or brown? Those numbers are nowhere close.

 

[Mike Liut]

I have a feeling we are crossing the Rubicon as a society.

 

[Mike Liut]

 

[Robb_K]

I've had a similar instance in a town of 75,000 in Central BC. I thought it was pretty draconian in process given it was 2012...

I'd driven up to visit friends from down south, where I was living at the time (town of 12,000 about an hour away). Pulled over by an unmarked SUV on one of the main boulevards.

Having dealt with being pulled over before, I did the usual. Stopped, rolled down my driver and passenger window (it was summer, I wanted the cross breeze if it was more than a warning), pulled the keys out of the ignition and placed them on dash in plain sight, grabbed my license and had it ready on the dash for the approaching officer. He was quick, I hadn't had a chance to pull out my insurance papers, which I usually get ready too. So I had my hands on the steering wheel, in plain sight.

I was greeted with hostility - which, given the cooperative process I'd started caught me off guard. I was grilled about who I was, why I was driving in this section of town and where I was going. I've never been treated with hostility by police, even when I'd been stopped for committing traffic offences.

Being a 22 year old white male at the time, I tend to be treated with some degree of annoyance when stopped for traffic violations. But I hadn't been speeding or breaking any laws. I continue to get grilled, by this cop in plain clothes.

Eventually, he loosens up, believing my answers. He then asks for my insurance papers (5 mins after the encounter began). As I turn away from him to get them out of my glove box, I notice his partner - gun drawn, aimed at me with the pistol inside the cabin of my car. So I immediately slow down my movements, retrieve the papers and hand them to the first officer.

His partner stays with me, gun aimed on me while he returns to the unmarked SUV behind me and runs my papers. Usual traffic stop, this is under a 5 minute process. I waited for 12 minutes while this guy did his thing... Upon his return, he gives me my papers and tells me to go home and get out of this town. His partner finally holsters his weapon.

Naturally I was shocked - this is Canada, a free country - this treatment is not the standard procedure, and being told what to do by a member of the police force? I asked, clearly this wasn't a traffic stop - can you explain why I was treated like this? The answer I got is "You looked like someone I know who doesn't have a license. Get home kid." as I described this encounter to a friend later, I find out this isn't abnormal for an encounter with the drug enforcement task force - There's probably a warrant out for a guy that looks something like you.

We don't have near the same degree of violence here, and in my time in the region (27/30 years of my life) I've never seen an officer respond to a call or traffic stop with a drawn weapon. I've never had 2 officers approach me at a traffic stop that wasn't a sobriety check road block.

If in peaceful times, these measures are infrequently applied in Canada, I would expect that in tumultuous times in the states (a much more violent country, in terms of crimes committed etc) those responses, justified or not are going to be much more quickly escalated because of the frayed nerves and very hostile attitudes encountered in any situations dealing with the riots.

I won't justify or support anything that has happened. The conduct of some officers has been deplorable - but the conduct of "peaceful protestors" or those infiltrating these crowds and acting out from them is also disgusting. I don't know how you move forward from this because nobody trusts anyone to do anything remotely approaching the right thing.

Wow!! Has drug dealing really brought this on??? In almost 74 years of living in or visiting Canada, I've never seen a Canadian policeman pull a gun on anyone, other than a filmed incidents on the news. Growing up in Manitoba. the police were our friends. I DID see some rough treatment of drunk First Nation people (Crees and Ojibways) in Downtown Winnipeg, but a gun was never used. Nowadays, when I visit my sister, every year, I just stay at her house in the suburbs (other than attending the odd Jets' game): and I rarely see a cop, other than a patrol car, driving by once in a while. I'm shocked that things have degraded such that they feel compelled to behave that way.

 

[Thallis]

Blacks make up 13% of the population and commit over 50% of the crimes. Until this changes, they are going to be targeted more.

Just so you know, this is horrifically racist and comes from a deliberate misrepresentation of statistics. The thread below is an important read on the subject. Further, the link to crime is far closer tied to socioeconomic status than race.

 

[Davimir Tarablad]

 

[bluesXwinXtheXcup]

I can hear protesters chanting from my backyard. Kind of eerie...

 

[simon IC]

Nobody here is trying to say the police should never use force. No one wants a situation in which future officers can't be recruited because they would be sitting ducks for being easily killed by lawbreakers. I just think that using George Floyd's unnecessary death as a catalyst to get outside agencies to have overview powers to keep watch on police departments, and public boards to have similar positions related to ALL public service positions, rather than having them only reviewed from within, there will be a lot more accountability and responsibility taken by people holding those positions.

All those people work for the general public's citizens. Currently, the average citizen has no say in how such people are disciplined or not, related to their actions. All they can do is vote for legislative representatives and some judges, and some officials, and hope they work towards following their constituencies will (which it seems they have not been doing very well during the past 40 years or so). Laws need to be in place listing what actions can't be taken by officials, and what procedures should be in place to review them, and who does the reviewing. Then the officials will think twice about crossing the line, going beyond their allowed actions, and knowing that their own departments will no longer be able to cover up for them.

If the reform movement in getting officials to take less personal liberties at the expense of acting properly in the public interest, maybe that could lead to improvements across the board in areas like provision of health care, healthiness of the food supply, public education, reduction of pollution, building and repairing of proper physical infrastructure, working towards a more equitable distribution of wealth, and so on, so that the lives of every citizen and resident are improved, instead of moving towards further and further degradation towards 3rd Worldishness.

Police officers and other public officials who want to cross the line of what is necessary shouldn't be able to feel that they can do whatever they want and suffer no consequences, because their department will sweep it under the rug and there will be no consequences.

Very well stated, Robb. Thank you.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

So you are saying the police have not done anything to earn some of this blame they are receiving? My father was a cop but they have done some really crappy things the last few weeks...... I do not think most people want no cops, maybe better ones and de-militarized ones...

One athlete (I forgot who) is donating $1M toward training police in better tactics to subdue offenders. I am all for this. Police forces around the country have been militarized with older equipment from the military as new toys were developed for the recent wars.

Also, the number 1 recruiting pool for police officers is the veteran community. Combat vets enter civilian combat duty; the police force.

Not good.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

I have some advise..... quit breaking the law and you won’t have to worry.

I have a personal policy when it comes to dealing with the police. Don’t commit crimes.

 

[Robb_K]

I have a personal policy when it comes to dealing with the police. Don’t commit crimes.

Good advice. And also don't look like someone else, who happens to commit crimes. And don't drive a car that looks like the car of someone who commits crimes. And, above all, NEVER try to put something in your pocket while a policeman is talking to you.