Salary Cap: Salary Cap & Roster Building | Cap Details + Links in First Post

[Tom Hanks]

Slaps roof of car meme

 

[xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]

I don't really like Phil with Sid or Geno, to be honest. His best is when he's driving his own line, and when you put two guys who need to carry the puck and direct the flow of the shift together on the same line, it's maybe not a catastrophic failure, but it's definitely making each guy weaker than he could be. I also think we have the forward depth to put together 3 legitimately alite lines without having to put Phil with Sid or Geno. I just hope Phil and Brassard can gel with an off-season/pre-season to work on things.

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

The LW on that line would have to be pretty good based on last season. When Guentzel was on that line it really worked. I’d would say mainly because Jake and Phil clicked and are so skilled. Sheahan allowed them to do what they did being more of a safety net and providing good D.

I doubt we see that though unless they wanted some version close to this:

Brassard-Crosby-Sprong
Hagelin-Malkin-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Sheahan-Kessel
Simon-Cullen-Rust
Grant

That 3rd line did produce well but after what I saw in the playoffs with Crosby and Guentzel I can't break that group up. Also Hagelin really made that Malkin line better and they really took off when Hagelin came back from injury. What would really take this team's forward group to the next level is if Sprong could excel at this level like Guentzel did as a rookie. I believe the best spot for that to happen would be with Hagelin and Malkin. This would give him the space to open up with his great shot. Sprong has an elite level shot and was one goal off the lead of the whole AHL in his rookie season which was pretty impressive. Playing with a generational player and also arguably the best forechecker in the NHL would be the perfect spot for him and allows Kessel to carry a 3rd line with Brassard and Rust on the LW. That would be the perfect lines if Sprong proved ready. Skills are there and he would not have to be defensively responsible on that line kind of like Kessel and Neal before that..

Guentzel-Crosby-Hornqvist
Hagelin-Malkin-Sprong
Rust-Brassard-Kessel
Cullen-Sheahan-(ZAR, Grant, Simon) You could put Rust and move one of these to the 3rd line LW.

This is what I would like to see and it all comes down to Sprong meshing with Malkin. If that happens this team could put out the best 4 lines in hockey that could not be matched. Adding JJ who was the 6th best outlet passer in the league last year will also be a big boast to the forward group.

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

Rust was on pace for 45 points so he’s pretty good offensively. I doubt Sprong tops that for a while (if ever).

The great thing about Rust is that he can produce well on any line and make any line better. I remember two years ago how much better the 4th line was when Rust played on Cullen's RW. I also think Rust makes that 3rd line much better providing a Hagelin type play with more offense. Sprong needs to be played in a spot that can allow him to use his great shot and not have as much defensive responsibility like Kessel needs also. Rust can help any line and is a much more complete player.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I just like that the Penguins 8th best center in the organization right now is better than the 3rd best center in the organization 12 months ago.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Guentzel - Crosby - Phil
Hagelin - Malkin - Rust
Simon - Brassard - Hornqvist

 

[Gurglesons]

What is wrong with those lines?

Elite RW Sprong missing?

We likely see something like..

Guentzel - Crosby - Rust / Hornqvist
Hagelin - Malkin - Kessel
Simon - Brassard - Rust / Hornqvist

To start the season with Simon maybe playing 1st line RW.

I’ll be absolutely shocked if Sprong plays in our top nine to start the season.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

What is wrong with those lines?

Elite RW Sprong missing?

Sprong is missing, but more importantly the talent and complementary players are poorly distributed.

Putting our 2 most skilled and least defensively responsible players with Crosby, and our two least skilled but fastest and hardest working complementary guys with Malkin is a poor allocation of resources. It makes every line flawed and essentially eliminates the idea of rolling 3 legit scoring lines.

The absolute last thing Crosby and Guentzel need is Kessel on the other side.

 

[Gurglesons]

Sprong is missing, but more importantly the talent and complementary players are poorly distributed.

Putting our 2 most skilled and least defensively responsible players with Crosby, and our two least skilled but fastest and hardest working complementary guys with Malkin is a poor allocation of resources. It makes every line flawed and essentially eliminates the idea of rolling 3 legit scoring lines.

The absolute last thing Crosby and Guentzel need is Kessel on the other side.

I think outside of Crosby and Jake, Jake has shown to have the most chemistry with Kessel in our line-up. Let’s not forget Jake had his first hot run in the NHL with Kessel on the RW.

Even if it is in a rare circumstance, stacking Jake - Crosby - Kessel when we can’t buy a goal should be done more often. That being said I see no reason Jake - Crosby - Kessel wouldn’t be absolutely fine in the regular season.

I also don’t see how having Malkin and Rust together removes anything. They are dynamic together and Brassard seemingly plays better when he is in charge of the puck on his line. Simon has enough talent to hang with him like Sheary who was clearly the best with Brass and Hornqvist is Hornqvist. Honestly, I’d prefer Hagelin - Brassard - Hornqvist, but with our lack of LW options I don’t think it is possible.

