Player Discussion Ryan Spooner

[effen]

First line production on a reasonable contract.

So fancystats are great until you don't want to hear em? OK.

glhf

 

[Stasis]

I think he's been both good and lucky....I'd be very hesitant to hand out long term deals to people based on small sample sizes...see smith, brendan

This is my exact concern. Smith and Skjei were great, we thought we had a fantastic 2nd pairing for years to come. And look where we are.

That said, we've scored 17 goals since he joined us. 10 of which he scored or assisted on. 58.82% of our goals.

Also of note, Kevin Hayes has scored 4 goals in those 6 games. All assisted by Spooner. So we're seeing that Spooner and Hayes mesh and that's great. We want that. We're very likely not getting rid of Hayes and Spooner has clearly helped him find his game. On the one hand, not only is Spooner directly raising Hayes' value and bargaining power for his next contract, he's also making a case for being signed much like Smith did. And it's a gamble. I don't think we can really do both him and Namestnikov. And I prefer Namesnikov, even if he's not currently producing. I think he's the better bet, for us, in the long run. I like his overall game a lot more and he'll find his right linemates. It can take time. This flash in the pan Spooner/Hayes magic... I have my doubts. Especially because of Skjei/Smith.

I'd hate to be Gorton right now, and I'd love to be Gorton right now. I sit here creating and recreating rosters again and again, and it's just so damn hard to know. So many moving pieces and uncertainties.

This can go either way, so fast, and really determine how quick of a turnaround we see. Combined with draft position and our Russians and other prospects, obviously.

 

[Machinehead]

So fancystats are great until you don't want to hear em? OK.

glhf

Patrick Kane has bad fancystats.

It doesn't really matter than much if you score like a 1st liner and get paid like a 3rd liner.

 

[effen]

This is my exact concern. Smith and Skjei were great, we thought we had a fantastic 2nd pairing for years to come. And look where we are.

That said, we've scored 17 goals since he joined us. 10 of which he scored or assisted on. 58.82% of our goals.

Also of note, Kevin Hayes has scored 4 goals in those 6 games. All assisted by Spooner. So we're seeing that Spooner and Hayes mesh and that's great. We want that. We're very likely not getting rid of Hayes and Spooner has clearly helped him find his game. On the one hand, not only is Spooner directly raising Hayes' value and bargaining power for his next contract, he's also making a case for being signed much like Smith did. And it's a gamble. I don't think we can really do both him and Namestnikov. And I prefer Namesnikov, even if he's not currently producing. I think he's the better bet, for us, in the long run. I like his overall game a lot more and he'll find his right linemates. It can take time. This flash in the pan Spooner/Hayes magic... I have my doubts. Especially because of Skjei/Smith.

I'd hate to be Gorton right now, and I'd love to be Gorton right now. I sit here creating and recreating rosters again and again, and it's just so damn hard to know. So many moving pieces and uncertainties.

This can go either way, so fast, and really determine how quick of a turnaround we see. Combined with draft position and our Russians and other prospects, obviously.

Great post. There's actually a logjam coming up in 2 or 3 years where Mika is still signed at that point, Hayes will have a contract with term, Namestinkov will probably as well, Spooner would be a 4th C eligible guy, Lias Andersson and Chytil make 6, Brett Howden would be 7, Boo Nieves is still floating around and he's 8 guys who should theoretically be playing center.

I'm of the opinion where we look ahead and sell on one of Spooner or Names, and like you I'd rather the two way guy over the playmaker. We'll see though, it's a nice problem to have.

 

[Fvital92]

This is my exact concern. Smith and Skjei were great, we thought we had a fantastic 2nd pairing for years to come. And look where we are.

That said, we've scored 17 goals since he joined us. 10 of which he scored or assisted on. 58.82% of our goals.

