Confirmed with Link: Ryan O'Reilly Thread Part III - O'Reilly SIGNS 2 yrs 12M (6M AAV) - No Arbitration

[tigervixxxen]

It's at least positive.

Yes, even though technically not much was resolved in the long term at least in the short term it feels much better, or at least better than it did 24 hours ago.

 

[5280]

Yes, even though technically not much was resolved in the long term at least in the short term it feels much better, or at least better than it did 24 hours ago.

I would love to know what longer-term contract numbers were tossed about.

 

[AslanRH]

Yes, even though technically not much was resolved in the long term at least in the short term it feels much better, or at least better than it did 24 hours ago.

Curious why? 24 hours ago we already knew ROR would be under Avs control at around 5.75-6m for 2 years unless traded.

The only thing that has changed is that there is no QO/Negotiation next summer. Unless of course, ROR wants to go the NFL route and not report for the 2015 season until he has a long term deal in place that starts after the 2015-16 season, which is another "option" he will have as a player. Not his best option, but an option at this point I wouldn't rule out for a Newport client.

 

[tigervixxxen]

Curious why? 24 hours ago we already knew ROR would be under Avs control at around 5.75-6m for 2 years unless traded.

The only thing that has changed is that there is no QO/Negotiation next summer. Unless of course, ROR wants to go the NFL route and not report for the 2015 season until he has a long term deal in place that starts after the 2015-16 season, which is another "option" he will have as a player.

Don't think he'd do that, he needs that 7th year of service to become a UFA. He could have held out as a RFA but under contract I'm sure he's happy to play it out.

Anyway, to the question you asked, it's all in the attitude, the perception. The fact that they mutually agreed to a contract and shook hands is the difference. Glance around twitter, people are happy and relieved, even if it's naive and short sighted to feel that way. Even if the contract deal and the arbitration deal were the exact same (I know he chose the one year but hypothetically) it matters because of the message it sends. O'Reilly wants to be here, the Avs are happy, life is grand. Even IF that's not all true it's HUGE from a PR perspective. A team that's still trying to build their brand back up and maintain the "team on the rise" perception needs to manage PR very carefully. Would have been more pointed questions from the media, more potential distractions, more trade chatter, any leaked transcripts or reports from the hearing might surface. Fans would have been much more hostile towards him. Now it's a lot more like any of the other 20 arbitration cases that will eventually settle, it's not one big glaring team-player war it was trumped up as...at least in the perception sense. I'M not going to forget what went down in this 6 week long saga but from a fan perspective it's best to let it die down.

 

[Tweaky]

I just wanted to point out that the Avs actually gained some negotiating power in a trade situation over what they would have had if they went through arbitration. Hear me out. As it stands, they are able to talk to other teams about trading a guy that is signed for 2 years at a not unreasonable salary. A guy that signed said contract of his own free will. Had they gone to arbitration, they then only have a one year contract (for likely the same amount or a bit less), and a guy the other teams now know does not want to resign with the Avs, because of the arbitration. It has been said many times in this thread that any team that trades for him will have an idea of his salary demands and be willing to meet them. True. The difference comes in what the Avs might be able to get in return. If the other teams know that RoR does not want to sign with the Avs, they do not have to offer as much in trade to get him. Giving him this contract avoids that possibility.

Also, as far as $$, the $6m is likely what he would have gotten in arbitration, or slightly less, say $5.75m. If it had gone this way, next summer, if the Avs want to keep him, they have to QO him at the same amount. If he regresses, he takes the QO, or if his season is so bad they don't want to offer it, he walks as a UFA. If he continues to improve (or maintains and feels the arbitration amount is too low), and feels that the season proves his value is higher, he can refuse and either demand arbitration for another 1 year contract, or hold out.

One last thing. Why is it OK for the team to use hometown discount, RFA status and favorite team concepts to lower a players salary, but if a player tries to use what little leverage they have, like holdouts or arbitration, they are branded as greedy bastages. Or how about not comparing the salary a player that gave the favorite team discount to the perceived demands of a player that did not grow up idolizing that team? Just because Dutchy gave a discount does not mean that everyone else has to. If Dutchy is willing to play for less than his full value should not make other players that are not lifelong Avs fans pressured into doing the same.

 

[shadow1]

Not to be a Debbie Downer, but this isn't the greatest news in the world to me.

Avoiding arbitration will surely strengthen the relationship between the Avalanche/O'Reilly, but O'R is now set to hit UFA in two seasons. Scary thought.