Also, I think you are looking at our past rosters (something I think Sully is guilty of as well) and not realizing Brassard is the type of talent that with a top six winger can pretty much carry a line. Issue is he doesn’t mesh with Kessel ( who has kind of proved the last two years he can’t carry a line which I mean there are maybe two or three wingers in the league that can) and I’m not sure Rust is good enough to be carried by Brassard.

 

[JRS91]

I wouldn't mind Guentzel away from Crosby.

That said, I think Guentzel is at his best with Crosby. Guentzel can play pretty much anywhere in the top 9 on the LW. He's shown chemistry with Crosby, Malkin and Kessel. I don't think it's going to be a bad idea to put him on the first, second or third line. I just think he's at his best when playing with Crosby, so that's where he should remain.

Personally, in terms of the LW, I'd put Guentzel with Crosby and Hagelin with Malkin. Those seem to be our two best combinations at least on the LW. As far as RW goes, there's a lot more versatility, but I feel like it's a bit similar to LW. Hornqvist, much like Guentzel, can play anywhere in the top 9 on the RW, but I feel like he's at his best when playing with Crosby. That line of Guentzel, Crosby and Hornqvist was arguably our best line in the playoffs last season. That said, Hagelin, Malkin and Hornqvist was also a very productive line during the regular season, so it's tough. Personally, I think Hornqvist should play with Crosby and Guentzel until that line stops producing.

Then there's if Kessel should play on the second or third line. I think it's obvious Kessel prefers to play with Malkin, but the results don't lie and it seems like the Penguins are a much better team when Kessel is on the third line. Personally, I'm fine with it during the regular season, but I think Sullivan will ultimately move Kessel to the third line during the playoffs. Personally, I'd rather just seem him there at the beginning of the season to be honest. I understand it's an 82 game season and the lineup is going to change throughout it, but I feel like it would be good to give Brassard and Kessel time together before the playoffs start, much like Hagelin, Bonino and Kessel had time due to injuries (Which are going to happen) in 2016. So that leaves Sprong to most likely play with Malkin and Hagelin, which I think has the potential to be a very good line.

Rust can play anywhere in the lineup on LW or RW, but chances are he's playing LW on the third line with Brassard and Kessel. I'm not against putting Brassard on the wing, but I feel like Brassard gives us such amazing depth if he's playing center. Let's not forget that Brassard is a 2nd line center on most teams in the NHL. He's a 20-25 goal scorer and 50-60 point player that came from a rough situation in Ottawa that played a very defensive system. He's trying to adjust to a new system and had to basically play injured his entire time here. I think Brassard will have a very productive season.

The fourth line is most likely going to be Cullen, Sheahan and Aston-Reese. Once again, this forward group is super versatile so guys are going to move around, but in my opinion that's as solid of a fourth line as I can remember in recent memory. Cullen is soon to be 42 years old which is why I think the Penguins signed Grant, well for a couple reasons. One to give Simon some competition (I think Grant will make the team over Simon, I don't see them using 14 forwards) and two to give Cullen a rest. Grant is a very good defensive forward and penalty killer that can play all three forward positions. He's basically what you want in a 13th forward and is a good option if Cullen isn't playing well or needs a few games off.

 

[Gurglesons]

There is really very little chance we see ZAR on the opening night roster without any trades or him scoring like Jake in the preseason last year with Sprong and Simon being absolutely terrible.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

After the Brassard deal, I'm not sure why you would think that the only way to get retention for a player would be from Carolina.



It wouldn't affect Guentzel. I can think of another highly-paid winger whose position here is a lot more tenuous that Skinner signed long-term would affect.

Think of it this way:

1. Impending UFA + sweetener for Skinner
2. Sign Skinner long-term for Kessel dollars
3. Trade Kessel for prospects and picks
4. Profit

We get 5 years younger, better at ES, and bolster our prospect pool for cheap ELCs moving forward.

If you're planning to deal Sprong or Rust then getting skinner and dealing Kessel just makes that Rw even worse. Then you're back to square one.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

If Sullivan doesn't give Sprong a shot in the top nine, then I'll start to wonder if he's slipping down that road of stubbornness.

If he takes Guentzel away from Sid and puts Rust on that line, I'll take the year off.

I may or may not be joking about that last part.

 

[Gurglesons]

If Sullivan doesn't give Sprong a shot in the top nine, then I'll start to wonder if he's slipping down that road of stubbornness.

If he takes Guentzel away from Sid and puts Rust on that line, I'll take the year off.

I may or may not be joking about that last part.

There is one open spot in our top nine unless you think they’re going to pay 3.5 to a fourth liner.

I see no issue with Sprong on the fourth line with the occasional shift with the top three lines until he proves he can produce consistently on the NHL level. Sheary, Kuhn, Rust all broke in with Cullen. See no issue for Sprong to start there and move his way up the line up once injury hits or Sully decides to try Rust on the LW.

 

[EightyOne]

If Sullivan doesn't give Sprong a shot in the top nine, then I'll start to wonder if he's slipping down that road of stubbornness.