Also of note, Kevin Hayes has scored 4 goals in those 6 games. All assisted by Spooner. So we're seeing that Spooner and Hayes mesh and that's great. We want that. We're very likely not getting rid of Hayes and Spooner has clearly helped him find his game. On the one hand, not only is Spooner directly raising Hayes' value and bargaining power for his next contract, he's also making a case for being signed much like Smith did. And it's a gamble. I don't think we can really do both him and Namestnikov. And I prefer Namesnikov, even if he's not currently producing. I think he's the better bet, for us, in the long run. I like his overall game a lot more and he'll find his right linemates. It can take time. This flash in the pan Spooner/Hayes magic... I have my doubts. Especially because of Skjei/Smith.

I'd hate to be Gorton right now, and I'd love to be Gorton right now. I sit here creating and recreating rosters again and again, and it's just so damn hard to know. So many moving pieces and uncertainties.

This can go either way, so fast, and really determine how quick of a turnaround we see. Combined with draft position and our Russians and other prospects, obviously.

It's easier To find an excelent 3C than a borderline 1st line winger. This guy is the real deal, he will be a steal at 4mi per year .

 

[Machinehead]

We traded Miller because Spooner made him entirely expendable. But Miller is 6'2" and American so he's better.

They're actually fairly similar, but Miller is a shoo-in to be overpaid whereas Spooner is a shoo-in to be a bargain.

 

[darko]

Patrick Kane has bad fancystats.

It doesn't really matter than much if you score like a 1st liner and get paid like a 3rd liner.

Been telling you for years fancystats are somewhat overrated. You have finally seen the light.

 

[Machinehead]

Been telling you for years fancystats are somewhat overrated. You have finally seen the light.

I won't budge on defensemen.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

No way you trade Spooner. He is flourishing as a Ranger. He needs to stay.

 

[nyr2k2]

All preseason the proposals were Holden for Spooner. Kind of worked out that way, indirectly.

 

[Yuck]

Unless the Rangers intent on tanking next year for a better draft position rather than trying to build a winning culture (which I don't think is happening), I don't see why you wouldn't sign all three of Spooner, Hayes and Namestinkov as long as its fairly reasonable. As long as their new contracts aren't an albatross, they all seem pretty easy to move if/when we need to and let us gracefully introduce our youngin's on the third and fourth line. I'd much rather invest in those three than Vesey (which I'd still sign but move if the kids make it). Let the kids push these guys off the team, make them work for it. Just don't give them contracts that we can't move going forward if & when the kids work out. Let's build a young and deep team with four lines of talent.

 

[NYRFAN218]

I wonder how much teams value the small sample size he has with the Rangers. Say he does finish the year out as PPG with us, how much does that change his value to what it was previously?

 

[Off Sides]

I'd rather see them trade Spooner if they can get a good return. He is a decent middle 6 wing and all but if some team out there thinks he can be a bargain playing in their top 6, and will trade a relatively high ceiling prospect based on that idea, I'm hoping the Rangers are listening.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

We traded Miller because Spooner made him entirely expendable. But Miller is 6'2" and American so he's better.

They're actually fairly similar, but Miller is a shoo-in to be overpaid whereas Spooner is a shoo-in to be a bargain.

If Miller was a free agent acquisition, people wouldn't defend him so much.

 

[Machinehead]

After last night, Spooner is close to 3.00 p/60. McDavid has company.

The fact that it changed that quickly shows you the type of opportunities he was getting in Boston as far as TOI.

I don't know how you don't take a flier on that at a reasonable AAV.

 

[Miamipuck]

I'd say the out of shape argument for smith only works for the first 10 to 15 games... If you're not in shape by that time.....

It's not that simple sometimes, if you get behind other players, sometimes you just never seem to catch up. I think he got behind the eightball and never seemed to catch up. Actually, it snowballed on him and he got worse. Also, you can't discount that AV's defensive scheme didn't make it all that easy on him to get up to par with the rest of the players/league.

I missed this:

I dunno, I think it’s the kind of thing that can snowball. Yeah maybe you’ll get in better shape after a few weeks but everyone is getting better then too and they’re building on a stronger foundation than you are

Agreed......

 

[Machinehead]

Also, Smith was always going to struggle in AV's defensive scheme sham even if he was in the best shape of his life.