 

[tigervixxxen]

A couple relevant things I hadn't seen posted here. I hate how the DP creates a story and then adds quotes piecemeal. I'm sure it's not limited to just them but you have to read the story 5 times to get everything. Anyway:

@adater: Ryan O'Reilly tells me: "I'm very happy with the deal, can't wait to get back to Colorado and get ready for the season"

The Avs were confident they'd "win" the case. But they also knew the attitude that would develop with agent Morris if that happened.

"I said to Joe, 'If you win, you also lose,' and that everybody would lose — the club, the player and the fans," Morris said. "Joe was very professional about it and very prepared, as was Greg Sherman. We both knew what our upside and our downside was, and it didn't take a rocket scientist to see the path to where the middle point was. It's always a positive when we create a free negotiation based on what we do as opposed to a third party."

 

[Mupster]

I think he was more than fine with how Newport was handling things but sure it's human nature when you look people in the eye and when literally the 11th hour dawns that people become motivated to find some sort of compromise. Even if the money ended up being basically the same it does say at least something that there ended up being some sort of human element at play in this situation.

Yeah. It's at least a little comforting that they were able to come to a compromise, and to imagine that ROR himself had something to do with it.

I'm just a conflicted fan that loves what he brings on the ice, but hates what seems to be his "money above all else" attitude off of it.

 

[RockLobster]

Good job getting those quotes out TV, because you're right, the DP does add them and update their initial article with new quotes as they get them.

From THAT quote from Morris, he makes himself (and by extension Newport) sound like willing negotiators...so that does give me a renewed sense of optimism that when the time comes O'Reilly can be re-signed to a longer-term deal, possibly in the 6.5-7M range seeing as how they will begin going into UFA years (and again, we all know that UFA years are worth more).

 

[AslanRH]

Morris sounds like a good salesman for sure. Telling Joe basically, If you win everyone loses. I'm sure some will say he meant if either side wins, but he knew his side was behind the 8 ball in a hearing and that 6m was likely the high a ruling would give him.

 

[54toscore]

I think pretty much everyone in this thread is overlooking one key factor--after we win the Cup next season (Daniel Briere with the GWG in Game 6 2OT), we'll become a hot destination for all sorts of UFAs and we'll be able to sign them below market value.

This is worth more than whatever middling NHL player, not-quite-top prospect, and futures we'd acquire in a trade for O'Reilly.

 

[RockLobster]

Morris sounds like a good salesman for sure. Telling Joe basically, If you win everyone loses. I'm sure some will say he meant if either side wins, but he knew his side was behind the 8 ball in a hearing and that 6m was likely the high a ruling would give him.

I'm not a Morris fan by any means, but I don't believe that he's exactly "wrong" when saying that if the Avs had "won" the arbitration that they still would have "lost" in a sense...that sense being that the relationship that Joe/Patrick had worked to rebuild w/ Ryan would be torn down again...that just seems to be how Arbitration works.

Morris had nothing but good/positive things to say (apparently) about Sakic, and Joe even said that there was no animosity between both sides and that any of the "perceived animosity" was being made by outside parties.

I'm not quite ready to give up on O'Reilly re-signing long term...not yet at least

 

[bohlmeister]

Morris sounds like an arrogant weasel in that quote to me. Basically pulls Joe Sakic of all people aside, to give him some free advice. Give in or we all lose. And the worst part of this, Morris is going to be an ******* during the next negotiation as well. A normal human being would see it as the Avs giving in a little, and the player giving a little next time. Not Mr Morris. He will be raking them over the coals again, as if this never happened.

 

[billybobjoe2112]

I think pretty much everyone in this thread is overlooking one key factor--after we win the Cup next season (Daniel Briere with the GWG in Game 6 2OT), we'll become a hot destination for all sorts of UFAs and we'll be able to sign them below market value.

This is worth more than whatever middling NHL player, not-quite-top prospect, and futures we'd acquire in a trade for O'Reilly.

Double OT in game 6 of the cup finals? I couldn't handle overtime in round 1. But bring it on.

 

[bohlmeister]

I'm not a Morris fan by any means, but I don't believe that he's exactly "wrong" when saying that if the Avs had "won" the arbitration that they still would have "lost" in a sense...that sense being that the relationship that Joe/Patrick had worked to rebuild w/ Ryan would be torn down again...that just seems to be how Arbitration works.

