Salary Cap: Salary Cap + Roster Building (Cap Details in First Post) | Sassy GM Edition

[CheckingLineCenter]

I still have my doubts that Rust gets traded, I could see him being a trade candidate, but I won't believe JR will actually do it until he actually does it. I don't think there's any reason to expect Sprong to not get traded, to be honest. He won't be a guy that gets moved because the team is struggling, that's what guys like Hagelin will be moved for. He will be moved because the Penguins will be swapping him for another "change of scenery" player. I'm 100% expecting them to trade Sprong for someone like Zykov, which probably wouldn't even be a bad move.

Sprong for Zykov would be solid.

Rust idk. He’s very far from same imo. All depends if JR thinks whoever he can get back makes the team better right now.

 

[Tom Hanks]

We have a whole lot of forwards with 1 or less goals in 16 games.

Yeah but we are still scoring a lot so only need tweaks. We are getting scored on a lot too.

I have more faith in the forwards than the D

 

[WayneSid9987]

I THINK Pearson can help in a good Kunitz like way.
Conversion in the paint/between the dots.
They haven't really had that since he left.
ZAR, Kuhnackl, Hags forced to play there were all tried.

It'd REALLY help if they could take Sprong for another spin in the top 6. Since Phil isn't with G anymore, it's a perfect place to put him. Sadly, they probably won't do that.

And i agree that they gotta start gutting/the surgery on this D. As KIRK said JJ, Rig, Olli with some Ruh. It's too much suck everynight and even with Schultz back it's too much. It's 10Million bucks of too much suck.
Simply make a move and play Riiko to start things off for all i care.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I don't see two more being moved. They would be stupid to move Guentzel right now with his cost control, so I don't see him going anywhere. If Crosby is out and Brassard is still out Sheahan is your second line center, so unless they go for a center he isn't getting moved either. And I don't know how you move Rust either after moving Hagelin. You would lose all your speed and your two best penalty killers.

I think it was either Hagelin or Rust being moved not both. And I could see Sheahan getting moved but not until Brassard and Crosby are back.

And them calling up Grant and Wilson at the same time means they don't see any internal replacements in WBS right now for anyone.

That is some straight up terrible logic for keeping Sheahan, especially with how ass he has been this year. I wouldn't lose even a second of sleep if they'd trade him for nothing right now. I'm really confused by your entire post, it really comes of as complacent when the team shouldn't be complacent.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Well except NOBODY is doing that Captain Strawman. Expecting Sprong to literally know how to be in the correct position and or how to read the play in the offensive zone.

Nobodys is arguing the talent, he literally has been producing point despite playing like total ass.

Nobody is expecting him to carry a line or grind anyone down (the 4th line strawman falacy). Their expecting him to literally be competent at being in the right place. Not exactly putting up a high bar for him to clear AND ZERO to do with his linemates.

There's no strawman there. You just implied that the only reason Sprong had fantastic possession numbers was because he was playing with Crosby, and I showed you that Rust isn't doing it right now. So clearly, it's not something that just happens as soon as you play with Sid.

He's reading the play just fine...it's the main reason he's been able to produce like he has despite of his circumstances...it's how he managed that incredible read on Malkin's goal.

When a scoring line prospect is learning the ropes, you don't bury him on the 4th line in his own end for 60% of his minutes for 9 minutes a night and expect him have all the nuances of a new system down so well that he won't get exposed from time to time. That's not easing a player in. That's throwing him in the deep end and then chucking him a cinder block for a life preserver. No other scoring line prospect of ours has gotten that kind of treatment.

ZAR has a grand total of 0 points and has been worse than Sprong on the possession front...yet he's already gotten more time with Malkin than Sprong has. Why is that?

 

[madinsomniac]

Sheahan wont go anywhere... until Brass is healthy no center will... even when he is cullen will get lopped first...

Jake won’t go anywhere... way too cheap

Rust is probably safe now that hags is gone... a defenseman would probably be next.... tanger and dumo are safe but all the rest are susceptible though Rutherford seemed happy with JJs progress on Madden today...

 

[Darren McCord]

That is some straight up terrible logic for keeping Sheahan, especially with how ass he has been this year. I wouldn't lose even a second of sleep if they'd trade him for nothing right now. I'm really confused by your entire post, it really comes of as complacent when the team shouldn't be complacent.

How is it terrible logic? I said he isn't getting move unless its for a center, or if they acquire a center via another trade. If they get a center then yes I could see him getting moved.

I think they will target a Dman next or a winger. If you ship Sheahan out for one of them your center depth is Malkin, Cullen, Grant, And Bueger. Thats even worse. Sheahan may be Vanilla but he's better than Grant and TB has not played in the NHL yet.