 

[kovazub94]

I'd rather see them trade Spooner if they can get a good return. He is a decent middle 6 wing and all but if some team out there thinks he can be a bargain playing in their top 6, and will trade a relatively high ceiling prospect based on that idea, I'm hoping the Rangers are listening.

What kind of a prospect you expect back? Would it really be a A-level prospect? How high of a ceiling would there be if he's a return for Spooner? Meanwhile a decent young middle-6 winger who could be a bargain relative to his production would be valuable to the Rangers during the rebuild, and given his age, after the team would come out on the other side.

 

[Off Sides]

What kind of a prospect you expect back? Would it really be a A-level prospect? How high of a ceiling would there be if he's a return for Spooner? Meanwhile a decent young middle-6 winger who could be a bargain relative to his production would be valuable to the Rangers during the rebuild, and given his age, after the team would come out on the other side.

That is kind of what I was saying, if some other team thinks he can be a bargain for his production for them perhaps they would give up a prospect they probably shouldn't.

If the Rangers end up keeping Zbad, Kreider, Spooner, Hayes, Name, Skjei, Buch, Fast, Shattenkirk, Lundqvist, and whatever else is still around, and add in which ever prospects are ready, that to me looks like a team that is fighting for a wildcard spot. If that plays out for a year or two are they going back to buying at the deadlines? At some point that roster building technique looks to becomes good enough to be one of the teams who makes the playoffs as about half the league does but not good enough to win a Cup.

 

[kovazub94]

That is kind of what I was saying, if some other team thinks he can be a bargain for his production for them perhaps they would give up a prospect they probably shouldn't.

If the Rangers end up keeping Zbad, Kreider, Spooner, Hayes, Name, Skjei, Buch, Fast, Shattenkirk, Lundqvist, and whatever else is still around, and add in which ever prospects are ready, that to me looks like a team that is fighting for a wildcard spot. If that plays out for a year or two are they going back to buying at the deadlines? At some point that roster building technique looks to becomes good enough to be one of the teams who makes the playoffs as about half the league does but not good enough to win a Cup.

I have doubts about your starting point that someone would give up a high quality prospect for Spooner at this point. If he continues his transformation in a Brassard-like fashion - maybe he gets his stock up to that level after some time from now.

 

[Off Sides]

I have doubts about your starting point that someone would give up a high quality prospect for Spooner at this point. If he continues his transformation in a Brassard-like fashion - maybe he gets his stock up to that level after some time from now.

That may be true, but if he would be a good signing and player for the Rangers going forward, why not worth it for some other team to trade something valuable for him?

 

[nyr2k2]

I think the Rangers want to get back to competitive sooner rather than later, and as such I think they keep Spooner.

 

[Off Sides]

I think the Rangers want to get back to competitive sooner rather than later, and as such I think they keep Spooner.

That may be, I just believe that type of team building is going to lead to the same thing they just broke up, a team that has some potential for anything to happen but not one who is going to be one of the odds on favorites. Which leads back to can kicking, without elite or near elite skaters results may vary based on how far a goaltender can take them.

 

[Machinehead]

That may be, I just believe that type of team building is going to lead to the same thing they just broke up, a team that has some potential for anything to happen but not one who is going to be one of the odds on favorites. Which leads back to can kicking, without elite or near elite skaters results may vary based on how far a goaltender can take them.

Why would it lead to that?

Having good players in your middle six doesn't disqualify you from having top talent.

 

[Off Sides]

Why would it lead to that?

Having good players in your middle six doesn't disqualify you from having top talent.

How do they get the top talent by being halfway good?

They tried through UFAs, the Nash trade, and it still left them short of the Cup even with the best or one of the best goalies in his prime.

Other than them getting a Barzel in the mid 1st round of the draft, or a Bergeron with a 2nd, etc, or making a trade with Edmonton for a former top pick, or them getting another Gomez/McD, which are all low odds of happening, they need to draft those types early in the first round. Even the mid or later picks they won't have the chances as they will be selling those picks off at the deadlines to make their halfway good team seem a little better.