Confirmed with Link: Sabres acquire Colin Miller from VGK for STL's 2nd round pick in 2021 and a 5th round pick in 2022

[Chainshot]

Why does his draft position matter at this point?

IKR? Look no farther than the most recent award night to see a bunch of players winning recognitions and those guys were not first round picks. Good players develop. Sometimes even from somewhere outside the top picks.

 

[Buffalo Norsemen]

Have not seen one whisper he is available or being offered. Brisebois is a pretty smart cookie who learned under another smart cookie. So being a realist I cannot ponder the idea of it happening.

But if a young stud / Selke style center is available... we have to pounce.
Cirelli is the real deal. Even if he plateaus as a puck dom 40 point 2 way center, the acquisition will be well worth it.

 

[joshjull]

For me, it's not a question of whether Dahlin could handle that role, because I think he very much looks like he'll become the franchise blue-liner we hoped for. It's a question of whether that's the best use of his talent. Is the team going to be better if we sacrifice some of his offense for defense? Or would the team be better served by finding its own McDonagh/Vlasic type to take the tougher minutes while letting Dahlin have greater opportunity to create offense? I think the latter is probably true. I think it goes without saying that if we can't find a guy to anchor a more purely defensive pairing, we'll get better results putting Dahlin in that role than anyone else on the roster, but it comes down to roster construction.

Good points and I get where you're coming from. I’m saying I expect Dahlin to be able to bring Vlassic level defense while also bringing Burns level offense. I don’t see much of anything surrendered. To me Dahlin at his peak will be as impactful as guys like Chara, Lidstrom, Pronger, Niedemayer, Suter, etc at their respective peaks. Playing huge minutes (26+mins) and tilting the ice in their team’s favor whenever on the ice. But I’ll gladly have another pair with a Vlassic level shutdown ability as well.

 

[My Cozen Dylan]

Can people please stop talking about Cirelli? Frankly it's annoying to see you all waste your energy on something that would never happen in a million years.

 

[Sabre the Win]

No. That's why it would have to be Gourde. Hes a proven top 6 forward anyway. Why the obsession with Cirelli over him? Gourde is proven.

Guorde has a NTC and hes probably not waiving to come to Buffalo.

 

[Tatanka]

Interesting proposal from a stars fan on the main board:

To Dallas:
Risto

To Buffalo:
Lotery protected 2020 1st
Oettinger
Robertson
Cecconi
Hanzal (cap dump 4.5 for one year)

Thought it wasn’t bad. Oettinger helps the Amerks situation and lets 6k rehab without pressure.
Robertson looks like a top 6 goal scorer. Hanzal would be off the books after a year.

I’ll hang up and listen.

 

[hizzoner]

I have seen a lot of Ristolainen live. He has been terrific. He has been awful. But so has almost every defence man. The inconsistency of our goaltending has restricted some breakout play-no question. The scheme or lack of it for D in their own zone just drives me nuts. It is either a wing and a prayer stretch pass or a pass to a stationary winger standing on the blue line facing in towards our zone. That player then looks to pass but can only see back to his own end and does not have the skill set to turn and start skating before being banged into the boards. The short give and go just never seemed to me to be there--because the forward was not looking for the pass quickly enough and the D held onto the puck too long to have a good option. Teams sent 2 guys in to forecheck and that made it even tougher for our D. Until recently only Risto could skate it out so they always went after him if the puck was in his zone. With the acquisition of other Dmen who can and WILL skate with it and who will themselves get open for the quick pass then Risto's hockey IQ and his physical skills might be better utilized. Coaching IS important and CAN make a difference.

 

[MayDayMayDay]

This trade from yesterday has me way stoked. Miller is seriously just what the doctor ordered for our blue line - defensively responsible, great skater, good size, mean as a bag of hornets, and excellent character. I see him coming in and taking on a real glue guy, leadership role on this team. Great move by Botts.

 

[MayDayMayDay]

Interesting proposal from a stars fan on the main board:

To Dallas:
Risto

To Buffalo:
Lotery protected 2020 1st
Oettinger
Robertson
Cecconi
Hanzal (cap dump 4.5 for one year)

Thought it wasn’t bad. Oettinger helps the Amerks situation and lets 6k rehab without pressure.
Robertson looks like a top 6 goal scorer. Hanzal would be off the books after a year.

I’ll hang up and listen.

I'm kind of surprised the Stars would put Robertson's name out there. That team needs secondary scoring, and he can flat out play in the offensive end.

 

[Der Jaeger]

Cirelli for Ristolainen would be the best move Botterill has ever made... by far.

Agreed

 

[sabresEH]

I'm sure everyone has different opinions of Risto's value and just how good he is (versus being miscast or what have you)... but, just going on people's opinions on the trade, acquiring Miller for this price has to make you question what we would even get back for Risto. If it'd be *that* much better.

Doubt anyone wants to move Risto for a few picks. Or slightly better than a few picks.

You're ignoring the fact that almost every trade involving d-men this off season are salary based deals. Hence the " low" returns or picks being the pieces coming back.

We don't need to move Risto due to cap space so our return wouldn't be a package of futures/picks(unless Botts asks for that). If Risto is moved it will be for forward help.

 

[CrazyPsycho]

I have seen a lot of Ristolainen live. He has been terrific. He has been awful. But so has almost every defence man. The inconsistency of our goaltending has restricted some breakout play-no question. The scheme or lack of it for D in their own zone just drives me nuts. It is either a wing and a prayer stretch pass or a pass to a stationary winger standing on the blue line facing in towards our zone. That player then looks to pass but can only see back to his own end and does not have the skill set to turn and start skating before being banged into the boards. The short give and go just never seemed to me to be there--because the forward was not looking for the pass quickly enough and the D held onto the puck too long to have a good option. Teams sent 2 guys in to forecheck and that made it even tougher for our D. Until recently only Risto could skate it out so they always went after him if the puck was in his zone. With the acquisition of other Dmen who can and WILL skate with it and who will themselves get open for the quick pass then Risto's hockey IQ and his physical skills might be better utilized. Coaching IS important and CAN make a difference.

