Sabres Core

[Cap'n]

Not sure how many of you guys are familiar with the Marek vs. Wyshinski podcast but following Chicago's cup win a lot of the talk has been about the fact that while Chicago has seen a boatload of talent leave it's roster in order to stay under the cap that they had a core of 8 guys that were the nucleus for all three cup wins. With that thought in mind, and with yesterday's fun behind us, who is your 8 man core that you see the Sabres committing to for the next say 6 seasons?


Eichel
O'reilly
Girgensons
Reinhart
Kane
Ennis

Ristolainen
Bogosian


Questions I debated:

Feels like a 3rd D needs to be a part of the mix, McCabe, Pysyk, or possibly someone like Sekera added to that group and that would force a tough decision on either Kane or Ennis. We also just spent a heck of a lot on Lehner so it seems like he's no doubt part of Murray's core but I have a hard time supplanting someone else for him. Is Samson's place secure in the core? Does he get the nod over Girgenson? Or are both Samson and Girgenson in while Kane and Ennis are out if you consider adding a D and Lehner? One of each?

Either way I feel much better about our core heading into next season now that we've turned all the potential draft picks that we knew we had in our back pocket into actual live bodies.

Click to read more...

 

[krt88]

Who is Chicago's 8 man core? Or LA's?

You don't have 8 player cores? 4/5 yes

as of today:
Eickel, Girgensons, O'Reily, Risto and Bogo

I can't include Reinhart because he hasn't done anything and he isn't as good as Eickel. Tough to keep Kane out of this mix, but let's see if he's healthy.

 

[Gabrielor]

The core, pending development and meshing together, is short 1 top-pairing, left-shot defensemen. Otherwise, wow.

 

[Rowley Birkin]

Who is Chicago's 8 man core? Or LA's?

You don't have 8 player cores? 4/5 yes

as of today:
Eickel, Girgensons, O'Reily, Risto and Bogo

I can't include Reinhart because he hasn't done anything and he isn't as good as Eickel. Tough to keep Kane out of this mix, but let's see if he's healthy.

Exactly this.

I sound like a broken record & really do rate him as a prospect - but they should look to dangle SR as the centrepiece in a deal for a stud LD (<25 yo) to add to the above.

Then the core is complete.

 

[flyingpig]

Exactly this.

I sound like a broken record & really do rate him as a prospect - but they should look to dangle SR as the centrepiece in a deal for a stud LD (<25 yo) to add to the above.

Then the core is complete.

I guess I get that he has not proven himself at the NHL level, but I have no problem including him in our core going forward. His last Junior championship was stellar. He is a special kid and could/should end up the second or third most important player we have on the team. He sees the ice like thiose rare talents. Just needs to get bigger and a bit stronger on his skates.

IMO no reason for tempered expectations for a number 2 pick to be a solid two way, play making steady top six player.

 

[Cap'n]

Who is Chicago's 8 man core?
You don't have 8 player cores? 4/5 yes

Glad we made it one post in before you changed the exercise...

This is Chicago's 8 guys that were on all 3 cup teams. Hard to argue that at least 7 of these guys don't comprise their core (Bickell being the lone exception). I'm including their ages from the first cup win in 2010 as well.

Toews (21)
Kane (21)
Sharp (28)
Keith (26)
Hossa (31)
Seabrook (24)
Hjalmarsson (22)
Bickell (23)

Crawford also played in 2010 regular season but Niemi obviously backstopped the first cup win.

so... as I asked to start, who are the 8 players you see our team being built around for the next 5-6 seasons?

 

[Rowley Birkin]

I guess I get that he has not proven himself at the NHL level, but I have no problem including him in our core going forward. His last Junior championship was stellar. He is a special kid and could/should end up the second or third most important player we have on the team. He sees the ice like thiose rare talents. Just needs to get bigger and a bit stronger on his skates.

IMO no reason for tempered expectations for a number 2 pick to be a solid two way, play making steady top six player.

I don't disagree with any of this. When it looked like we'd miss out on McEichel I wasn't actually as worried as most people because we had such a good group to build around already.

Reinhart would be a core piece on 90% of other teams - but not ours IMO.

