Sanheim and Couturier Contracts and Futures?

phil162888

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Jul 28, 2012
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Two questions (1) What does everyone feel Fletch and the Flyers will offer Couts and Sanheim this off season in regards to their next contracts (2) If Couts and Sanheim don't sign team friendly (fair) contracts and play hard ball do you think they get traded this off season

I'm thinking 5 yrs $40 million for Couts (which is too high but how do you not give him more than Hayes) and Sanheim 3 yrs at $10.5 (He passed the eye test this year and showed improvement but does he deserve more than his last contract after a mediocre season statistically and a tight cap?)

If the Habs get knocked out early I could see them (amongst a dozen others) making a huge play for Couts if he's available
 

phil162888

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Jul 28, 2012
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Man, those would be some great contract offers by Chuck. It would cut right to the chase and let them decide to go to free agency.

Would you want to give a 29 Yr old Couts a 7 or 8 yr deal? I think anything over 5 maybe 6 you pull the plug

Travis really hasn't produced ..... maybe 5 yrs $22.5 would be as high as I would go... What are you thinking
 

Striiker

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Jun 2, 2013
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A pretty easy comparison is available for Sanheim's agent too, except Sanheim has outproduced this other individual over the past 3 years, while not even being a full-time PP player.

Not to mention having better possession stats, while playing with inferior partners nearly the entire time.

It would be an extremely difficult - if not completely impossible - to say that the other player deserves to be paid more.

So the starting point should be $6.750M per year and then you go up from there.
 

phil162888

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Jul 28, 2012
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A pretty easy comparison is available for Sanheim's agent too, except Sanheim has outproduced this other individual over the past 3 years, while not even being a full-time PP player.

Not to mention having better possession stats, while playing with inferior partners nearly the entire time.

It would be an extremely difficult - if not completely impossible - to say that the other player deserves to be paid more.

So the starting point should be $6.750M per year and then you go up from there.

Provy hasn't lived up to his deal but Sanheim better than Provorov lol You should propose to Travis.... You never stop.....Sanheim this Sanheim that... Just like Deadhead with the goalies.(at least he assesses all players).. So your on record 6 yrs-$6.75+ ok.... interesting.. Can you become the GM of another team so we can get like 4-1st rd picks for him ....please
 
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deadhead

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Actually, Provorov and Sanheim have similar offensive numbers, and Provorov is the better defensive player.
So 6x6 is probably a reasonable offer to Sanheim.

Couts is going to get $10M a year, he was underpaid for years and the organization will be loyal to him.
Term will be the issue, 5 years at $10M is a no brainer, but if he demands 7 or 8 years the AVV will be reduced to account for the lower value of the last 2-3 seasons. So 7r/$63M, 8yr/$68M or something like that.
 
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phil162888

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Jul 28, 2012
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This is a nice example of what happens when the team media pushes out constant propaganda about specific players and gullible minds buy it.

If one player outperforming another for three straight years doesn't make them better, I'd love to know what we're supposed to be evaluating players based on.

Sure he's better..... I will give you it's possible that he may be better in a season or 2 with the right partner and continued improvement defensively (Provy needs to step it up again). Both underperformed this year so Provorov definitely doesn't deserve too much praise either. Anyway stop with the nonsense Travis didn't regress as much as Myers or Provorov but both were head and shoulders better last year. I like Travis though I think it would be a mistake to trade him... He's developing into Jay Bouwmeester which was his comparable imo (solid 2 way dman that was brutal in his own end early in his career but started to play with a bit more edge to his game and eventually became a solid top 2/4 Dman 2 way dman that was great jumping into the rush but wasn't good on the PP)
 

phil162888

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Jul 28, 2012
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Actually, Provorov and Sanheim have similar offensive numbers, and Provorov is the better defensive player.
So 6x6 is probably a reasonable offer to Sanheim.

Couts is going to get $10M a year, he was underpaid for years and the organization will be loyal to him.
Term will be the issue, 5 years at $10M is a no brainer, but if he demands 7 or 8 years the AVV will be reduced to account for the lower value of the last 2-3 seasons. So 7r/$63M, 8yr/$68M or something like that.
....
For two guys that post daily... you guys are f*****. $10 million for a 29/30 yr old Couts until he's 35+ and $6 million for a kid that literally has not performed at all yet.. You two bitch and complain everyday about brutal contracts.... my god .... can I work for you two... We have a tight cap and you want to pay Couts $10 million a year for a player not even top 40 in the league are you nuts!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Seriously... love the guy but not more than $8 million which is still too much for a great player but a non elite player.
 

phil162888

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Jul 28, 2012
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Actually, Provorov and Sanheim have similar offensive numbers, and Provorov is the better defensive player.
So 6x6 is probably a reasonable offer to Sanheim.

Couts is going to get $10M a year, he was underpaid for years and the organization will be loyal to him.
Term will be the issue, 5 years at $10M is a no brainer, but if he demands 7 or 8 years the AVV will be reduced to account for the lower value of the last 2-3 seasons. So 7r/$63M, 8yr/$68M or something like that.

Sorry stopped reading after $10 million per... you think it would be a good decision to pay Couts $ 9 million dollar cap hit at ages 34,35,36,37.... Really??????? My god were f**** as an organization if thats the case as were never getting real star players.. SO the logic is since we f*** up Hayes and Provy contract we now have to f*** up Couts and Sanheim.... may I all remind you that Jake is making $8.25 at 31 and fans want to jump off a bridge
 

phil162888

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Jul 28, 2012
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W
lmao, this thread is something.
We have to keep things interesting.. we have 5 months of no Flyer hockey lol. Just curious people's mindsets as this likely coming to a head this off season. Couts may get $8.5 over 5 years but $10 million is for elite players imo but heh were the Flyers we love to overpay... This is going to be a crazy off season.. Hart + Patrick also need to re sign ... Fletcher is going to be busy
 

wankstifier

All glory to the harvest god
Jun 19, 2018
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A pretty easy comparison is available for Sanheim's agent too, except Sanheim has outproduced this other individual over the past 3 years, while not even being a full-time PP player.