Morris had nothing but good/positive things to say (apparently) about Sakic, and Joe even said that there was no animosity between both sides and that any of the "perceived animosity" was being made by outside parties.

I'm not quite ready to give up on O'Reilly re-signing long term...not yet at least

Well if that "negotiation" was civil, I would hate to see it on bad terms. Oh look, no difference. They still demand the sun and the moon or won't talk.

 

[Klifton]

Inquiring Pens fan wants to know.

Now that you have ROR, and assuming you don't intend to trade him off right away, I would like to have your opinion of something. Does this make McGinn less important to you?

I suggested a Sutter for McGinn deal a while back and it seems this would be a good time to revisit that. What do you Avs fans think?

 

[5280]

Double OT in game 6 of the cup finals? I couldn't handle overtime in round 1. But bring it on.

Yeah, me neither.

 

[The Mars Volchenkov]

Now that you have ROR, and assuming you don't intend to trade him off right away, I would like to have your opinion of something. Does this make McGinn less important to you?

I suggested a Sutter for McGinn deal a while back and it seems this would be a good time to revisit that. What do you Avs fans think?

I'd rather keep McGinn at this point. He'll also likely be cheaper than whatever Sutter gets, and we're pretty tight up against the cap as is.

 

[RockLobster]

Well if that "negotiation" was civil, I would hate to see it on bad terms. Oh look, no difference. They still demand the sun and the moon or won't talk.

So you don't believe Sakic when he said that there was no animosity?

I give up...O'Reilly will forever be hated by a group of posters on this board, that's fine...but when he plays like we all know he can play there better be no more of the "Pay the man" bulls**t that was going on.

 

[Joe Sakic]

So did we for sure buy 1 UFA year?

I thought if it was a 1 year deal he was RFA still next offseason?

 

[RockLobster]

So did we for sure buy 1 UFA year?

I thought if it was a 1 year deal he was RFA still next offseason?

We bought 0 UFA years, he was two years away from UFA and he now has a 2 year contract.

 

[bohlmeister]

So you don't believe Sakic when he said that there was no animosity?

I give up...O'Reilly will forever be hated by a group of posters on this board, that's fine...but when he plays like we all know he can play there better be no more of the "Pay the man" bulls**t that was going on.

I do believe when such moments come up, I will be able to post anything within the site rules. And "Pay the man" will be included in that.

And no I don't believe Sakic. They took him to arbitration, they DID try to get a deal done and Morris wouldn't have any of it. Then Morris basically says that if they don't shape up this time, next time will be worse. Whatever.

 

[bohlmeister]

UFA years will cost 11 million O'Rubles. 1300 space bucks. Or 9 million US dollars.

 

[RockLobster]

I do believe when such moments come up, I will be able to post anything within the site rules. And "Pay the man" will be included in that.

And no I don't believe Sakic. They took him to arbitration, they DID try to get a deal done and Morris wouldn't have any of it. Then Morris basically says that if they don't shape up this time, next time will be worse. Whatever.

Obviously post what you'd like within the site rules, but you don't think it's going to come off as hypocritical?

And for clarification is it that you don't believe Sakic because it doesn't fit your new outlook on Ryan O'Reilly? I mean all we've heard about on this board since Joe and Patrick took over was that there was a lot more "transparency" than before, some things aren't talked about, but for the most part they've been upfront with fans...but when it doesn't "fit the mold" he's lying? Come on now, who's fooling who at that point?

 

[bohlmeister]

Obviously post what you'd like within the site rules, but you don't think it's going to come off as hypocritical?

And for clarification is it that you don't believe Sakic because it doesn't fit your new outlook on Ryan O'Reilly? I mean all we've heard about on this board since Joe and Patrick took over was that there was a lot more "transparency" than before, some things aren't talked about, but for the most part they've been upfront with fans...but when it doesn't "fit the mold" he's lying? Come on now, who's fooling who at that point?

Well I don't believe this is a line in the sand argument. That I either believe 100% of what Sakic says to the media, Or I believe 0%. In this instance, I think Sakic is saying the right things in hopes that it will be better next time (which it won't be). There was obviously animosity, otherwise he would wouldn't have made the comment about "Morris thinks they are negotiating off of a 1 year 6.5 million dollar deal, and forgetting about the first year." That was a shot at Morris. Who's fooling who?

And just to point out, the last ROR ordeal I was on ROR's side. I thought he was worth more than what the Avs were offering and that the Avs were being unrealistic. This time, screw him. It is going to be the same song and dance next time too.