Risto likes to ring the puck around the boards...

In the OZone

 

[Shootica]

Cirelli for Ristolainen would be the best move Botterill has ever made... by far.

Trading Cirelli makes absolutely no sense for Tampa given their cap situation and that he's still on his ELC. They'll want to trade just about anybody else before getting rid of him.

Hyping ourselves up over the concept of a Cirelli for Risto swap just seems pointless.

 

[tsujimoto74]

Trading Cirelli makes absolutely no sense for Tampa given their cap situation and that he's still on his ELC. They'll want to trade just about anybody else before getting rid of him.

Hyping ourselves up over the concept of a Cirelli for Risto swap just seems pointless.

I'd take cap dumps to get Cirelli. The Lightning will still have Stamkos and Point, so it's not like they'd really be hurting at C.

 

[Dreakon13]

You're ignoring the fact that almost every trade involving d-men this off season are salary based deals. Hence the " low" returns or picks being the pieces coming back.

We don't need to move Risto due to cap space so our return wouldn't be a package of futures/picks(unless Botts asks for that). If Risto is moved it will be for forward help.

True, but in that case GM's will probably look elsewhere (ie. cap strapped teams) before breaking the bank on Risto.

I'm all for trading Risto for legit forward help... I'm just not sure that offer is going to be out there. Hopefully this is a situation where Botts only pulls the trigger on an overpayment. For reals this time.

 

[Baccus]

Nice move by Botts, 2nd rounder for someone with term that can play middle pairing or solid bottom pairing.

Still needs to fix the center position before start of the season.

For those talking about Gourde, I don't think his NTC actually kicks in until July 1st according to capfriendly, so still "movable" for a couple days.

 

[Reddawg]

The best part about this trade is it means we aren’t going to do something stupid like give Tyler Myers 7 x $7m

 

[Jame]

Trading Cirelli makes absolutely no sense for Tampa given their cap situation and that he's still on his ELC. They'll want to trade just about anybody else before getting rid of him.

Hyping ourselves up over the concept of a Cirelli for Risto swap just seems pointless.

I agree.

Won’t stop me from responding to people who say “no way” from a Buffalo perspective... or valuing Cirelli as a 3rd round/30 point player.

They are wrong about Cirelli.

 

[Chainshot]

Trading Cirelli makes absolutely no sense for Tampa given their cap situation and that he's still on his ELC. They'll want to trade just about anybody else before getting rid of him.

Hyping ourselves up over the concept of a Cirelli for Risto swap just seems pointless.

Indeed. They haven't displayed a lack of vision when it comes to trades. Hell, they're in a cap bind and just fleeced a first round pick out of a fringe playoff team for one of their known cap dumps. They're not going to deal a cost-controlled entity like Cirelli.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

I have a hunch Scandella is going to be a lot better this coming season. Might have something to do with Housley’s ridiculous defensive system.....

If we’re blaming coaching for scandella then Risto is underrated. Posts all over this thread about coaching’s effect on d, but Risto better get traded amirite!?

On topic, yay another defenseman.

 

[Der Jaeger]

If we’re blaming coaching for scandella then Risto is underrated. Posts all over this thread about coaching’s effect on d, but Risto better get traded amirite!?

On topic, yay another defenseman.

Well, yes and no. Risto did play in Housley’s dumb system. But he doesn’t have Scandella’s track record of good defensive play.

 

[WeDislikeEich]

'It just takes guys that are willing to buy in': Colin... (sub required)

One organizational difference between the Sabres and Golden Knights has been a connection in the dressing room. While Vegas bonded, Buffalo has had players tune out the past two coaches (though Dan Bylsma and Phil Housley also shoulder their share of the blame for that).
Miller can bring a better attitude to a team that’s missed eight consecutive postseasons.

“It just takes guys that are willing to buy in,” Miller said. “I think if there’s one thing that I was most proud of in Vegas, it was the character of the guys and the friendships that I made, because we had such good people in that locker room and good people throughout the organization.
“That’s the first thing in Buffalo, from talking to the coach and the players and the GM — it really is some great people here. And that’s what it takes, ultimately, if you’re going to come together as a team.”

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

Well, yes and no. Risto did play in Housley’s dumb system. But he doesn’t have Scandella’s track record of good defensive play.

has he had a chance? Housley <- Disco <- Nolan <- Rolston 5 years of his career spent with coaches that this board has widely trashed for their coaching of the blueline, hes played half a season under Lindy Ruff and the rest of his career under high school coaches

Jeremy White was ranting the other day and said everyone brought into Buffalo has become a tire fire and the bums in toronto got better, I thought oh ya 5 years of below NHL caliber coaching vs babcock, that will happen won't it

 

[Dirty Dog]

Huh? How...

He means when bits is sending the quantity and the best player in the deal is being sent out way. See skinner, montour, Miller relative to ROR (where we were getting the quantity). The truth is, the side getting the quality player for futures almost always looks better...

 

[sandybridge]

He means when bits is sending the quantity and the best player in the deal is being sent out way. See skinner, montour, Miller relative to ROR (where we were getting the quantity). The truth is, the side getting the quality player for futures almost always looks better...

This is actually taking advantage of a situation though.

They would have never moved him if the cap came to > 83M. VGK really had no choice in the matter, Haula and Miller are supplemental pieces that they can replace internally, but it doesn't been they are not valuable. And the value in both cases are pretty bad for them in the deals.