And my post wasn't about complacency at all. I think trades will come but not with the players you mentioned thats all. I think Maatta or Sprong are more likely to be moved with picks as add ons if needed. And Sheahan down the road. Nothing was about complacency but you also cant panic and trade 3 players at once just to mix it up.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Sheahan wont go anywhere... until Brass is healthy no center will... even when he is cullen will get lopped first...

Jake won’t go anywhere... way too cheap

Rust is probably safe now that hags is gone... a defenseman would probably be next.... tanger and dumo are safe but all the rest are susceptible though Rutherford seemed happy with JJs progress on Madden today...

If the Penguins decide on keeping bad players because they have players injured in the middle of November, they deserve to be losing. That's a terrible way to build a team. They're already asininely deep at center in the first place, with their center depth extending way down into WBS. If they find a trade including Sheahan, they should do it because Sheahan is garbage this year.

How is it terrible logic? I said he isn't getting move unless its for a center, or if they acquire a center via another trade. If they get a center then yes I could see him getting moved.

I think they will target a Dman next or a winger. If you ship Sheahan out for one of them your center depth is Malkin, Cullen, Grant, And Bueger. Thats even worse. Sheahan may be Vanilla but he's better than Grant and TB has not played in the NHL yet.

And my post wasn't about complacency at all. I think trades will come but not with the players you mentioned thats all. I think Maatta or Sprong are more likely to be moved with picks as add ons if needed. And Sheahan down the road. Nothing was about complacency but you also cant panic and trade 3 players at once just to mix it up.

Because they're already really deep at center and Sheahan is terrible. It really doesn't matter what their center depth is in November, unless Brassard and Crosby are out for the year/not on the team, that doesn't matter. If you can find a taker for Sheahan in a trade that makes sense, you trade him instantly because he hasn't performed better than any given AHLer. You don't keep someone as crappy as Sheahan just because Crosby and Brassard are hurt for the short term. That's just the thing here, Sheahan isn't good enough where you worry about keeping him and his $2 million cap hit if you have some short term injuries.

 

[Tom Hanks]

I THINK Pearson can help in a good Kunitz like way.
Conversion in the paint/between the dots.
They haven't really had that since he left.
ZAR, Kuhnackl, Hags forced to play there were all tried.

It'd REALLY help if they could take Sprong for another spin in the top 6. Since Phil isn't with G anymore, it's a perfect place to put him. Sadly, they probably won't do that.

And i agree that they gotta start gutting/the surgery on this D. As KIRK said JJ, Rig, Olli with some Ruh. It's too much suck everynight and even with Schultz back it's too much. It's 10Million bucks of too much suck.
Simply make a move and play Riiko to start things off for all i care.

When Sprong gets back in the lineup he needs to not get scored on and be smarter/work harder.

I don’t see much intensity in his game this season and he’s making a lot of bad/no decisions.

Obviously Sully isn’t a fan and his play is probably part of it too. He’ll get some more games if he’s not traded and to stick he needs to play like he’ll be the first one scratched if playing badly

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

There's no strawman there. You just implied that the only reason Sprong had fantastic possession numbers was because he was playing with Crosby, and I showed you that Rust isn't doing it right now. So clearly, it's not something that just happens as soon as you play with Sid.

He's reading the play just fine...it's the main reason he's been able to produce like he has despite of his circumstances...it's how he managed that incredible read on Malkin's goal.

When a scoring line prospect is learning the ropes, you don't bury him on the 4th line in his own end for 60% of his minutes for 9 minutes a night and expect him have all the nuances of a new system down so well that he won't get exposed from time to time. That's not easing a player in. That's throwing him in the deep end and then chucking him a cinder block for a life preserver. No other scoring line prospect of ours has gotten that kind of treatment.

ZAR has a grand total of 0 points and has been worse than Sprong on the possession front...yet he's already gotten more time with Malkin than Sprong has. Why is that?

1. The strawman is that you keep implying that he need to produce despite...excuse...excuse...excuse. Thats not what ANYONE is arguing.

2. Last i checked ZAR plays LW. And can literally position himself properly.

3. Rust has always hurt Crosbys possession numbers relative to other players sometimes even outright. They put Sprong up there when Crosby was on fire. SProng wasnt the reason.

Your head is in the sand. So you might want to pull up your pants because your bias is showing.

Carrying this torch is stupifying. Good lord lawyers dont try this hard to defend people even the ones that get paid alot. Its not the linemates or the zone starts, he lacks basic instints of when he is supposed to be and what hea supposed to be doing. Whether its because hes thinking too much or not enough i dont know. But lets all hope he figured it out because he could be a 30-30 guy if he gets his shit together OR he could be just another Yakupov.