If he takes Guentzel away from Sid and puts Rust on that line, I'll take the year off.

I may or may not be joking about that last part.

That'd be the confirmation. Last year--with personnel assignments/lines/usage was the 'start to wonder' mode already.

 

[Peat]

I think we need more than 450 minutes at ES over the past three years to say this is true. I also would be interested to see how those shifts / times actually breakdown as I’d assume most of their TOI comes from Sid or Phil taking a shift before or after the other.

You would need a bigger sample size to be sure, but at the same time the sample we've got (which isn't the best) is not suggesting further attempts.

 

[JTG]

I don't believe Skinner is 5'11 or 200 lbs. At the very least, I don't buy that he's 200 lbs. He looks closer to Jake Guentzel's build out there than Sid's.

I think he is much closer to 200 than 170. Jake is really lean. Skinner has a thick build and awesome leg strength. He's always a weird guy because he shows he can come down the wing and lean into bigger defensemen and not get pushed around, but when he's down low he can get roughed up a bit. It's probably a lack of core/upper body stretch than anything else.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

If you're planning to deal Sprong or Rust then getting skinner and dealing Kessel just makes that Rw even worse. Then you're back to square one.

I'm not.

I think outside of Crosby and Jake, Jake has shown to have the most chemistry with Kessel in our line-up. Let’s not forget Jake had his first hot run in the NHL with Kessel on the RW.

Even if it is in a rare circumstance, stacking Jake - Crosby - Kessel when we can’t buy a goal should be done more often. That being said I see no reason Jake - Crosby - Kessel wouldn’t be absolutely fine in the regular season.

I mean, Jake's hockey IQ ensures he'll plays well with skill, so that's not really a problem. The issue is that Kessel's not necessary on a line with Crosby and Guentzel, and isn't the best complement for their talent. There has never been a single time while watching Crosby and Guentzel together and thought "what these guys really need is a soft, elite talent on their line". They've never required it to torch the league. They've worked fantastically well when they have a solid complementary guy who can get out of the way of their mind-meld.

I also don’t see how having Malkin and Rust together removes anything. They are dynamic together and Brassard seemingly plays better when he is in charge of the puck on his line. Simon has enough talent to hang with him like Sheary who was clearly the best with Brass and Hornqvist is Hornqvist. Honestly, I’d prefer Hagelin - Brassard - Hornqvist, but with our lack of LW options I don’t think it is possible.

Also, I think you are looking at our past rosters (something I think Sully is guilty of as well) and not realizing Brassard is the type of talent that with a top six winger can pretty much carry a line. Issue is he doesn’t mesh with Kessel ( who has kind of proved the last two years he can’t carry a line which I mean there are maybe two or three wingers in the league that can) and I’m not sure Rust is good enough to be carried by Brassard.

I don't mind Rust with Malkin. I do mind Rust and Hagelin with Malkin. Those guys are used better providing speed and a defensive conscience to different lines.

Simon is fine, but that Brass line is in no way going to cause match-up problems for opposing coaches. And I'll take issue with both the ideas that Brassard is better when he's in charge of the puck and that we have a lack of LW options when the best Brass looked all year was when we used Rust-Brass-Kessel.

 

[Shrimper]

Jake-Sid-Horny
Hags-Malkin-Rust/Sprong
Brassard-Sheahan-Kessel
Cullen-Grant-Simon/Sprong

Rust and Sprong can interchange.

 

[Rakell67]

Brassard Crosby Simon/Sprong
Hagelin Malkin Hornqvist
Guentzel Sheahan Kessel
Cullen Grant Rust
Sprong/Simon

 

[Randy Butternubs]

Looking at the RWers and RDs, think other teams will load up on their left side?

Legit question since I honestly don't know hockey strategery.

 

[Clatartar]

There is one open spot in our top nine unless you think they’re going to pay 3.5 to a fourth liner.

I see no issue with Sprong on the fourth line with the occasional shift with the top three lines until he proves he can produce consistently on the NHL level. Sheary, Kuhn, Rust all broke in with Cullen. See no issue for Sprong to start there and move his way up the line up once injury hits or Sully decides to try Rust on the LW.

Sprong on the 4th line? I thought we were aiming for logical decisions...

Sprong needs to play with Geno.
Rust needs to play on the 4th line.
Jake needs to play with Sid.
Phil needs to play away from both Sid and Geno.

 

[Jacob]

Rust is a 45 point player, he can’t be on the 4th. Hagelin will be there before Rust.

 

[Turin]

Sprong on the 4th line? I thought we were aiming for logical decisions...

Sprong needs to play with Geno.
Rust needs to play on the 4th line.
Jake needs to play with Sid.
Phil needs to play away from both Sid and Geno.

Cool, then trade most of them because those lines will have to change throughout a 100 game season ideally.

 

[Gurglesons]

Rust is a 45 point player, he can’t be on the 4th. Hagelin will be there before Rust.

Not to mention the fact they just gave him 3.5.