Not to mention having better possession stats, while playing with inferior partners nearly the entire time.

It would be an extremely difficult - if not completely impossible - to say that the other player deserves to be paid more.

So the starting point should be $6.750M per year and then you go up from there.

While I agree with your points, I’d expect counting stat disadvantages will be factors in contract negotiation. Think TOI in all situations and goals were brought up on Provorov’s side, even though the underlying metrics might not have supported the output. Realistically, I’d expect Sanheim to be offered less
 
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wankstifier

All glory to the harvest god
Jun 19, 2018
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....
For two guys that post daily... you guys are f*****. $10 million for a 29/30 yr old Couts until he's 35+ and $6 million for a kid that literally has not performed at all yet.. You two bitch and complain everyday about brutal contracts.... my god .... can I work for you two... We have a tight cap and you want to pay Couts $10 million a year for a player not even top 40 in the league are you nuts!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Seriously... love the guy but not more than $8 million which is still too much for a great player but a non elite player.

You’d let Couturier walk even though there are few players who could replace him in the league and significant costs to acquire those replacements?

Also, most complaints are about players who provide some fraction of Couturier’s value. What players on the team justifiably earn more than Couturier?
 
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Striiker

Former Flyers Fan
Jun 2, 2013
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While I agree with your points, I’d expect counting stat disadvantages will be factors in contract negotiation. Think TOI in all situations and goals were brought up on Provorov’s side, even though the underlying metrics might not have supported the output. Realistically, I’d expect Sanheim to be offered less
Oh trust me, I agree 100%.

He’ll be undervalued because of things that shouldn’t count against him and are outside of his control, like averaging less icetime or having lower raw overall point totals, even though the former is due to coach favoritism and the latter is due to the former. The idiots might even bring up +/- too. :laugh:

Speaking of goals, it’s crazy that their all situation goals/60 over the past three years is only off by 0.02 goals per 60 minutes, even though Sanheim has 300 less minutes on the PP (179 minutes to 472 minutes).

Plus Provorov isn’t paid what he’s worth to start with, so comparing the two as players is already kinda pointless.

Anyways, I’m just saying it’d be easy for the agent to say “Look at this contract you just gave out. Now look at my client doing better than him in pretty much every way, with far less to work with. Explain why he he should make less money”.
 
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ajgoal

Almost always never serious
Jun 29, 2015
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He’ll be undervalued because of things that shouldn’t count against him and are outside of his control, like averaging less icetime or having lower raw overall point totals

If he wants more ice time, he should score more points and have a better +/-. These are not things that are out of his control.

Kids these days.
 

wankstifier

All glory to the harvest god
Jun 19, 2018
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11,097
Oh trust me, I agree 100%.

He’ll be undervalued because of things that shouldn’t count against him and are outside of his control, like averaging less icetime or having lower raw overall point totals, even though the former is due to coach favoritism and the latter is due to the former. The idiots might even bring up +/- too. :laugh:

Speaking of goals, it’s crazy that their all situation goals/60 over the past three years is only off by 0.02 goals per 60 minutes, even though Sanheim has 300 less minutes on the PP (179 minutes to 472 minutes).

Plus Provorov isn’t paid what he’s worth to start with, so comparing the two as players is already kinda pointless.

Anyways, I’m just saying it’d be easy for the agent to say “Look at this contract you just gave out. Now look at my client doing better than him in pretty much every way, with far less to work with. Explain why he he should make less money”.

I’d bet that scoresheet stats are primarily discussed in contract negotiations.
 

deadhead

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Feb 26, 2014
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Stone got 8yr/$76M at 27.
So Couts at 30 would be 5yr/$44M or so to be equivalent. But he'll get a little extra b/c he's been underpaid on his current contract.
Couts is easily one of the top 20 players in the NHL, Selke winner, consistent scorer.
20th in ES points over the last 3 seasons (combined) and one of the best defensive forwards in the league.

Giroux will take a paycut at 35, maybe a 3yr/$18M deal, he'll want to finish his career here and 35 year old players don't break the bank in FA.
Pavelski got 3yr/$21M in 2019 at 35
Stastny got 5yr/$30M in 2018 at 33

So Couts/Giroux will cost about the same going forward, and the cap will be rising by 2023-24.
 
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TCTC

Registered User
Mar 25, 2013
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Stone got 8yr/$76M at 27.
So Couts at 30 would be 5yr/$44M or so to be equivalent. But he'll get a little extra b/c he's been underpaid on his current contract.
Couts is easily one of the top 20 players in the NHL, Selke winner, consistent scorer.
20th in ES points over the last 3 seasons (combined) and one of the best defensive forwards in the league.

Giroux will take a paycut at 35, maybe a 3yr/$18M deal, he'll want to finish his career here and 35 year old players don't break the bank in FA.
Pavelski got 3yr/$21M in 2019 at 35
Stastny got 5yr/$30M in 2018 at 33

So Couts/Giroux will cost about the same going forward, and the cap will be rising by 2023-24.
You never know. At 36 Joe Thornton got 8 million for one year from the Sharks. We can hope that Giroux will take a significant paycut. But we should also be ready and prepared to move on if he doesn't.
 

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