 

[Darren McCord]

Because they're already really deep at center and Sheahan is terrible. It really doesn't matter what their center depth is in November, unless Brassard and Crosby are out for the year/not on the team, that doesn't matter. If you can find a taker for Sheahan, you trade him instantly because he hasn't performed better than any given AHLer.

But what is this center depth you keep saying? With Crosby out and Brassard out you. And Sheahan moved you have.

Malkin
Cullen (Hasn't been good this year either and just turned what 100?)
Grant (Hasn't done anything a
Bleuger (0 Nhl games)
Lafferty (0 NHL games)

Thats terrible unless you expect some rookies to save the season. Which is also terrible logic.

 

[Empoleon8771]

But what is this center depth you keep saying? With Crosby out and Brassard out you. And Sheahan moved you have.

Malkin
Cullen (Hasn't been good this year either and just turned what 100?)
Grant (Hasn't done anything a
Bleuger (0 Nhl games)
Lafferty (0 NHL games)

Thats terrible unless you expect some rookies to save the season. Which is also terrible logic.

So because they have 0 NHL games, they can't play in the NHL? And where did I ever say that rookies needed to "save the season"? I'm saying Riley Sheahan is garbage this year, and playing Blueger over him isn't any sort of net loss. You'd be completely fine with playing Lafferty, Angello (he played center all throughout college) or Blueger in the NHL for 10 games if you needed them to. Sheahan is a completely replaceable piece, you don't keep him because you have short term injuries to Crosby and Brassard. You're either grossly overrating Sheahan or pretending that guys with no NHL experience can't play in the NHL.

The Penguins are very deep at center throughout their entire organization. You can trade a vanilla 4th line center with 2 injuries to your other centers and still be completely fine, because you already have 3 other 4th line centers in the organization.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

I found JRs comments about Simon... interesting.

Madden asked him if he was happy with Simon’s production this year and JR said he was very happy with it... then mentioned that he basically needed time to learn the NHL game last season, and now it’s paying off production wise, etc.

Why doesn’t that apply to a guy who lead all AHL rookies in goal scoring last season?

Seems quite curious.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

To Ottawa: Bryan Rust and Pens 2019 1st
To Pittsburgh: Matt Duchene at 50% retained
To Las Vegas: Pens 2020 3rd

 

[Empoleon8771]

I found JRs comments about Simon... interesting.

Madden asked him if he was happy with Simon’s production this year and JR said he was very happy with it... then mentioned that he basically needed time to learn the NHL game last season, and now it’s paying off production wise, etc.

Why doesn’t that apply to a guy who lead all AHL rookies in goal scoring last season?

Seems quite curious.

Are you saying this as a "JR is being impatient with Sprong" comment? I'm not exactly sure what you're getting at with this. I think you can interpret what you're saying as either "JR is making a big deal out of Sprong playing more minutes right now, when he should be more patient" or "JR is trading Sprong way too prematurely".

 

[Clare2904]

To Ottawa: Bryan Rust and Pens 2019 1st
To Pittsburgh: Matt Duchene at 50% retained
To Las Vegas: Pens 2020 3rd

Ain't Duchene UFA this summer?
What we getting from Vegas?

 

[Pens1566]

I firmly believe one of Rust/Sprong needs moved to LW. I'd put Sprong there on L3 with Rust at RW. Can't hurt. Assuming Brassard comes back.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Are you saying this as a "JR is being impatient with Sprong" comment? I'm not exactly sure what you're getting at with this. I think you can interpret what you're saying as either "JR is making a big deal out of Sprong playing more minutes right now, when he should be more patient" or "JR is trading Sprong way too prematurely".

I’m saying what I already know... Sullivan doesn’t want Sprong on this team... and JR does... yet Sprong’s name is on the block...

JR said he doesn’t get involved at that level and let’s the coaches do their thing...

Sprong could be a bust, but I want him to be around long enough to know that, and none of us know that yet... none of us... that includes the coaches... yet his name is on the block... but even the talking heads that make fun of fan overreaction like Madden and Mackey are confused what’s going on here...

Like I keep saying, quite curious.

 

[Tom Hanks]

I found JRs comments about Simon... interesting.

Madden asked him if he was happy with Simon’s production this year and JR said he was very happy with it... then mentioned that he basically needed time to learn the NHL game last season, and now it’s paying off production wise, etc.

Why doesn’t that apply to a guy who lead all AHL rookies in goal scoring last season?

Seems quite curious.

Simon’s bad is better than Sprong’s bad from what I’ve seen. This season Sprong has been mainly awful.

Every player, situation is different too. Different positions, skill set, form etc. You can’t treat everything the same.