Again - I think KRT nailed it with his post. ROR & Girgs are proven at the NHL level & are exactly the type of all round, physical players that TM seems to want to build around. Eichel is an anomaly which very few teams will ever get the chance to benefit from. As good as he may become I don't have Reinhart on either of these levels yet. As KRT also alluded to - If I'm adding anyone to this list at forward it is Kane but we need to see what he can do in a Sabres jersey first before judging.

We also don't currently have anything resembling a first pairing LD so you have to assume when/if one is acquired he would instantly become part of the 'core' as well.

This is Chicago's 8 guys that were on all 3 cup teams. Hard to argue that at least 7 of these guys don't comprise their core (Bickell being the lone exception). I'm including their ages from the first cup win in 2010 as well.

Looking at Chicago - Sharp & Bickell are in no way part of their core. Both will get traded this summer. Their core is Toews, Kane, Hossa, Seabrook, Keith. Maybe you can add Hammer to that. This goes hand in hand with what KRT is projecting for the Sabres.

 

[OkimLom]

Easily: (in order of importance IMO)
Eichel
ROR
Reinhart
Ristolanien
Girgensons
Kane
Bogosian

If I had to throw another guy to make 8 there it would be a toss up of Pysyk, Foligno, or Ennis

 

[TalkingProuder]

Reinhart has done nothing but Eichel has? Of course Eichel is a better, more ready NHL prospect but the Buffalo Sabres had Reinhart as the #1 player on their entire draft board. Surely they value him highly.

 

[yahhockey]

FWIW I posted the paragraph below in the around the league playoffs thread. The eight players that were on all three Cup winning teams for the Hawks consist of: 3 D, 5 F, 6 drafted by Chicago, one acquired via trade and one signed via free agency

The seven players to win three cups with the Blackhawks are: Hjalmarsson (108th in 2005 by Chicago), Hossa (12th in 1997 by Ottawa, signed as FA in 2009), Kane (1st in 2007 by Chicago), Keith (54th in 2002 by Chicago), Seabrook (14th in 2003 by Chicago), Sharp (95th in 2001 by Philly, traded to Chicago in 2005 after moderate AHL success and minimal NHL success), Toews (3rd in 2006 by Chicago)
-A minor addendum...Someone above mentioned Bickell who was not listed on the wikipedia roster page I looked at leading me to believe there were only seven. He played 16 regular season games, 4 playoff games during their 2009/2010 Cup run and was drafted 41st in 2004 by Chicago.

We have so many young players it's hard to say who may be in it for the long haul so I think the term "core" is much harder to define on this team. Is it abnormal to have this many talented players under 25 or have I simply forgotten what building a winning future looks like? Tampa Bay comes to mind, to a lessor extent Edmonton because their ineptitude (and a little luck) is what created their group of youngsters although I still feel we have the better overall team. The Bryan Bickell of the Sabres could be one of Fasching/Bailey/Baptiste who finally crack the roster in a couple years during our first deep run. Hopefully the Lehner trade pans out and he'll be on the roster for six or more seasons however for now if we were going to list eight...

Eichel
Ristolainen
O'Reilly (if resigned), Kane if ROR leaves
Reinhart
Bogosian
Girgensons
Larsson
Pysyk/McCabe

 

[Sabre the Win]

Most of you don't realize that the players we have now might just be placement holders until we can develop some talent in the future. You say we need a core LHD but maybe our core LHD is not on the roster yet but developing. Reinhart is young and could be one of the best playmakers of the last decade, think Adam Oates and is cost controlled. When Reinhart is 24, Ryan O'Reilly, Ennis, Kane will be 28 and probably looking for a big payday we won't be able to afford. Some will stay and some will move on.

Reinhart and Eichel are the future and the core 1/2C with Risto as the core 1D

To think anybody else is the core is being short sighted. I want a Stanley Cup win but I also want a Dynasty and having 2 young potential star centers for the next 15 years is better than having O'Reilly, Kane, Ennis and whoever else.

Only downside to this, is any one of those 3 in Reinhart, Eichel or Risto bust it sets plans back but I'm pretty confident neither will.