 

[Darren McCord]

So because they have 0 NHL games, they can't play in the NHL? And where did I ever say that rookies needed to "save the season"? I'm saying Riley Sheahan is garbage this year, and playing Blueger over him isn't any sort of net loss. You'd be completely fine with playing Lafferty, Angello (he played center all throughout college) or Blueger in the NHL for 10 games if you needed them to. Sheahan is a completely replaceable piece, you don't keep him because you have short term injuries to Crosby and Brassard. You're either grossly overrating Sheahan or pretending that guys with no NHL experience can't play in the NHL.

The Penguins are very deep at center throughout their entire organization. You can trade a vanilla 4th line center with 2 injuries to your other centers and still be completely fine, because you already have 3 other 4th line centers in the organization.

So you'd be fine with a team with one first line center and 3 4th liners till they came back? It doesn't matter anyways and I am not trying to defend Sheahan. That was not my original point I am just saying, you are crazy if you think this team is going to play the AHL guys. Sullivan had TB last year and refused to play him. He refuses to play Sprong and they called up Garret Wilson and Grant before any of those guys.

Its not a matter of I don't want them to trade Sheahan, because he sucks and they should. But your crazy if you think they will actually do it right now, unless they bring in another center with experience.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

1. The strawman is that you keep implying that he need to produce despite...excuse...excuse...excuse. Thats not what ANYONE is arguing.

You said that you expected him to not play like shit and that he doesn't know how to read the play in the offensive zone. Both Sprong's numbers and how he produced those numbers dispute those ideas.

Maybe your expectations for a prospect in his position are out of whack.

2. Last i checked ZAR plays LW. And can literally position himself properly.

It's almost like one of our veteran RWs isn't effective at all in his present role and can switch to LW any time Sprong's not involved, which is pretty often.

3. Rust has always hurt Crosbys possession numbers relative to other players sometimes even outright.

Which is precisely why Rust shouldn't be there, yet he is. Why do you think that's not relevant?

They put Sprong up there when Crosby was on fire. SProng wasnt the reason.

Your head is in the sand. So you might want to pull up your pants because your bias is showing.

Crosby had 3 points in the 8 games before he and Sprong were put together.

Carrying this torch is stupifying. Good lord lawyers dont try this hard to defend people even the ones that get paid alot. Its not the linemates or the zone starts, he lacks basic instints of when he is supposed to be and what hea supposed to be doing. Whether its because hes thinking too much or not enough i dont know. But lets all hope he figured it out because he could be a 30-30 guy if he gets his **** together OR he could be just another Yakupov.

Or maybe your opinion is not supported by anything that withstands scrutiny because half the time you just make things up to support it (Crosby was ON FIYURRRRR), which makes it pretty hard to take seriously.

 

[Empoleon8771]

So you'd be fine with a team with one first line center and 3 4th liners till they came back? It doesn't matter anyways and I am not trying to defend Sheahan. That was not my original point I am just saying, you are crazy if you think this team is going to play the AHL guys. Sullivan had TB last year and refused to play him. He refuses to play Sprong and they called up Garret Wilson and Grant before any of those guys.

Its not a matter of I don't want them to trade Sheahan, because he sucks and they should. But your crazy if you think they will actually do it right now, unless they bring in another center with experience.

Well they're going to have a team with 1 1st line center and 3 4th line centers regardless of what they do with Sheahan, because Sheahan is a 4th line center at this point. They'd just save a good chunk of money and get some new blood in by getting rid of Sheahan and putting Blueger in. Any sort of downgrade from Sheahan to Blueger isn't significant because Sheahan isn't good. What does Sprong have to do with this? I'm pointing out that Sheahan is playing at "should be waived fodder" level, so playing a young guy in WBS who is performing well isn't any sort of demonstrable downgrade on what they are getting from Sheahan.

I’m saying what I already know... Sullivan doesn’t want Sprong on this team... and JR does... yet Sprong’s name is on the block...

JR said he doesn’t get involved at that level and let’s the coaches do their thing...

Sprong could be a bust, but I want him to be around long enough to know that, and none of us know that yet... none of us... that includes the coaches... yet his name is on the block... but even the talking heads that make fun of fan overreaction like Madden and Mackey are confused what’s going on here...

Like I keep saying, quite curious.

I'm still not getting what you're saying

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Ain't Duchene UFA this summer?
What we getting from Vegas?

Yes. And we're getting cap retention, like we did for the Brassard trade.

I should have been explicit about that.

 

[66-30-33]

I guess getting Pearson means we are out of the Duchene sweepstakes in July? Hagelin was 4M coming off the books, we will have 3.7 for the next 2 years and need money for raises.

 

[JackFr]

I'm expecting to see Sprong traded for one of Zykov, Ritchie, or Jacob Larsson.