 

[krt88]

FWIW I posted the paragraph below in the around the league playoffs thread. The eight players that were on all three Cup winning teams for the Hawks consist of: 3 D, 5 F, 6 drafted by Chicago, one acquired via trade and one signed via free agency

The seven players to win three cups with the Blackhawks are: Hjalmarsson (108th in 2005 by Chicago), Hossa (12th in 1997 by Ottawa, signed as FA in 2009), Kane (1st in 2007 by Chicago), Keith (54th in 2002 by Chicago), Seabrook (14th in 2003 by Chicago), Sharp (95th in 2001 by Philly, traded to Chicago in 2005 after moderate AHL success and minimal NHL success), Toews (3rd in 2006 by Chicago)
-A minor addendum...Someone above mentioned Bickell who was not listed on the wikipedia roster page I looked at leading me to believe there were only seven. He played 16 regular season games, 4 playoff games during their 2009/2010 Cup run and was drafted 41st in 2004 by Chicago.

We have so many young players it's hard to say who may be in it for the long haul so I think the term "core" is much harder to define on this team. Is it abnormal to have this many talented players under 25 or have I simply forgotten what building a winning future looks like? Tampa Bay comes to mind, to a lessor extent Edmonton because their ineptitude (and a little luck) is what created their group of youngsters although I still feel we have the better overall team. The Bryan Bickell of the Sabres could be one of Fasching/Bailey/Baptiste who finally crack the roster in a couple years during our first deep run. Hopefully the Lehner trade pans out and he'll be on the roster for six or more seasons however for now if we were going to list eight...

Eichel
Ristolainen
O'Reilly (if resigned), Kane if ROR leaves
Reinhart
Bogosian
Girgensons
Larsson
Pysyk/McCabe

How can Larsson, Pysyk or McCabe be considered part of the team core as this stage? This makes no sense.

Maybe a year from now but certainly not today.

 

[ZZamboni]

I don't think the core is complete. Maybe Murray doesn't even believe in having a "core".

 

[slip]

Easily: (in order of importance IMO)
Eichel
ROR
Reinhart
Ristolanien
Girgensons
Kane
Bogosian

This.

 

[CatsforReinhart]

ROR is a free agent next year. Sorry, how can that be a core piece without a contract. Sure he could resign but until then....

 

[BananaSquad]

ROR> Reinhart. Im down to trade him for a top pairing dman.

 

[BananaSquad]

ROR is a free agent next year. Sorry, how can that be a core piece without a contract. Sure he could resign but until then....

Hes going to sign

 

[slip]

ROR is a free agent next year. Sorry, how can that be a core piece without a contract.

Should we take Risto off the list, too?

 

[CatsforReinhart]

Should we take Risto off the list, too?

Risto is an RFA don't be thick.

 

[yahhockey]

With that thought in mind, and with yesterday's fun behind us, who is your 8 man core that you see the Sabres committing to for the next say 6 seasons?

How can Larsson, Pysyk or McCabe be considered part of the team core as this stage? This makes no sense.

Maybe a year from now but certainly not today.

I'm simply replying to what the OP wanted to discuss. Do I think my list of eight are the eight best players on the Sabres today? No, I certainly do not. I'm not even sure how long those eight players will be with the team but what fun is it to post the same 7/8 names in every post. Larsson was finally given a chance to shine and showed he may be a feisty two-way player that other forwards despise playing against. Hopefully one of Pysyk and McCabe will become a solid top four defender that is reliable in their own end and can eat up a lot of minutes.

We're talking about eight players that may be with the team through a couple of Cup runs and that "core" may not be the highest paid or the most talented. Probably at least two of the eight are not on the active roster today since the team's first potential Cup run is probably a couple of years away. Even names like Deslauriers and Fasching should be popping up on some of the lists.

A discussion about the team's top X players is a completely different discussion than what the OP wanted to have. The only certain "core" players in the sense of ones that I hope are with the team indefinitely are Eichel and Risto. Reinhart will probably be added to that list in short order and may even deserve to be on that list today but any other player could be moved for assets and eventually replaced. Losing those two/three would be much harder to overcome. We have so many players under 25 that it simply won't be feasible to keep them together for a long period of time.

 

[Sabre the Win]

ROR> Reinhart. Im down to trade him for a top pairing dman.

Why when ROR will be shifted to the wing where he plays best and the real stars will be Eichel/Reinhart down the middle if all goes as planned. Your another person who doesn't plan for the future. You do realise ROR will age before Reinhart. they are about a 4 year difference, down the line that's huge.

the main core should be the 18/19 years olds.